doc benway

They’re slowly creeping up on it… Beautiful to watch it unfold, both hlundrub and kadag and the brilliant minds trying to define them. Both equally vibrant and genuine.

For sure, yes. Like Camellia, I think anything can become a meditation or a spiritual path even negative things. There is a nice book I read a long time ago called Creativity and Taoism by Chan Chung Yuan. Warm welcome!

Good ole’ DaoBums synchronicity! I’ve been reading, and came to post about: Quantum cognition - quantum models for cognition and decision making. It’s becoming a very predictive approach of course. Popular - https://www.livescience.com/quantum-like-model-of-decision-making-proposed.html Technical - https://jbusemey.pages.iu.edu/quantum/TICS.pdf

@kakapo You may participate here or not, it’s up to you and your group at the moment. I have confirmed with the moderators and admin that discussion of Mo Pai and unauthorized spin-offs is not permitted here. This decision is made out of respect for the authentic Mo Pai lineage as well as the health of our community and members. We appreciation everyone’s compliance. Thread closed

@awaken What is truly incredible is how much of your time and life force is spent here judging and criticizing others and their practices. This post is disrespectful. Please edit it It has been hidden and edit your attitude or take a sabbatical to work on your book. Thank you, The management

Yes, there was a time when I did quite a bit of reading and studying in a variety of traditions. Now it’s mainly practice and living life for me. I do still read teachings given by trusted masters in my tradition. No question our intellect is a very powerful tool. On the other hand it tends to think it is the end all and be all and that is an error in experiential practices.

Especially when seated!

Happy Guru Rinpoche Day everybody! "Like space, mind is spontaneously present from the beginning. Like the sun, it is free from any basis for the darkness of ignorance. Like a lotus flower, it is untainted by faults. Like gold, it doesn't alter its own nature. Like the ocean, it is unmoving. Like a river, it is unceasing." ~ Guru Rinpoche, from the book Advice From the Lotus-Born: A Collection of Padmasambhava’s Advice To The Dakini Yeshe Tsogyal And Other Close Disciples

My sincere recommendation as a mod and a practitioner is that you look at yourself first. If you change, the world around you changes, no other way. What is it about your mode of communication, and the contents, that results in conflict and denied access? As a practitioner, I look at the situation, from the center, what is my own experience, my responsibility and opportunity? Everything I project on others is never anything other than my own experience. There are said to be 3 levels of practitioner - 1st level accepts all responsibility for their situation. end of story. 2nd level accepts partial responsibility, blaming others and circumstances to varying degrees. 3rd level practitioners accept none genuinely, only insincerely, and see their problems as primarily caused by the outside world… lowest level practitioner. As a mod I try to deal fairly based on how members treat each other through words and action, with no as little as possible concern for the tradition being represented, or lack thereof. As a human being, I feel that Mo Pai is a danger in the West, particularly to the inexperienced. It is an undeniable dead-end. The highest knowledge of Mo Pai in the West is rudimentary and unreliable. I would not recommend anyone practice it and I don’t want people to come here if that’s what they’re looking for. You can set up your own site for that. Maybe reddit? 😉 The lineage in the West is broken and it is a very lineage dependent transmission. So you’re welcome to post whatever suits you if you’re following the rules and I’ll moderate as fairly as I can. Thanks for checking in κάλτσες

I have spent quite a bit of time with single leg stances, mostly in the context of bagua training but also martial qigong and taijiquan. I can relate to the power generation you describe. When actually sky-gazing there is no need for visualization, just look. But yes, a bit like it for sure. I bring the elements into kata practice with and without weapons. Great way to explore different possibilities. Very powerful and beautiful medicine that us city dwellers have lost touch with. This is one of the things that attracts me so much to Bön.

It does. I don't think or speak too much about absorbing energy as these can be very imprecise, even ambiguous terms often defined differently by different people. In a practical sense, having a solid connection to earth serves a very important grounding function. Some experiences in practice can have a destabilizing effect - disturbing emotions can come up, a sense of depersonalization or disembodiment can arise, strange physical sensations, frightening ideas, hallucinations, visitations, delusions of grandeur, all sorts of things. When faced with such experiences, having a solid connection to earth is very supportive. Earth and Heaven balance one another and finding that balance in our lives is a source of stability and health. Being too focused on one or the other can be problematic.

