steve

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Posts posted by steve

  1. Posted

    8 hours ago, old3bob said:

     

    "...We remain human..." By Steve,  I wasn't sure of your import there (?) but 'if' we remain human then we have not yet realized that being identified as a particular human/mind is only an apparent and passing identity.  

     

     

    I agree, it is an apparent and passing identity.

    Nevertheless, it is how we experience life from birth to death, defined by this human form and sensory apparatus.

    It is what we have to practice and realize with.

    Realization does not mean that our human form vanishes, at least that is my experience.

    It persists until death or rainbow body (in the dzogchen tradition).

    Consequently, it is important for me to be aware that I am not the pure and perfect mind itself, i am a practitioner - which is an expression of that pure and perfect mind.

    Conflating the two leads to errors in understanding and practice in the teachings I follow.

     

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  3. Posted · Edited by steve

    2 hours ago, Cobie said:

    One cannot have a sensible discussion with someone from another Way, as long as either is locked up inside their own Way.

     

     

     

    Yes, but one can have one hell of an argument!

    DaoBums for the win!

     

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  4. Posted

    6 hours ago, old3bob said:

     

    the ways or teachings of renunciates are often being quoted at this site but a householder/family person can not rightly be a renunciate and also fulfill their householder dharma at the same time....In many/most Hindu traditions when a householder has fulfilled that dharma then they can transition to being a renunciate,  whereas some become vowed renunciates/monks or nuns of an order at a very early age.  What problems have you seen along such lines?  

     

    I've not spent much time on the path of renunciation so I can't really comment much.

    Not saying it would not be effective, even for me maybe, but I'm glad I found an alternative.

    I do think it is a difficult path to tread for a householder.

     

     

    6 hours ago, old3bob said:

     

    "...We remain human and it is the human mind that experiences and recollects the release of limitations as some special state. That in and of itself is a bit of an error."  Steve

     

    There is a lot packed into your sentence above! (and the related post)  Is there an 'if' in part of it?  My interpretation along that line would say that the traced memory of "it" is not "it".  (but that pointers/maps/signposts can surely help) 

     

    Not sure where or if an "if" would fit in there, do you have a suggestion?

     

  6. Posted

    The synchronicity of the DaoBums provides... a brief description of working with the tsa, lung, and thigles in the Bön tradition, recently posted on FB by a young practitioner from Menri monastery in Himachal Pradesh for any curious - 

     

