doc benway

Are you willing to elaborate on your direct intimate contact of deep knowledge goldisheavy? I'm genuinely interested.

I once had the direct experience of knowing that I am unborn and undying. The intensity has waned but the absolute certainty remains... And I have been conceived of a mother and father and am sitting here typing this note.

I think Argentina has more than Messi but I don't think it's enough to beat the Germans. I will miss it when its over... Nothing else really worth looking at on the telly.

I learned the other way around. I started with zhan zhuang and learning the slow form together. Later came zuo wang and later yet came the jin training. I think there are different ways to approach it.

The more I think about this the more I appreciate the opportunity this thread has given me. Here I am, criticizing a member while at the same time I'm appealing for civility in the Buddhist forum. What's up with that? ChiDragon - please accept my apology for being overly critical and aggressive. Goldisheavy - thanks for helping me to see myself a little more clearly. Great stuff for me - sorry it had to be at ChiDragon's expense. I love you all! _/\_

You are both correct. The reason I questioned ChiDragon's authority and credibility is because he has provided so much misleading information on so many occasions over the years regarding topics involving Taijiquan and Daoist cultivation. It is not that important to me that information necessarily come from a teacher or a lineage or a big name, but if there is a long history of misinformation from a particular source, I tend to be skeptical (and perhaps overly critical). On the other hand, this moment is new and fresh and who knows what is possible. And you are correct goldisheavy, we are each responsible for what we accept and reject. It's not my job to make sure people present accurate or sensible information here, although I tend to act as if it is sometimes. I can be an ass and it's good time be reminded of that periodically. Peace y'all

My intention was never to validate the thread's contents before they were finished. When you present a definition with absolute authority, I think it's reasonable to question your resource. If you stated that the definitions were YOUR personal understanding through your study, then I would feel no need to question you and I would understand that your conclusions were YOUR opinion through your personal study (with or without a master). If you state that the definitions are THE Chinese Taoist definitions, then I cannot accept that unless you can show evidence that you have the authority to speak for all schools and practitioners. I hope you can see the difference here.

If you haven't done this yet, it might be a worthwhile investment of some time to look into the measured rotational axes of Earth, our solar system, our galaxy, and local reference points. Getting a sense of the direction you are facing relative to how we are positioned and moving relative to planet, solar system, galaxy, etc.. might be useful. You may find that you can feel it already, although I still feel it's helpful to check how what you feel compares to measured parameters.

If you are serious, do anything you can to find a credible teacher. If books are the only option, Nei Yeh is a great resource although quite cryptic (as are all alchemy writings - hence the need for a master). I also think that Bruce Frantzis' two books on Daoist meditation are two of the most practical and accessible books for someone who has no access to direct instruction. My training was in a very different method but I read through Bruce's books and incorporated his methods into my practice for a while and it is VERY powerful stuff. Personally, I don't like Dr. Yang's book very much for practical use. Lots of interesting translations but better as a reference than a guide, IMO.

Very cool stuff! Do you do any work connecting with Earth's core, rotational vectors or inertia, or larger scale awareness (solar system rotation, galactic vectors, and so forth)?

This is exactly why I am asking for information regarding your Daoist training and affiliation. You have asked us to accept your definitions without question. I am asking for some evidence of your credibility.

Your post has the suggestion of absolute certainty and authority. Can you tell us something about the Daoist sect and master(s) you have studied with? Is this "Chinese Taoist definition" accepted by all schools and practitioners?

Very nicely put! 心

Such a blessing when the teachings reach our mind/heart as opposed to being stuck in the brain. _/\_

Another wonderful post! I think that nothing is as effective at developing ting jin as zhan zhuang. I've never studied yi quan beyond a seminar or two but I've always been fascinated with it and zhan zhuang has also played a very fundamental role in my training. What sort of dog do you have? Sounds big! I'm a dog lover. I used to live with an English bulldog and because of their physique, they are incapable of cleaning their nether regions... hence I used to wipe worse things than water and saliva! But I loved her dearly and it was never a bother. No better advice has ever been given, IMO.... _/\_

Don't rule it out!

Great post and great question! I will meditate on this as well. Generating gratitude is a part of my daily practice. It is fundamental in taking refuge. My initial response is - While it may or may not make sense to be thankful "for my Self" or "for something that I am and that I do," it may make sense to be thankful for the recognition of that nature of Self. In ignorance, we experience a great deal of confusion and suffering. In awareness, we experience some degree of liberation from suffering. That awareness which leads to liberation is a blessing. It has no predictable or reproducible cause, therefore, it's unexpected and greatly welcomed appearance is the genesis of gratitude.

Thanks for the helpful comments Daeluin... There's a lot of history here and I would also be happy to discuss further with you privately to avoid any further conflict. I would do better to be more circumspect and less concerned with pointing out errors and inconsistencies in others' posts. _/\_

Hence the emphasis on mindfulness in Buddhism, it is the mundane key that many of us take for granted.

I appreciate your comments and efforts to help me understand. While the thig le nyag gcig is certainly not a thing consisting of parts, it does represent an underlying nature and a wholeness, or completeness, e.g. Complete Perfection, no? And while this may not imply a big, happy One-ness that includes everything and everyone a la Brahman, there is some sort of sense of completeness, a single taste, isn't there? Nothing is excluded. And I don't mean to imply the universality of such nature, but I also don't mean to exclude it. That shared nature is empty of any characteristics, 'like' the sky, and even empty of itself and yet that emptiness is not an absence because it is the nature of all the various manifestations. Hence the importance of understanding the fault of the four extremes. We certainly need to guard against the extreme of eternalism. Similarly, we need to guard against nihilism. Some of the earlier comments in this thread border nihilism, IMO. Anyway, sorry to ramble. I'm not very good with the words and I appreciate the constructive criticism and information. I spend much more time practicing than studying, for better or worse...

Deci is often spot on... I miss her, eccentricity and all.

Sorry I'm not a better teacher. Peace

This post is very cogent for me right now. I spent over a decade practicing taijiquan as a martial art. I was happy to benefit from the other qualities but didn't really think or care about it much. My meditative practice took me to some places that have changed me. My values and priorities have changed. I have very little interest any longer in martial training. I find that cultivating love, compassion, and relationships is something that will be of more consequence to me at this point in my life and moving forward. I still practice form and circle walking, but now there is no martial intent. Oh it pops up constantly, applications jump into my mind as I do the movement, but I'm slowly trying to let that go - just for me, not because I think it is 'right' or 'better' for anyone else. I do think that having a solid understanding of the martial aspect makes the internal martial arts even more effective for healthy, well being, spiritual, and energetic development. This is because understanding and respecting the martial principles generally insures more anatomically and physiologically efficient posture, movement, and breathing. That said, if one learns these principles, I think the martial component can be abandoned for those that have no taste for that aspect.

As requested by the Dragon of Chi - Discussion of neigong throughout this thread: Sorry if I missed any and I hope no one minds that I took the liberty of editing posts for brevity...

I practice Chen Pan Ling's 99 Forms, as he called it. Fantastic form and like you say, it is full of martial applications. The possibilities are only limited by our imagination. There is bagua and xingyi mixed in. Great story about Master Chang. My guess is that Master Chang used heng quan on you (if it was xingyi) or lone phoenix at dawn (if bagua). Both good moves to get behind an opponent. The beautiful thing about Chen Pan Ling's method was how he created a systematic approach to the training. My teacher learned from another of his senior students, Chen Jin Pao.