On the sutric path, Bön speaks of the ten non-virtuous actions to avoid and ten virtuous actions to pursue. They are basically the same as in Buddhism. Ten non-virtuous actions: Three of the body: - taking a life - stealing - sexual misconduct Four of the speech: - telling lies - deliberately causing problems between friends - harsh language - gossip Three of the mind: - negative thoughts - harmful thoughts towards others - wrong views toward the teachings The ten virtuous actions are basically the opposite of these. - avoid taking another’s life - practice generosity - practice moral discipline - speak the truth and avoid lies - try to bring friends together - speak peacefully and calmly - engage in practice rather than gossip - be mindful - avoid evil thoughts toward others - be free from wrong views about the teachings

The dzogchen approach is unique in that there is a single precept - remain connected to the mind's nature which is clear and open. That's it. Most, if not all, practitioners of dzogchen are exposed to the moral precepts of Bön or Buddhism at some point in their training but when established in the practice of dzogchen, those precepts are not the foundation of our behavior, the natural state alone is. And there are, unfortunately, people who use this approach as an excuse to engage in inappropriate, unhealthy, even abusive behavior claiming, maybe even genuinely believing, that as long as they are connected to the natural states (or what they think is the natural state) even such inappropriate behavior is acceptable but this is a critical error. I think this is one important reason why the dzogchen teachings remained highly secret for most of history. The practice can be very easily misunderstood and such misunderstanding can result in serious karmic consequences for oneself and others. There is a saying that while the dzogchen view should be as expansive as the sky, the behavior should be as fine as barley flour.

Welcome to the DaoBums, Don't work too hard!

In some teachings it’s said that Buddha taught 84,000 methods because there are so many unique needs of sentient beings [based on their karma]. I take from this that there is no one path that works for everyone. We need to stay open to what we are able to connect with, be honest with ourselves and be prepared for change.

Yes, as Maddie said karma affects everything. Your ability to respond well to a teaching through physical, intellectual, emotional, and spiritual interaction depends on your karma - your conditions, your predilections and preferences, your attributes, geography, language… every factor you can imagine. All of that is an expression of karma.

@awaken Thank you for the clarification, I understand your point. Regarding the breathing technique I will extrapolate your meaning there as well.

Thank you for sharing, I can feel your connection to the earth. Do you ever play with your awareness of and connection to gravity? This can be very interesting and a huge support for things like kicks and one-legged qigong and neijia stances. Connecting to sky and heaven can be as simple as standing upright and turning your attention upward, opening the crown of your head to feel the endless open expanse above. Reach upward and outward with attention and openness, and rest in the connection. A simple prayer asking for a connection to the heavens, to unbounded space, may be supportive. Like gardening connects you to earth, deepen your relationship with the clear open sky. Try sky gazing. Sit quietly and rest the gaze and full attention on the open sky. Great to do this at altitude, if possible, with the sun at your back. Continually bring your mind to rest with the openness of the sky, notice and reconnect whenever you get disconnected. Feel the openness, the spaciousness in your heart/mind and throughout the body. Become the sky. Any distractions that arise simply liberate into the expanse if you leave them be as they are without pushing away or engaging. As your connection to the sky gets comfortable, combine the feeling of resting the body fully and deeply in the earth with resting the mind fully open through the crown to the sky as you stand upright. Become aware of you, the spaciousness in the center of your heart that is clear and alert, the center of your being, this experience of being human, connecting heaven and earth. Rest there as long as it remains fresh. Breath naturally. You could also practice this sitting but there is a special aspect to standing. You can add postures and movement, bringing this connection to Heaven and Earth to every aspect of life. Something I play with often, fwiw. Good luck in your practice. 🙏🏼

Wait, you’ve got it all wrong. True transfer method:

That would not help me because I am trying to understand you, not someone else. But if you do not wish to be more clear that is fine. Thanks

Would you please share your description of the technique of breathing in the transfer method? It would perhaps help to make sure we are on the same page. I agree with your point that Buddha did not teach breathing technique but attention technique using breath as the object.

This has run it’s course and is heading for rapids Let’s move on my friends

fwiw It looks like the Original Dao forum will be shutting down soon. https://www.originaldao.com/viewtopic.php?t=1888 I rarely visited but fondly miss many of its members. There was a lot of emotional reactivity and pain when things fell apart. I wonder if any of our exes would want to return and how people here feel about it? It will be interesting to see how it plays out. I would love to see old friends back and would welcome most with very few exceptions. PS - to be clear, I speak as a member only and don't mean to imply any official TDB stance...

Inner mastery Good thing I don’t depend on beating my own heart

Agreed