    Spoiler
    In the Embrace of Fire and Wind: A Reflection on the 106 Day Tsalung Retreat
    As I sit here now, the intense rigor of the past few months settling into a quiet inner warmth, my heart is filled with a profound sense of gratitude. From October 29, 2025, to February 8, 2026, I had the incredible karma to withdraw from the ordinary world and enter the Shen gyi Sang-ngak Gom-drup Ling (Shen’s Secret Mantra Meditation Center) at our glorious Pal Shenten Menri Ling.
    Together with my dharma brothers, under the close guidance of our retreat master, Gen Geshe Yungdrung Yonten, we undertook the 106 day Tsalung (Channels and Winds) retreat.
    The Foundation
    As the great master Sumden Yormeba taught, "Before entering the practice of virtue, one must recite the scriptures, make offerings, receive initiations, and accumulate merit in every possible way." Following this essential advice, we did not rush. We began by performing the Tsog offering of the Lama Gonpo Yermed (Inseparability of the Lama and Protector) and the Inner Guru Yoga of the Unrivaled Lord (Nyammed Sherab Gyaltsen). Only with this spiritual foundation laid did we embark on the actual path of the winds.
    The Daily Discipline
    For one hundred and six days, our lives were governed by the rhythm of the breath and the discipline of the body. We moved through the stages of the "Gentle Wind" (Jam Lung), the "Intermediate Wind" (Bar Lung), and the "Fierce Wind" (Drak Lung).
    Every day was divided into four sessions (Thun). It was physically demanding. We practiced the three preliminary isolations, erected the protective tent of the mind, and purified the poisonous winds. We worked tirelessly to bless our channels and chakras, holding the strict physical postures and visualizing the channels with unwavering focus. We performed the 80 magical movements (Trul Khor) of the A-Tri and Zhang Zhung Nyen Gyu lineages until our bodies became pliable vessels for the wisdom wind.
    Moments of Blessing
    A memory I will cherish forever occurred on the final day of our "Intermediate Wind" practice. We were blessed by the presence of His Holiness the Menri Trizin Rinpoche and His Eminence the Menri Ponlob Rinpoche. To demonstrate the Trul Khor movements before our root masters was nerve-wracking, but their compassionate gaze gave us new strength to continue.
    The Test of Inner Fire
    The culmination of our journey came on February 7, 2026. In the pre-dawn darkness, after holding the breath 108 times and completing the Nyen Gyu Trul Khor, we stepped out into the biting cold in front of the Meditation Center.
    At 5:30 AM, in the presence of His Holiness The 34th Menri Trizin Rinpoche, His Eminence Menri Ponlob Rinpoche, and the assembly of monks, we offered the sign of our practice: Tummo (Inner Heat). Following the texts, we dipped sheets into water that had been consecrated for 100 days. Wrapped in these cold, wet sheets, I turned my mind inward to the fire at the naval chakra. Slowly, steam began to rise. Drying those sheets three times was not just a physical feat; it was the external proof of the internal warmth of the teaching.
    Looking Forward
    On the morning of February 8th, after a final session of "Gentle Wind" and archery-style Trul Khor, we concluded the retreat with a thanksgiving offering and the opening of the retreat doors.
    Though the 100 days are over, the practice does not end. We are now immediately transitioning into the practice of Chudlen (Essence Extraction), nourishing ourselves on the "essence of liberation" as taught in the texts.
    Having completed 100,000 recitations of the Lama Gonpo Yermed mantra, and having spent every morning reciting the Ma Gyu lineage prayers and every evening offering our bodies in generosity (Lu Jin), I feel a transformation. My body feels lighter, but my devotion feels heavier—anchored deeply in the blessings of the Lineage.

     

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  7. Posted · Edited by steve

    4 hours ago, Apech said:

    I think that to rest one's consciousness in the pristine consciousness itself is quite an achievement in itself.  But as a goal it is limited as it presents as a separate state - so it is prone to abstraction and negation of life and the world.

     

    Agreed, one mistake is to take it as a goal, per se, another to consider it a separate state. While it is a valuable skill to cultivate, once there is some level of success and stability it should no longer be treated as  final goal. It is more of a tool. The goal becomes total integration in all states of human experience. For sure the method is prone to abstraction and disconnection. This is why expert guidance and a close relationship with a lineage and teacher are so important. 

     

    4 hours ago, Apech said:

    That more complete thing engages both the subtle and physical body - and this is where the 'work' is. 

     

    I very much agree. The work must address everything in human experience, from the coarsest to the most subtle. There is work at each level. In the dzogchen tradition I follow, every formal practice session includes elements from sutra, tantra, and dzogchen. At a minimum prayers, energetic cleansing, and guru yoga. In life, one must attend to the physical body, the subtle body, and mind's nature.

     

    4 hours ago, Apech said:

    I think mahamudra and dzogchen do have a fault in that this task is disguised in a lot of talk of resting in the natural state etc.  which is very misleading if not fully understood.

     

    I think it is a mistake to fault mahamudra or dzogchen, per se. The fault lies with the teacher and/or the practitioner. That is where misleading and misunderstanding occur. In these vehicles, there is a common tendency to conflate the practitioner with the inherent perfection of the primordially pure essence. It is not surprising, given that this is the very essence of the practitioner herself.

     

    It is my contention that in the living being, there is never complete and perfect union with / resting in pristine consciousness. Any experience we have of "that" is actually an experience of the release of an obstacle that was previously limiting our openness, our spaciousness, our warmth in some way. This is in part because in life we are always limited by our human form and in part because what we are pointing to in these teachings is not "a state" of any sort in the way we can envision what that means. We remain human and it is the human mind that experiences and recollects the release of limitations as some special state. That in and of itself is a bit of an error.

