Apech

I think there is a theme emerging here which says "that which is true is that which is useful and that which useful is that which can be understood." OR ... you make a thing useful or not by understanding its nature. OR ... stop thinking about things and limits of their uses and start thinking about possibilities. (I keep changing my mind) lol

Plenty gods in some forms of Taoism ... but none in yours.

Right. Tell me if you think I am on the right lines with this. When you do things its not for praise or self esteem, it is simply to do what has to be done. Not too much or too little because both of those would lead to error (? is that the right word). Er help me out here ... I do not have a functioning brain at the moment.

Functioning brain! There you go exaggerating again.

Maybe this one I don't know ... that's why I was asking you what the distinguishing features were. Maybe I'm just and old wet liberal at heart ... I've seen racism do a lot of damage in the world and I hate it with a vengeance. Ah well. PS. Just found this from Scientific American .... Just Google "Does Race Exist pdf" and you can get the article.

Well I don't agree - those distinguishing features are just adaptations to different climates and environments. If you want to believe in five root races that's up to you I guess. I don't. I've made my point so I suppose we'll just agree to disagree.

OK thanks for answering ... although you didn't answer my specific question. Before we knew much about the science of genetics it was easy and natural for people in the Victorian era say, to look round the world and say there's white people over here, black people over there and yellow people ... and produce a list of types of peoples on the basis that by identifying superficial characteristics of appearance such as skin colour, they were categorising groups of people into different types or races. But we also know that the Victorians were racist in that they assumed that those not like them were also not equal ... possibly less intelligent and so on. They were imperialists after all. But what genetics discovered was that the apparent differences between the supposed races were so little, superficial and actually quite vague because there are whole spectra of shades of skin colour and so on that it was not possible to define people by race in this way. The variations within each group far outweighed the differences between groups. Obviously this is different to cultural differences which do exist. So although for instance in giving a description of a man to the police ... 'he was white caucasian' ... this is purely descriptive of appearance and does not denote any other characteristics. If you, or anyone, believes that there are five, or whatever number of 'root races' - which is what I was being told - then for this to have any meaning they must believe that there are real differences between those races. If they do, then they should be able to list those differences beyond say colour of skin and shape of eyes. If they cannot what they are actually saying is that there is only one 'race' or species 'homo sapiens' with superficial variations within which gives no basis for racism or discrimination in the sense of making assumptions about someone beyond the level of saying for instance, their hair is blond, brown, red and so on.

Ok yep Buddhist sub it is.

A detail I know ... but what does this mean?

I haven't read this for a long time. I am trying absorb each section so slow is good for me.

I'll move it but I'd like Stan to agree since he started it as a matter of courtesy.

Anyone else noticed how bright Jupiter is in the night sky (in Europe and I assume the same in some parts of US?) ... its a stunning sight. Anyway I wonder what significance it has. It's something and its up!

You are right of course ... it could easily be about both meanings at once.

This bit seems to be saying that its not size itself that matters (thankfully ) but relative size. So everything needs to be understood in relation to something else. Its no good looking at a thing as just a thing ... you need to see it in relation to another thing or its environment. So relative subjective truth again. Yes/No ???????????

Whoah I seem to have precipitated an argument by asking what Peng and Ku meant. Thanks for the detail by the way. Funny that we should start by debating the meaning and interpretation of terms. What does it all mean? Maybe this question is actually what this is about. Is ZZ saying in a way ... I can give you fantastic stories about mythical entities of enormous size ... but what would that actually do for you? Humans need truth on a human scale. I'm not convinced that this is about inner alchemy - I think its about the subjectivity of truth.

If they are from Brazil it would be 'bruxo' (pronounced broo-show). Ok I know I'm a smartass .

