steve

Buddhism is so complicated because the human mind is complicated. 

There are many different ways in which people are deluded and misguided and it tries to help in ways that all people can access.

As others have said, it is as complicated as we make it as individual practitioners, based on our karma.

Nothing is simpler than resting in the nature of mind, but that approach simply doesn't work for everyone.

Many have to create, explore, and ultimately release all sorts of structures and processes in their mind before they are ready to realize what is always already right here and now. 

18 hours ago, Cobie said:

.

Unfortunately, I didn’t get to see what you wrote but I did get notification that you mentioned me. I’m quite sure it was loving and warm!

😄

48 minutes ago, Cobie said:

I have said all I can say. 
 

 

Thank you 

Just now, Cobie said:

 

 

 

It really does not exclude anything. It’s about knowing what’s on the inside and what’s on the outside. 
 

 

As you describe it, it excludes everything on the inside, and that which can’t be apprehended by the 5 senses on the outside, or am I misinterpreting your words?

3 hours ago, Cobie said:

 

 

I ‘see’ etc. as clear as in reality. I have always had them. It was difficult for me to learn what’s inside and what’s outside. Had problems. I was told I was hallucinating. I learned hallucinating means to walk in the mind. Problem solved. Enjoying my internal senses now.

 

 

I also have  feelings and thoughts.  They too are inside, in my internal world. So not real. Real by definition refers to the physical world that’s observed through the 5 senses.

 

 

And yet that reality ignores such a large part of our lived experience. Reality testing is an important part of mental health. So is acknowledging the reality of our internal life and its impact on the external, for us and those around us.

 By that definition, space is not real and yet it is what allows all things to have their place. Similarly, consciousness is not real so how do all these wonderful senses manifest? What about feelings, are they real? Or solutions to mathematical problems before they’re written down ? I don’t feel limited to a materialistic definition of reality. It misses so much of my life experience.

Both - all are mental processes, and could be reasonably labeled as thought, and yet each is a specialized subset. In my paradigm they are real, that is they are an integral part of reality for me.

For me there is nothing better than standing directly on the Earth with bare feet. I particularly like to be near large trees or rocks. I don’t imagine or think about anything at all related to energy, grounding, channels, or anything else. No music or podcasts. I just open all of my senses and remain present, perhaps offer my gratitude to the Earth, birds, trees, and so on, for sharing the moment with me. Whenever I find the mind off on a trip or disconnected, I just guide it back to the experience of this very moment. The feel of the ground, the feel of gravity, the openness of the sky, allowing the fullness and completeness of the experience of this very moment.  If the legs or feet get sore or tired, sit or lie flat on your back. I also love walking, same approach and similar benefits, although I don’t recommend walking barefoot unless you’re used to it.

42 minutes ago, Forestgreen said:

Sounds like every school of qigong, meditation or martial arts I have ever trained in.

It’s an interesting phenomenon. While there are clearly some teachers/figureheads who actively create a cult following, there also seems to be a collective tendency for students/followers to create a cult atmosphere even in the absence of a predatory leader.

42 minutes ago, liminal_luke said:

By "restorations" I suspect old3bob has physical objects in mind.  I´m neither handy nor crafty and don´t have much to share in that department, but I wonder -- do posts count?  I´m really into post restoration (otherwise known as editing).  There have been times when I´ve edited a post twenty times before I finally let it be.  It´s kind of a ridiculous hobby.

When it comes to posting, I frequently choose to restore the space. I write long posts, revise them a few times, then think better of it and simply delete. Nothing beats the openness and unlimited potential of the empty space of my unposted posts.

😄

2 hours ago, old3bob said:

 

Well that saying is along the lines of not getting caught up in or being reactive too evil which I'd say works to a point,  but the point can also come when being a pacifist, "turning the other cheek",  ignoring,  or acting above it all during developing and dire situations no longer works.   (or is applicable)

 

 

 

I get that.

I'm asking what do you differently when you reach that point or are pushed beyond?

4 hours ago, old3bob said:

 

evil in multiple forms is attacking the earth and its decent people in every way possible...  "Resist not evil" only works so far, so then where is your cutoff point? 

 

What do you mean by cutoff point?

What is different before vs after that point?

Loved Sea Hunt!

Made me become a diver.

I find martial arts training to be a wonderful way to cultivate self-discipline. Running and weightlifting are also good but nothing beats martial arts for me.

On 8/19/2025 at 8:15 AM, RobB said:

Anyway, squats. The answer is more squats. 

Love for the squats!

Staying connected and sensitive while protecting one's energy is possible when you recognize that energy needs to flow, needs to move through us, not get stuck in or held by us. The one who feels like they are trying to protect something is more of a problem than solution. Of course it is important to maintain mental, physical, and emotional health which are the foundation of our energetic potential but it's no accident that so many energetic practices are focused on clearing obstacles. If we want to optimize our power it does not lie in hoarding and trying to wield a finite amount but in opening and being responsive to the full flow of it. This is the principle of Wu Wei in a nutshell.

1 hour ago, liminal_luke said:

 

Some people change their gender; others get really creative with copper wire. Different strokes.

Or one might say different pokes…

58 minutes ago, BigSkyDiamond said:

Given that form is not real

Do you contend that nothing is real?

Some wonderful suggestions here.

Contrary to a recent thread bemoaning the fall and end of DaoBums, I see a small but vibrant, engaged, and wise group of practitioners here that still have a lot to offer if one is ready to learn in so many different areas.

