doc benway

No one here is saying that Buddhists, Hindus, Daoists, their methods, or associated results are the same from what I've read. They are pointing to something more subtle, more pure and pervasive. The point being made has nothing to do with imagination, thought, method, or result, and yet all of these things are subsumed within what is being described. The excerpt from the Katha Upanishad in the OP espouses the non-dual nature of Self. If Self is of a non-dual nature, can there be more than one Self? If Self encompasses all by its very nature, is it separate from Daoists, Buddhists, Hindus and their various rituals, methods, and realizations? Some here are speaking from a perspective of genuine non-dual realization, the perspective to which the OP is directing the reader. When one has a taste of this perspective, that flavor can be discerned in all of the teachings of all of the wisdom traditions. You need to have some familiarity with the taste of a green mango to recognize it in a soup, a stew, or a cake. Indeed deep thinking can no more approach what the verses in the OP are pointing to than shallow, although one could perhaps say that if thinking is shallow enough, meaning absent, there may be a glimpse... 23. The Self cannot be known through studyOf the scriptures, nor through the intellect,Nor through hearing learned discourses.The Self can be attained only by thoseWhom the Self chooses. Verily unto themDoes the Self reveal himself. PS - I love the synchronicity of dwai and I posting the same message at the same time...

I feel like it would be nice to have a thread where all the MoPai derailings can go to die, or live forever as the case may be.

Looking forward to it. There is also other material - Samten Karmay’s The Arrow and the Spindle Chogyal Namkhai Norbu’s wonderful 3 volume series The Light of Kailash: A History of Zhang Zhung and Tibet. Bø and Bön is the most closely related study to what I think you are after, however.

For me this line of discussion is a very important one. How can we trust words written hundreds or thousands of years ago? How to know who actually wrote them and how accurately they've been documented and passed along; especially when they've been translated from foreign languages, perhaps through multiple iterations? It doesn't matter if it is Jesus, Buddha, Moses, or Laozi. How to even know for certain that the individual ever existed? For me this is the importance of transmission. When you come into direct, personal contact with a lineage representative and feel their love, observe their behavior, and recognize the fruition of the tradition in their body, speech, and mind, then you know. You see and feel the teaching. You practice and experience it yourself. Then you realize the meaning in the words and know the truth they represent. At this level the truth that is the core of all of the different wisdom traditions shines and is undeniable.

We also have a sub forum dedicated to this wonderful teaching here for anyone interested: https://www.thedaobums.com/forum/256-neiye/

Another book you may want to check out - A Step Away From Paradise by Thomas Shor. A story of a 20th century terton and his search for a beyul.

Another misconception is that a still mind is a mind without thought. Not true at all. A more accurate description is a mind that is free of thoughts. Thoughts are not absent but the still mind remains undisturbed as thoughts come and go. There are periods of thoughtlessness but they are interspersed with thought that can’t take root, like paint thrown into the air.

@Nungali Are you familiar with the book Bø and Bön by Dmitry Ermakov? Very well researched and documented. The Bönpos I have studied with acknowledge the type of connections you describe though it is not an area I know much about. https://www.boandbon.com/

One way I look at it is that visions are not purely subjective because they depend on causes and conditions.

James Webb telescope, very excited to see what it has to show us!

I didn't do anything but you are most welcome. Glad they turned up!

@Earl Grey The problem with @Cleansox PPD was that during some maintenance, elements of his PPD were accidentally dragged/dropped into a different PPD. At least I think that is what I believe happened. If there are specific threads or posts you are looking for please let me know what is missing either here or in a PM and I'll try to find them. You could also look through other PPDs, especially those close to yours alphabetically to see if something shows up.

making

Stretch

Wild Country is a compelling documentary about Osho’s community in Oregon. Really eye-opening. Like the time his followers poisoned a salad bar with E.coli as a trial run for larger scale bio-weapon attacks to gain political power in the region. It’s available on Netflix.

I appreciate this post. While I can’t say I have a specific objective in mind at the moment, I am inspired to face the day with a renewed sense of openness and possibility. Warm regards!

@silent thunder Yes, it is done. Enjoy!

Nothing in the West related to Mo Pai is legit. The lineage holder has made it clear it is not open - it is a dead end for Westerners. Those teaching the first two levels of a 72 level system in the West have never been authorized to teach and no one in the West has been trained in anything beyond the first 2 or 3 levels. By definition this makes western Mo Pai illegitimate, IMO. In what other system would it be advisable to follow the teachings of someone who had received less than 5% of a system's teachings and practices as if they were a lineage holder or master? It's like learning a single stance from the Wing Chun kung fu system and expecting to magically extrapolate and master the rest of the art without any guidance or information about any other technique from the system on one's own. If that's your idea of sounding good, go for it!

waxy

May the year of the Water Tiger bring you good fortune, good health, and the power to overcome all obstacles to your spiritual growth!

I did not mean to imply that humanity is the center of Existence. I do think that humans are as good a vehicle for self-awareness as any with which I am familiar. I don’t rule out the possibility that more suitable vessels exist.

One “purpose” for the existence of humanity, and all other sentient beings, is to serve as the vehicle, or aperture, through which the universe is self-aware. This is a frequently cited aspect of non-dual realization. We are the “eyes of the world” as I believe Longchenpa, a dzogchen master, put it. Not at all a trivial responsibility and opportunity.

There is a Tibetan saying from the non-dual teachings, ‘the view should be as vast as the sky and the conduct as fine as barley flour.’ The thing about non-duality is that it does not entail cultivation. It is not possible to cultivate non-duality, only to optimize conditions for it to blossom. Resting in the natural state is comparable to wu wei. There is no interference with the spontaneous manifestation from the source. Whatever is needed in any given moment is already there. On the other hand, if we are honest with ourselves we find that we are very often distracted/disconnected from the fundamental essence and in these circumstances it is very beneficial to practice virtuous conduct. When the non-dual teachings refer to conduct it is often described “flexible” rather than virtuous. This refers to non-interference, wu wei. The advice is to continuously be present and undistracted. Consequently there are no expectations and no patterned or anticipated responses. The flexibility reflects spontaneity and non-interference.