BobD

Looking really good Sean. Lots of play value! I'll be awake all night now checking it out, damn!

Been trying this method again for a quite a few days now, mainly with the focus of trying to keep my nose clear and easy to breathe. The interesting thing is, you said whereas I seem to have better results with clearing my nose when I do hold after the inhale, rather than after the exhale. I know that this isn't what the B method teaches, and that its closer to Nine Bottle Breathing. Not sure what this signifies, if anything I still feel that I get some benfits from the B method, sharper mental focus, a more awake feeling (good in the mornings), but it doesn't seem to have an impact on my nose. Something for me to continue playing with I think, to decide which of the two practices suits me more.

Interesting article, but for the sake of balance, here is the opposing view of the project http://www.skepticreport.com/psychics/radin2002.htm

Yeah, I hadn't thought about it that way before. You never know, it might work! I'll give it some thought and maybe start one up, even if it does only function as a naggy little reminder to me. Your log is hardly boring, what with the, er, wide range of topics it has developed recently :shock: True. That works as long as you don't then think about everyone else here. My head spins just reading some of the logs here. Great, thanks. Cheers

Hi Harry If you are interested in memory books and techniques, let me add to the list of recommendations books by Tony Buzan (Master Your Memory) and Dominic O'Brien (How To Develop A Perfect Memory). Both describe similar techniques to Lorayne, but with different specifics and details. Absoultely. Using the techniques from the above books I have found that it is quite easy to remember whole chunks of stuff that I would previously never have attempted, believing my memory to be too poor.

Interesting. I like the part about the passive inhale caused by the sudden relaxation of the diaphragm. I follow normal belly breathing practices of the diaphragm (sheesh, thats a hard word to make sure you spell right each time!) pushing down on inhale but hadn't applied it in this dynamic tension/relaxation way during Buteyko breathing. I'lll give that a go. As with many of my practices, I find that I do most Buteyko breathing when driving (as it is often the only "free" time I can be sure of during my day), so the leaning and rolling may not be possible. Yeah, I have thought about it, but I know that it would mostly be of the form "missed most of my practices today again", "got up too late to do my routines" and so on. Plus with my current level of accomplishment and dedication I don't think it would make very interesting reading anyway . About the only constant part of my daily routine these days is the 5 Tibetans, which I have actually managed to do everyday (and I really do mean every day) since just before Christmas. That must be a record for me in terms of number of consecutive days of any practice (I am such a lamer!) Anyway, thanks again for the info.

Thanks Sean. The obsessive inhalations of modern breathing is something I have come across in both Winn's and Dennis Lewis' material, and I do try to ensure that I focus on exhalation for a more balanced breath, and that I actually complete the exhale. How long does the decongestion last for after you stop? I find that my nose closes up quite quickly, which must mean I'm doing something wrong! Could you give a quick outline of how you apply the protocol? Cheers

How does the Buteyko method sit alongside traditional deep belly breathing? When I have read other books etc about the method they all talk about "chronic overbreathing" and how people should breathe in small sips (ie not breathe deeply at all, using shallow breathing). This has always seemed to contradict the deep breathing from the tan tien that I try to follow during normal day to day breathing. I have noticed that my nose (which is normally quite stuffy) does clear a bit if I increase the pauses between in- and ex-halations and vice versa, but I have always been unsure about how the two styles fit together. Is it just a case of still deep breathing from the tan tien, but including long pauses at either end of the cycle (ie ignore the shallow breathing part)? Thanks Sean for bringing up a topic I have been meaning to ask for advice on previously anyway

From Bill's latest email newsletter: "....so we’ll try producing several sets of teaching lectures on Taoist cultivation, Esoteric School cultivation, Medieval Western Alchemy (this is cool stuff because it matches EXACTLY with Eastern cultivation, proving once again the path is nondenominational), anti-aging methods through science, nutrition and meditation, and the various stages of the spiritual path." Anyone wanting to subscribe to the newsletter can do so here http://www.meditationexpert.com/articles.html

