Thunder_Gooch

how many lightning bolts can a level 72 mo pai master absorb?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lwESraWEpSU

MO, I hope that you develop a successful lineage, and have many students. I wish you the best with your practice.

To be honest I don't know how many chakra's the mo pai system ultimately works with, whether it is 72 total fused together to make 36, or 144 total fused together to make 72. I don't have any good answers for you. I don't know what chakras are worked with or how past level 4 in their system, only that I would assume the other chakra's are filled compressed and fused to their corresponding yin centers just like levels 1-4, and interconnected with one another. Perhaps in the Indonesian system levels 1-4 are really all 1a, 1b, 1c, 1d. I do know that we have three dan tiens and it is my goal to fill all three if I do nothing else with my practice. I wish I had something better to give you, but I don't.

MO, Not to offend you, but I think you'd be better off getting to level 72, then coming back to help us once you've reached the zenith of your potential. No one is going to listen to anything you have to say until then. I am not trying to pick on you, just trying to tell you how it works in real life.

I'll be honest I don't know specifically how many chakra's mo pai's system works with. We know that levels 1-4 involve two chakras. So if you assume that for every 4 levels 2 chakras are filled, compressed and fused together as one, 72 / 4 = 18, and 18 x 2 = 36. It is possible that the mo pai system works only with 36 chakras fusing them together as in levels 1-4 into 18 chakras, and wiring them up and connecting them together. To be honest I don't know for certain. No one said that it was one chakra per level. In this there are 20 chakras displayed, not including the ones in the arms and hands, nor the channels interconnecting them.

Dorian, Each major chakra probably encompasses multiple levels, perhaps more than four before moving onto the next chakra. It is my understanding there are 7 major chakras and hundreds of minor ones, and the channels which interconnect them.

I'll send you a PM, the less I say here the less potential there is for me to get stuck in another 10 page debate.

It's an awkward state to be in, neither are you "not aware", nor are you "aware". It is both at the same time, neither at the same time, and just one, and just the other all at the same time, and none at the same time. It makes absolutely no sense for me even try to explain. Only that it is inception level trippy to exist like that. It isn't the same as waking consciousness, but you can remain focused with your awareness like a laser, and it does become mechanical and self repetitive like driving a car without thinking about it even though your active attention is diligently focused on the activity and not distracted by internal dialog or music or conversation. Imagine becoming one with the experience to the point the car becomes an extension of your being and you can feel it touching the road itself. It is my opinion that trance state must be achieved first before one pointed concentration begins, but this is just my opinion. If you can get that deep by using one pointed concentration then you are more advanced than me and you have my admiration. It takes me all night to reach the level of trance required just to do 30 minutes to an hour of actual concentration meditation.

Here is what I do know. Mo pai level 1 is nothing special, and employed in about a bazillion other schools. Longmen pai to name one specifically. At the very least we can fill all three of our dan tiens using this form of meditation, at which point the universe may open up better paths for us, or we may manifest clairvoyance to the degree to find the next step in our journey. OR We can continue to teacher hop to the next fad of the week, newage, hippy, mantra, snake oil salesman while pouting about our sour grapes and how much Mo Pai really sucked anyway. If faced with prospect of one true and fundamental practice vs 10,000 made up BS ones that lead nowhere, it's a no brainer.

One pointed concentration, yes absolutely critical. It's hard for me to describe an experience to another person. The state I am talking about certainly is not the same as normal waking consciousness though. Deep trance state, and suspended animation are the best words I have to describe it. You are in a deep torpor and your bodies metabolism slows to the point you would be pounced dead by a medical professional. You'll know you are in the correct state when you can see eyes closed and blindfolded. Anything before that level of trance isn't the correct state. Doing one pointed concentration meditation before you are deep enough is exactly the reason no one is able to progress quickly.

Mo Pai is the only system I am aware of that has ever produced immortal spirits (in recent history). John Chang, when he pushes close to the limits of his abilities can sense 10 more people like him alive in China, and no where else on earth. At the very most those 10 individuals could represent 10 seperate schools. In Mo Pai there are 72 levels of cultivation, each with a specific meditation. Some can take years to master even with daily training, all day every day. Each level deals with a different chakra, filling with yang energy, compacting/compressing, moving and fusing it with it's yin chakra counterpart, opening energy channels. Imagine building a human body from scratch out of energy. It isn't until level 30+ you are considered a true immortal. And when I talk about meditation it isn't mantra, or visualization, or focusing on the breath or any of that Jazz. It is an extreme and profoundly deep strate of trance/ suspended animation. You can't drink a potion and cast a spell and draw some pictures and chant some incantation or mantra or visualize and become an immortal. These guys sit outside in nature for years to extract the energy required to feed and noursesh their yin and yang spirits, and fuse them together as one.

To becoming immortal, no it's a lot more complicated than that.

I wasn't deep enough into my other body, to recreate an experiment I've successfully demonstrated before.

http://thetaobums.com/topic/20197-immortals-xian-shi/page__st__128#entry377139 Joe mentioned something about balloon hands, and it brought back a memory when I tried to push chi out of my palm and it felt like the veins and arteries and capillaries in my hand became balloons, like the blood was trying to shoot out of my hand. Very painful.

As far as I can tell full awareness is not maintained, it is not like normal waking consciousness at all.

I have no idea what this question means xD

I've had that happen trying to push energy out of my hands, it was quite painful for some time after that.

In the state I have found it possible to work with chi my body is asleep, and my mind is awake. I can see eyes closed and blindfolded even more clearly than in waking consciousness. My mind is straddling the waking and unconscious state. It is only in this in between state that a person can feel, work with, and store chi. It isn't a state where your mind is chattering, you can force verbalized thoughts but it's like being heavily sedated. It is in this state you can focus and feel chi flow strongly in your body. It is this state I have found to be a prerequisite for concentration based meditation.

Concentration is only 1/2 the equation, and it is useless without achieving a deep trance state.

All I can say is that I know what it feels like to work with chi in a deep trance state connected to the earth, and I know what it feels like to try to work with it in an active state of non meditation. The two are worlds apart, perhaps galaxies apart. If you are overflowing with chi perhaps in an active state you can have some degree more control over it, but it isn't the same. That deep stillness of deep trance meditation is the only state I can honestly say that I know chi can be felt and worked with.

Jetsun, I think there are more options than those two. If there were a method of killing my soul so that I achieved eternal nonexistence, and thus ended rebirth in that manner. I would indeed take it. I seek to fuse my yin and yang spirits not to stop death but to stop being reborn. I am not terrified of dying, I am just highly motivated to get off this ride. Buddhists that I've met for the most part don't even believe in rebirth, those that do see no problem with being reborn.