Thunder_Gooch

I was under the impression that WuWei meant automatic, effortless, natural, reflexive action. Automatically doing the best possible action for a given task, without thinking about it, or second guessing it, automatically, effortlessly and perfectly. The last time I was in a fight I believe I experienced WuWei, I did not need to think twice about what needed to be done, it happened automatically, naturally and reflexively. I've heard a lot of people refer to it as being in "the zone".

http://www.thetaobums.com/index.php?/topic/21954-meditation-is-not-a-good-way-for-practising/page__view__findpost__p__312000

http://www.thetaobums.com/index.php?/topic/21954-meditation-is-not-a-good-way-for-practising/page__view__findpost__p__312042 As I mention here, Huston Smith author of one of the best world religion's textbooks I know of, describes Taoism as being in 3 separate camps, they are not mutually exclusive. 1. Philosophical Taoism It is a way for living your life. 2. Religious Taoism Chinese folk religion, superstition, magick and rituals. Things like coinswords, fu's and magickal rituals and such. 3. Energetic schools of Taoism, that devote themselves to the study of neigong, neidan, etc. In each of these camps there are thousands of different schools some so radically different from one another it would seem the term Taoism itself wouldn't even apply. It is hard to define Taoism as a single term. Can it be a philosophy? Yes. Can it be a religion? Yes. Can it not be a religion? Yes. Can it be a system of internal martial arts and meditation you practice to grow closer to the Tao? Yes. Can it be all three? Yes. If you want to get philosophical I view the Tao as the energy which drives the rotation of galaxy's as well as the movement of particles in the atoms of my body, and their subatomic constituents. The movement of all that exists, the change and transformation of all that exists. It is the heartbeat of the living universe. This energy flows through every corner of existence itself, it powers all thought, all perception, all consciousnesses, it is consciousness, it is the reality and universe we perceive. Meditation is a tool for observing the workings of your own mind, for advancing yourself spiritually, for health, for martial application, for a million other things. You can spend your life observing the universe/tao in a normal state of consciousness but I don't think you are going to get very far along the path. It's like walking cross country when you have the option to use a motorcycle. Meditation can be a very powerful tool, please don't overlook it.

fulllotus posted some info from a book called the antichrist training manual which claims to have the mo pai level 1-4 exercises, it' a fraud.

No not you per se, it's just we have a guy from Australia (we think) who is running a scam selling rare Taoist books and amulets etc, he claims to have a copy of the mo pai manual and scams people out of their money for it. He has multiple paypal accounts to launder money with, and has been causing lots of problems here and on other forums. His modus operandi is creating lots of new fake accounts with low post amounts to argue in mo pai threads and message people telling them he has copies of the mo pai manual to sell them. Usually these new low post accounts turn out to use an Australian ISP.

By your own definition you follow a philosophy, that's fine dude. There is nothing wrong with philosophical Taoism. It's a fine philosophy. It isn't the only way however, and following a philosophy does nothing to aid spiritual development.

Explain the real Dao and how you practice it, in your own words.

You follow a philosophy, or a religious sect of Taoism then. That is fine, but it discounts many other valid schools of Taoism which focus on practices like neigong and meditation.

I tried to trim it down as much as possible. Huston Smith does a better job than I could. As I understand it there are many different philosophical schools of taoism, thousands of schools of religious taoism, and perhaps even more of taoist schools which focus on internal arts like neigong, and neidan. Saying meditation has nothing to do with Taoism is a supremely ignorant statement. I used quotes from someone I consider an expert on the subject to support my view.

According to Huston Smith, author of my world religions textbook. http://www.worldwisdom.com/public/viewpdf/default.aspx?article-title=Taoism_by_Huston_Smith.pdf

No I don't misunderstand what real neigong is. If you have a better explanation please enlighten us, or shut up and go away.

I have nothing to say except you are so wrong here, you store energy to develop your spirit. Also the health benefits of neigong and qigong are the main focal point of many schools. You may be well versed in certain forms of Buddhist or Taoist philosophy but you are ignorant of Taoism as a whole and the point of practices like neigong. Taoism is a big catch all phrase, there are religious schools of Taoism, philosophical schools of Taoism and neigong schools which dedicate themselves to internal arts and extracting Qi from the environment and developing internal power and developing their spirit or shen. Studying some philosophy or practicing some certain way of living isn't going to do anything to help you develop spiritually.

For me, meditation is an altered state of consciousness, where the body grows cold, the breathing slows to imperceptible levels, the heart beat slows down to the point a pulse cannot be felt, and you can feel currents of energy run inside and outside of your body. In this state you can focus on pulling in energy to the lower dan tein also known as the naval chakra. I think it's a little silly that you have to ask what meditation is (there are millions of types of meditation) but yet you think it has nothing to do with Taoism and is a waste of time. It's like saying cars are a stupid way to get from place to place, walking is faster, wait what is a car?

The meditation I practice does not involve visualization, or thinking of anything. You enter a deep deep deep state of trance where you can easily and tangibly feel currents of energy within your own body, in this state you can pull in more chi and store it at the naval chakra, or dan tein.

WHAT!!! LLOLL omfg dude please stop talking it hurts.

Meditation is the opposite of Taoism?? Jesus man... where the f*** are you getting this nonsense??? Correct meditation is the only way to gather and accumulate chi at the lower dan tein, there is no better way. It's the most crucial and fundamental aspect of neigong that I am aware of. If you want to study Buddhist and Taoist philosophy, that's fine you don't need meditation. But being well versed in a particular philosophy or religion isn't going to do jack s*** for your spiritual development, it just means you are well versed in philosophy.

I would love to see where all these people who just joined with under 10 posts IP addresses come from, Australia I am guessing if not there I bet they can traced back to a proxy service.

So much bad advice, so little time. Every real Taoist school of neigong begins with meditation to accumulate chi. I think thetaobums would be a better place if all the people who have no idea what they are talking about would STFU, and stop giving advice like they are sages -Tao Te Ching chapter 56 .

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This dude is ridiculous, how could anyone take this seriously?

I probably wouldn't punch these losers in real life, I am not a violent person unless provoked. I really just can't stand newage peaced out hippies. The whole vibe "spiritual" hippy peaced out newage people give off, is like the sound of nails on a chalk board for me. Being around such people is truly painful for me. Anytime I mention I am into taoism or meditation, people automatically associate me with some newage hippy, so I just usually don't share that information. What upsets me is how the general public winds up associating real practices like neigong that are an authentic and true methods of spiritual training and development with reiki masters who wear ancient alien crystal headband technology to channel Atlantean healing power. It's because of these obnoxious newage lunatics that authentic spiritual systems will never be taken seriously.