     

    Yes, there can be a lot of talk, particularly by anonymous folks online and in teaching sessions especially when beginner and intermediate practitioners are involved, but the talk and study are released and become less interesting as the path is understood. There was a time when I couldn't get enough of reading and listening to the teachings. I would read before, during, and after work, and on the weekends. I would listen to recordings whenever driving. Now these rarely hold my attention any longer. It is the resting and the integration that are most fascinating and engaging for the most part.

     

     

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  8. Posted

    1 hour ago, Tommy said:

    I have had you on the ignore list for a long time. And now you have reminded me of why that was.

     

    Nungali is like life.

    Sometimes they will slap you in the face, sometimes tickle you with joy, sometimes you feel like you just need a break, and at other times they will surprise you with the unexpected.

     

    :wub:

     

    I have ignored some people here on occasion (never Nungali though) when not modding.

    One of the downsides of being a mod/admin - you can't ignore people.

     

    I haven't felt the need to do so in a long time, probably not since the great right wing expulsion.

    The people who irritate me the most are pointing to something in me that is worthy of acknowledgement, recognition, and reconciliation. It's a bit like forgiveness in that it is more for the one offering than for the one receiving, though both can ultimately benefit. 

     

    Now that I've spouted off some wise sounding words, someone will probably piss me off enough to put them on ignore any time now!

    :lol:

  9. Posted

    1 hour ago, Tommy said:

    There is a curiosity about the nature of the univderse.

     

    Curiosity is most wonderful and is the motivating factor for both my interest in meditation and my interest in science.

    Each is a valid and valuable avenue of exploration of the nature of me, which is not separate from the nature of the universe.

    I would feel incomplete if I didn't give some of my attention to each. 

    For me, both are inextricably connected.

     

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  11. Posted

    9 hours ago, Tommy said:

    Sorry no patience. Too long-didn't read.

     

    I can relate. I rarely read or ponder this sort of thing any longer. I spend far more time practicing than studying or thinking about it. On the other hand, some topics do catch my interest and this happens to be one.

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  12. Posted

    9 hours ago, oak said:

     

    Hi Steve,

    Sorry to interfere with your conversation with Bindi but I feel like comenting on what you have written with an example of a dream.

    …

     

    Just my experience...

    Don't think that Bindi is defending that all dreams are untouched by our conditioning but a few in fact seem to be.

     

    No need for an apology.

     

    4 hours ago, Bindi said:

     

    I think the images that are used in dreams are very much based on conditioning and experience, but the plot of dreams is the objective part, I have found that dreams mirror the state of our psyche, subtle body and physical body without our subjective sense of our selves interfering

    …

     

    I see dreams as an incredible resource, but they come without an operators manual, at this point I think some of us are trying to write that manual. I’ve been at it for forty years so far, and I’ve found it to be a fascinating journey into all the levels of me. 
     

    …


    The objective reality I’m referring to is this objective mirror, the dream plot is delivered to my conscious mind without interference from my conscious mind. This is the most objective I can be about the nature of my own reality, which is what I’ve chosen to examine. 

     

    I very much appreciate both responses. Good stuff here with which to spend some time.

     

    🙏🏼

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  13. Posted

    On 2/13/2026 at 6:46 AM, Bindi said:

    Rising from the subconscious, untouched by subjective beliefs, dreams are as close as I’ve come to objective reality. 

     

    Interesting assertions @Bindi, thanks for sharing.

    I hope you don't mind a few questions to help me understand where you are coming from. 

    You propose that dreams are completely independent of subjective beliefs.

    Do you feel that our lifetime of conditioning, our assumptions and expectations, our life experience and its effects on our body, mind, and spirit have no effect on what arises in the heart/mind during sleep?

    You suggest that dreams, which are limited to individual subjective experience, are the closest thing to your experience of objective reality.

    That begs the question - how to define objectivity and reality? 

     

     

     

  14. Posted

    2 hours ago, Tommy said:

    So what are we talking about when it comes to Quantum and Consciousness? Probability and statistics? One doesn't just live in the world of the very small. There is also the very large. Are we talking about forces? Gravity, electro-magnetism, strong force, weak force? The topic is not clear.