Hum. I think I'm with Ron on that one! I follow (and agree somewhat with) your arguments, but I don't think that this is something that fits well with my WSM Whereas this is one I like! I've tried it a few times and like it as a variation. The main difference it imposes from my imagery is that I see the bones glowing white from within (creating a kind of transparancy in the skeleton), but I have combined them (ie wash off the crud to reveal the glow from within) which works for me. Thanks

Sums up my cuurent state of practice too! I've enjoyed and learnt from your posts, and wish you all the best. Same here (work, surf and PC games!) Have you got a flat screen? Makes a huge difference (as does getting the resolution and refresh rate correct)

Yoda - Debraining! Love it! That is a great word to describe it. Sean - fantastic approach. I will also try that in my next WSM. Like you, I had never considered it before. I do flesh, blood, internal organs, sinews etc, but had forgotten all about the old brainbox. Awesome. Both - Thanks for the links on herbs and skeletons. I will look into both if I have no luck looking locally after the Christmas rush has died down.

I have recently started to read quite a bit of the stuff on meditationexpert. A lot of it is too technical for my current level, but there is a lot that makes sense and that I can apply. But I have got a question about his take on the whole Chakra/Spinning/Orbit stuff. He seems to say that all of those practices that involve forcing (or perhaps encouraging is a better word) your chi to move in a set way are just not worth doing (or even harmful), and that all you should do is emptyness meditations to get the mind out of the way. For instance "Because you play with your thoughts all day, you are always interfering with your body's normal circulation of energies", and "your chi starts to rise because you let go of thoughts" I know that this has been discussed a little before (mainly on the HT board) but I was wondering what people's feelings are about Bodri's stuff compared to the more active HT style stuff. I think that (at least some of) you guys still do (at least some of) the HT practices, so what are your opinions on such articles as "Don't Try to Spin Your Chi When You Meditate" and "Another Lesson in Why Microscosmic Circulations is a Waste"? Do his comments extend to all HT practices? Thanks BobD

Many thanks for these replies. I am reading (and rereading) them and the corresponding posts on HT (and probably will continue to do so for a while!) That;s a good distinction. Mine isn't very quiet most of the time, so some more emptyness practice would probably be a good idea! Been following for a while, but not as seriously as many here. I have many books/tapes (Chia/Winn/Frantzis/Lam Kam Chuen/Wong Kiew Kit etc) but I think I need to stop reading them and start doing some of them more! Really enjoying White Skeleton at the moment, together with the HT basics (Smile, Sounds etc). That's a phase I miss from many of my practices, and so is something I can immediately focus on including. Vey nice! Thanks again to all. Really!

Yup, thats what I thought! It does seems to be a meditation open to combining with all sorts of other ones. I should try more outdoor practices. I used to do ZZ outdoors but found it hard to keep up (for one thing it meant that I had to keep the garden tidy , my garden does not get much sun and I found it harder to motivate myself to get up and outside each morning) I really must make more effort on some of these things to get more out of it. I'm sure that sungazing, or just being in the sun, has so many benefits, so when the weather improves again I really will make some effort. What benefits have you noticed from Nattokinase and Nature's Pure Body? Are they easy to get from local health stores (I'm in the UK so your answer may not apply anyway) or do you buy over the web?

I sent an email to Bill saying how much I have been enjoying WSM, and giving some details of the imagery I have been using (as posted in this thread) and (part of) his reply says: to add the inner smile to the WSM is the smartest thing I've heard of all year....an excellent way to help peple realize they should be HAPPY, not sad, during this technique so as to activate the hormones and let go of the body to slide into/match the first dhyana. As that US TV commercial goes, "Brilliant!" I wasn't too sure what he would think of the methods I have come to use when defleshing, or indeed of the whole thing of adding to this stage of the WSM (I'm never sure how much to do a practice exactly as described and how much it makes sense to play around with it - though this thread has been great for playing around value (thanks Yoda!)). His reply although not explicitly mentioning my imagery (except for the use of the Inner Smile) did at least not say don't do it . He also then reiterated the importance of imagining the bones to be a very bright WHITE (his capitals). Thats good, as thats more or less what I've been doing in this thread so far . I wasn't too sure at the start how much of the practice I could quote but I figured a reworded version must be ok, else no-one would ever be able to discuss it. Next on my list is to try Sean's variation and then move onto the emptyness phase a bit more.