**** Moderation Message **** Please read posts in blue above by me in conjunction with this message. We have five active reports in this thread alone and one from the previous thread. Not all the reports are from the two protagonists. We think this whole issue has detracted from the previous discussion and in effect hijacked the forum from legitimate topics. We think there is a degree to which this has been on the one hand a deliberate attack but also that the responses have not been helpful. We would like to think that people come on here to have genuine informed discussion and not to attack each other. In the end our decision is that Scotty is suspended from posting for 30 days. If he repeats his previous action of creating new accounts this is will result in a permanent ban - which will be enforced. **** Mod Message ends ****

We moderate the forum ... we don't muzzle people. You can report posts and we consider what action to take. But please do not try to dictate the result by asking fro people to be banned or whatever that is not your decision. I realize you feel unjustly attacked and presumable angry about this but I think it would have been better to answer the accusations calmly and factually as you have done below. Remember third party readers don't know anything about you or your teachings and so they need facts to repudiate any accusations. Thanks for the response. I think this is how you could have responded earlier. I don't agree with the last part. Scotty is responsible for what he says, no-one else. We don't do 24/7 moderation we just look at reports and decide on action. Sometimes this is a bit slow because we are located round the world in different time zones. See below for mod decision.

Sorry no. When you say you eventually ended up serving a 7 day suspension you forgot to mention that you spent several days spamming this forum with new accounts to post offensive messages. You were allowed back in because despite what some believe the moderation here is light and forgiving. At that time you were justly accused of provoking other users and it seems you may be doing the same now but remaining below the insult radar while doing. Your record of behavior is taken into account ... sorry but that's just how it is.

Thank you for replying. You are free to discuss teachers and products factually or from personal experience of course. The issue of lawsuits is just a fact and I don't think anyone has threatened you with this - just pointed out that if you make statements which impact on someone's business in this way there is a potential for legal action. Moderation action is always a possibility since this is a moderated forum. I don't see any personal vendetta here but I do wish for this thread to finish as it is unproductive and ill tempered - even if it does provide entertainment for some.

Well, no I don't because I don't know what the youtube links are until I watch them. I have a very slow connection and it takes an age to watch vids anyway ... so actually, for me, your message is lost quite often. I'm not suggesting you dumb down anything ... and I don't see your objection to concise messages clearly stated. After all we are on an internet forum ... that's how it is ... short messages of interchange between different posters. I am only raising this with you because I think many people have formed the opinion that you are a) fundamentalist Christian and b ) a troll. Maybe this is partly due to the way you present information. Of course it could be proven if the archeological evidence emerged. Look at Gobekli Tepe ... that's turned the traditional dating for stone working on its head ... if there were more finds of this kind then the theories would have to be drastically revised. Until then a better theory could produce a model for human dispersion which fits all the facts based on a pre-ice age civilization .. why not?

First off , I like the way Marblehead is setting about this. One section at a time with a chance to discuss. Thanks to him for taking the time and care to do this. Anyone know if Kun and P'eng have any literal meanings in Chinese? I have a feeling that ZZ is talking about myth and abstract concepts ... big ideas if you like and what you get from them and what you don't get from them. I heard an astrophysicist on the radio saying yesterday that the numbers they deal with are so incredibly huge that they are completely meaningless to most humans. I need to read the original again I think ... ths was off the top of my head (not a very big head).

Scotty, Just help me on this. When you said: Were you calling 5ET a liar and cheat ... or not?

**** Moderator Message ***** We have had a number of reports (from both 'sides') relating to the current issue between Scotty and 5ET. TTBs does not support any particular school of practice and is an open forum for discussion of spiritual matters including different systems and lineages. It does not also necessarily support or hold the views of expressed by individuals on here. Normal etiquette between genuine practitioners is to respect other people's system even if not agreeing with it. It is ok of course to point out where one might think weaknesses exist in the other persons approach. However it is not helpful to get into personalized disputes and/or to deliberately attack another poster on here or to troll threads for this purpose. The moderation team is discussing action and such action if and when it is taken will be geared to ensuring that TTBs is what it should be, that is a open forum where people are free to express their views without being attacked or goaded into action (including leaving the forum). In other words to protect the reputation of TTBs as a good place to come for information and debate. Anyone who thinks this place is for perpetuating disputes will probably face a long suspension - which will be strictly enforced. Apech for Mod Team **** Mod Message Ends ****