     

    It's definitely not very clear or easy to grasp but if you have the patience to read through the second paper I referenced above it does a very nice job of walking through fundamental ways of thinking about consciousness, quantum mechanics, and how the two could relate to one another in the context of the brain, nervous system, and beyond. It's not an easy read but I find the ideas and methods of inquiry fascinating.

     

    https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1571064513001188?via%3Dihub

  15. Posted

    On 2/8/2026 at 1:11 PM, old3bob said:

    Don't worry be happy?  (common in Hollywood movies and in the Absolute)

     

    Don't worry, be happy!

    And don't worry, be sad!

    Don't worry, be angry

    And don't worry, be fabulous!

    Be everything fully but don't take any of it too seriously, in a short time it will change.

    The "Absolute" has no preference and no limitation, everything is a part of it without exception.

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  17. Posted

    I have enjoyed looking through your thread. It is inspiring. 

    My practice is somewhat similar to yours.

    In recent months I've been trying to regulate, lengthen, and improve my quality of sleep as I am chronically sleep deprived.

    I've been prioritizing it over my morning meditation and exercise.

     

    I also practice Ba Duan Jin.

    I find it to be marvelous for my body, especially my low back.

    I try to always practice it after vigorous physical work or exercise, especially snow shoveling!

    I feel that it has saved me from low back pain and stiffness countless times, including after the big storm we had 2 weeks ago.

    _/\_

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  19. Posted

     

    50 minutes ago, Apech said:

    I'm not against the idea although I'm not sure it would get much traffic. 

     

    I would bet there would be more traffic, and less contention, than the new Neidan forum.

    About the only discussion there has been debate over Winn and Chia and an attempt to list legitimate schools.

     

    50 minutes ago, Apech said:

    Also what counts as 'indigenous' given I am indigenous to England ... would that count? 

     

    I think we could come up with a workable definition.

    You are indigenous to England but would not count because you are not a religion or belief system.

    Although some of us believe you are divine...

    :D

     

     

    50 minutes ago, Apech said:

     

    Maybe it would be better to have threads in Western Esoteric on Native American, African, Aboriginal beliefs?

     

    Western? When the Western world encounters indigenous belief systems it tends to denigrate or eradicate them, then a century or so later name their sports clubs, autos, and restaurants after them... They are certainly not geographically limited to the West. The are esoteric and occult, but not really what was intended to be the subject of the Esoteric and Occult sub-forum here, I don't think.

     

    I would like to suggest they be honored and respected by having their own sub-forum or left in General Discussion.

     

     

     

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  20. Posted · Edited by steve

    On 1/12/2026 at 7:30 AM, Vajra Fist said:

    Bit of a weird one. Wondered if anyone has encountered anything similar. 

     

    Throughout my life, I've had moments that feel like an intersection, where I come into contact with the mindstream of a future or past self. These are very strange, half-waking dream moments where I feel like I'm able to ask questions of a future self, or else send reassurance and answers to a past self. They don't last long. 

     

    I like to think I'm a fairly down-to-earth person. I'm a middle aged Brit and a dad, I work an ordinary job.

     

    I meditate, but not for altered states of consciousness, but rather to bring myself closer to tangible reality. 

     

    But I did do a lot of acid in my teenage years. Which has either opened me up to paranormal stuff like this, or else has given me latent schizophrenia. 

     

    I normally dont think too much about this, it's just a weird little quirk of my personality that I've never felt the need to tell anyone about.

     

    But recently what I feel like is a future self said that 2026 will be a particularly challenging year for my health. It has suggested I practice a specific type of qigong, and stop taking some supplements and peptides I've been dabbling with. 

     

    It's a bit of a worry because I'm 42 in April, which I've since learned is my yakudoshi year (basically ill fortune year in shinto belief). I also saw recently that it's also not looking great for my health in Chinese astrology (wood rat).

     

    So while I'd normally brush it off as my weird little mind, I'm not sure if I should perhaps take the suggestions of this internal voice seriously. Or whether that way lies madness. 

     

    Has anyone else heard of this sort of communication across time with future/past selves? I've not been able to find anything mentioned anywhere similar. 

     

     

     

    Thanks for sharing your experience. 