Now that sounds like a neat variation to try! Thats what I'm loving about these discussion, different slants on the same practices. Yeah, I should spend longer on that part. I'm thinking that I'll continue to work through it spending time on the first part til I'm happy that I have tried a few variations of imagery, and then concentrate more on the emptyness stage. He says this version is better for getting rid of the sexual energy that might otherwise build up. Yoda, are you doing this version more that the dust one? Do you experience any difference? Sean, please keep us posted with your experiences of WSM.

Never tried sungazing from this point of view before, but it is a recommended practice of the Bates Method (which is something that I follow). Basically, Bates was a guy who held the belief that glasses and contacts are a bad idea, and that all people need to do to improve vision is relax, and stop straining to see. One of the methods he recommended (not the main method by any means, just one method) was to stare at the sun. This has since been modified by later practitioners to be look at the sun through closed eyelids, and to sway the head from side to side, so as to wash the (closed) eyes with sunlight. This helps promote a more relaxed state of vision. I have stopped wearing my glasses completely, (they were never very strong anyway) and follow this and other practices to relax my eyes. My eyesight has improved since doing so. Bates himself, and plenty of others who follow his methods, claim to have helped hundreds of people go from very bad eyesight to 20/20 vision or better.

Hi Yoda Bill has just sent out an email called "How to Practice the White Skeleton Meditation and become a Meditation Expert". It may be that everyone here is on his mailing list anyway, and so will have got this, but if not is it worth (and would it be ok to) post the text of the email here? It's only a shortened version of the WSM text, but still useful. If he is sending it out free then it the same copyright issues may not apply.

Arrrggghhhh. Keep forgetting to log in, and the tick to login automatically just doesn't seem to want to work for me. At work it does, but not at home. Hum, must investigate that.

Thanks Trunk I'll give that a go, starting tomorrow. I'm on holiday for a few days, so I can actually have a lie in and do my practices. I will integrate ankle rotations into my pre-getting up routine and see what results I get.

Related to the original topic, can I ask for advice from people about any of the following: Practices for getting better (deeper, more refreshing) sleep. Practices for needing less sleep. Practices for feeling more lively in the morning? As you can perhaps tell from the theme of these questions I find that the main reson I sometimes(!) don't get round to doing my "daily" practices is that I feel too tired (not in an ME kind of a way, just normal "rather stay in bed for an exra hour" kind of a way). I have started juicing, but sometimes I can't even face that in the morning (which is my preferred time for practice). So I'm after advice as to what I can do to be able to bounce out of bed that extra hour earlier to start the day with a good session of exercises, meditations etc. I always feel better for getting up and doing my practices, but sometimes only several hours into the day. I have tried the NLP approach of reprogramming to look forward to getting up, with some success, but I was wondering if anyone had anything more directly related to the sleep issue. Thanks

Whoops, forgot to log in for that last one !

A few more points I have noticed after today's practice: If I start defleshing at the top of the head, and continue to the toes, then this part of the WSM seems to be very like Bruce Kumar Frantzis dissolving method. Another benefit to the practice. I find that it is quite easy to imagine my skeleton skull to be grinning, which acts as a reminder to do the Inner Smile during this meditation and after. It is also easy to imagine my spine straightening and lengthening as it is revealed. I have also started trying to visualize parts of my body as bones during the day, so that, for instance, whenever I see my arm I try to see it as the bones. This will (hopefully) help me when I come to do the full WSM by improving my imagery, and also help settle my mind during the day. You just gotta love this stuff!

Great way of expressing it! That describes the way I've come to do it very well! I grab a whole chunk of flesh and rip it off, which then shows the bones underneath. With some parts (especially eg chest) the flesh I remove then exposes all the gunk inside (organs, blood etc) which then flop to the ground with the flesh. Nice image also. I might start to incorporate the image of a bowl or large offering dish on a stand. I have to repeat that I'm loving WSM! Since you were spot on with that recommendation, I may try Primordial next. Did you buy it through HT or http://www.taichi-enlightenment.com/?