A few things I'd like to add from my own practice. No matter how much we try to protect ourselves (energetically, mentally, even physically), we will inevitably bump up against people and situations that drain and threaten us. Even if we avoid them we will still have to face our own isolated selves, the greatest challenge!  I think it's important to look not only at how to protect ourselves and our energy but how to do so in increasingly challenging circumstances so that we can engage as fully as possible in our lives and in the world and use our practices to grow and help others.

The first step is to find the right practices that give us that sense of needed protection. Each of us has to be sensitive to our needs and find the right approach and I increasingly value the need for them to be comprehensive. The second step is to put in the time to master those practices, mastery simply meaning that they genuinely work for us, we can see tangible benefits. The next step is to gradually begin to challenge ourselves, face those people and situations we prefer to avoid, little by little, using our practices both in real time and on the cushion, before and after the fact, exercising them like our physical muscles. At some point I think it's critical to bring this approach to those closest and yet farthest from us - estranged family members and the like. It's very important at this stage to be able to observe ourselves objectively, noticing reactivity as it arises without getting too wrapped up in the analysis or explanations, staying very close to the feelings, the direct experience. Then engaging in our practices with those feelings being very fresh and alive.

Fire is a good metaphor for developing this type of strength in our practices. At first we are like a small flame, a match, that needs to be protected from even a light breeze, and this stage can't be rushed or forced, we need to protect until our flame can withstand some pressure. As our flame grows, we can protect it less and it will stay lit as long as the wind is not too strong. At this stage we can get discouraged because progress can be slow. It can feel like one step forward, two steps back at time. Here it is so important to feel trust in our approach, that's what can carry us through. Eventually our flame can be so strong that even a gale just feeds it and makes it stronger, like a bonfire. This is the pinnacle of spiritual practice, IMO. Not that we find some sort of fairyland where nothing ever bothers us at all, rather that we feel what we feel, good and bad, and know how to make the most of every situation.

So I think it's important to protect our energy when it needs protection but to maintain the mindset and intention that we will eventually not need much protection. In fact, we may discover that at some point we can be the protector for those who are more vulnerable. This can take the form of teaching or simply being that calm, compassionate, empathetic, even wrathful force when engaging with others. 

8 hours ago, Cobie said:

Cry emoji. What's up with that? Please don't confuse the little children

I was simply offering Apech a little friendly kanchō

In reality, I don't know that much about the provenance or detailed history of Bön vajrayana practices. The Bön pantheon of deities and icons are different that those of Buddhism, some dating back to the early shamanistic origins of Bön that predated the subsequent intermixing with Indian Buddhism in Tibet. Bön and Buddhism have cross-pollinated quite a bit in Tibet with each tradition having its own ideas about how all of that transpired. I'm not too concerned with all of that, just grateful that I found my way to the practices and that they've done so much for me. 

2 minutes ago, Apech said:

I practice Vajrayana and it is 100% Buddhist.

 

I practice Vajrayana and it is 100% Bön.

6 minutes ago, Taomeow said:

 

Soft but not hollow.

Steel needle in silk cocoon.  

Diligent practice.

Diligent practice 

The way to Carnegie Hall

South from Central Park

On 8/12/2025 at 9:07 PM, Lotus of the abyss said:

I always had a question about, that if there's no self in Buddhism, then who realizes its absence? Like who learns about Buddhism? Who does anything?

 

I just don't understand how something that is not there, then who is learning about its absence?

 

 

Some great responses here.

11 hours ago, Cobie said:

To me that’s like being inside my own mind. 

In a way, we are always inside our own minds.

11 hours ago, Cobie said:

Teaching that thoughts are not real. 

I interpret it a bit differently.

I guess it depends on how we define real.

The experiences in the dark are extraordinarily vivid and compelling - sounds, visions, emotional reactivity, and yet there is nothing there but my own mind. Similar to dreaming. In the dream, there is no question about its reality, unless of course we are lucidly dreaming. For me it is more about the relationship between daily life experience and the mind. 

21 hours ago, Taomeow said:

 

I believe it's chasing, in a dark room, a black cat who isn't there.    

One of the practices in dzogchen is spending time in a completely dark room, dark retreat. Visions develop and the practice is to stay in the nature of mind, recognizing that all appearances are generated by the mind. I wonder if anyone has had a vision of a black cat in the dark retreat. If you chase it, you fail!

🤣

21 hours ago, Taomeow said:

 

 

As some may (or more likely may not) remember, I came to taoism from dzogchen, many moons ago, and the way I was taught dzogchen meditation, you had your eyes open, looking past the tip of your nose at nothing in particular but placing your awareness in your eyes.  I don't know if there's other ways (would have to ask Steve since I didn't take it far with that practice, it was still an experimental stage for me).  But even with my eyes open I would occasionally just feel sleepy and, realizing it, proceed straight to bed.  I asked my teacher then what I was doing wrong.  His response: "Nothing.  You must be chronically underslept."  Which I was at the time.  So he goes, "Then you're doing it right.  A sign of meditation done right is, it gives you what you need.  Not what you want.  What you need."  I made a note of it...       

 

I remember that because our trajectories were opposite, I got my foundation in Daoist meditation.

Yes, dzogchen practice is done with open eyes. Open but not resting or focused on anything in particular, meditation without an object. Bear in mind that it is traditionally preceded by a practice called zhinè, meditation with an object. One spends weeks or months staring at the Tibetan letter A, until the mind has stabilized and a distinction can be clearly made between its content and its nature. So when the transition moves from practice with an object to practice without, one is already accustomed to practicing with the eyes open. 

I didn’t get the zhinè instruction until I’d already been practicing without an object for about a year due to the timing of when I met my teacher. It was a definite obstacle for a while to practice with eyes open but then the zhinè came more easily.