    Some of my rambling thoughts on the matter, fwiw.

     

    Our minds come up with all sorts of things, some of little consequence and some very consequential, some weird and wonderful.

    Personally, I don't spend too much time trying to find explanations for these things, rational or otherwise.

    Do we sometimes meet with our minds from the past or future? Why not? Time is not as fixed or linear as once believed.

    Is it just content being created by the monkey mind based on all of the input over a lifetime and more? Why not? That does not mean that it is not very significant and meaningful. 

     

    Fortune telling and astrology are not set in stone and are not death or illness sentences, they are simply constellations of external conditions and how they relate to our own constellations of internal conditions. 

    I was in a similar state as you coming into my 60th year - warnings from Tibetan and Chinese friends and so forth. 

    Fortunately, nothing particularly bad occurred for me.

     

    I don't brush off my weird little mind and I don't take it too seriously either. 

    I don't brush of horoscopes and warnings and strange experiences, like meeting with a past or future self, or having visions, and I don't take them too seriously either. 

     

    I do recommend attending to healthy choices as best you can determine them. Your body is aging and needs attention and care. It's the only one you get. Much of life in our technological age is unhealthy for the body and mind. If it means listening to an inner voice or a voice from the future or past, that is fine. No need to analyze or judge its veracity, it's still just another voice. The important thing, IMO, is trying to recognize the source of that voice. Does it feel authentic or is it based in emotional reactivity or psychological baggage? Does it come from the source or from pain and ignorance. Is it the Dao speaking and flowing through you or rumblings from an unhealthy or overly indulgent meal? Is it a future self or an ancestral trauma? Does it matter?

     

    I think it is most healthy to find something to trust, something that is not dependent on the monkey mind and labile emotions. Something not rooted in conditioned patterns coming from ancestral, social, and cultural trauma and dysfunction. For me that is one major benefit of my meditation practice. I think it could be helpful to sit quietly and be very open and still for a time. Once the mind and heart are somewhat settled and open, drop a question in like dropping a pebble in a calm pond. A question like, can I trust this inner voice, is it authentic? Or, shall I engage in this new qigong? Or, do I realy need these supplements? Just one at a time. See how it feels, not thinking about it, just allowing the ripples to arise and spread for a time. Leave them be after asking the question, don't engage, just remain open and present. Then continue to sit in that stillness and openness that returns once the mind has once again settled. 

     

    I find that whatever comes from that quiet and still place is authentic, it is something I can trust. Maybe more precise to say it is something I have chosen to trust. I find that what comes from that place tends to be more accurate and dependable than decisions made from thinking or emotionally charged responses. The key is that one must be able to truly rest and be open to the stillness, silence, and spaciousness of body, speech, and mind. 

     

    Whatever happens, whatever comes for you in this year of the Fire Horse, you will be OK. Situations and circumstances change. Our capacity for being open and present and responsive to the situation is always there. If we can trust in that, we can be OK even when we're not OK. I may sound overly confident and certain and I am not. I also worry and get distracted by thoughts and feelings all the time. Health, family, work, politics, finances - all sorts of worries and challenges. What I am saying to you is an externalization of what I tell myself and try to practice. 

     

    I'm reminded in this moment of the Theravadan monks currently walking from Texas to Washington, DC - 2,300 miles. Simple human beings without any particular physical training walking everyday through the harshest of conditions, -15℃ with windchill much lower, through ice and snowstorms... all to raise awareness of the potential for peace in our country and in our lives. WOW, what power! What courage! What resilience! It boggles my weird, little mind. They are OK, I am OK, you are OK, even the poor monk who lost his leg to an impatient driver is OK, and yet...   it's OK to not always be OK.

     

    Sending you warmth and good wishes

     

     

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  24. Posted

    2 hours ago, Cobie said:

     


    Now everyone got a booklet (from the government) telling us how to survive the first 72 hours when e.g there’s a war here inside the Netherlands. I have already more than my fill of ‘fire breathing’ going on around here; no ‘horsey’ horses for me please, just a sweet horsie, thank you.

     

     

     

    Sending you good vibes and warm friendship @Cobie

     

     

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