NotVoid

Dee, It is Machu Picchu in Peru, about 80km or so northwest of Cusco. You can just type "Machu Picchu, Peru" into the search box in Google Maps.

Hello Kajenx. What I personally think is that in this modern world we are taught from a young age to objectify and to use logic and to analyze until the cows come home. This can work well enough when trying to understand the physical world around us better. In my opinion when it comes to actual meditation practice however, we need to put aside this mode of analytical thinking and just find a meditation practice that we find suitable and practice it according to the way that particular meditation is to be practiced. Many forms of meditation may well require an experienced teacher as well to help keep the student on track. In regards to meditation experience, our analytical mind is more apt to lead us astray than to be of real help. In my experience in regards to meditation itself it is better to relax the mind and just practice. Rather than trying to focus on and analyze any experiences too much, just relax and do the meditation as it is to be done. Over time a new sort of awareness and understanding may develop completely on its own. Good luck in your practice.

"Jhana in Taoism?" Hi kajenx. Just to make sure there is no misunderstanding, Taoism is not one single homogenous set of views and practices. There have been and are different branches and sects with various roots and influences, and so there can be a fair bit of variance in views and practices within Taoism. My way of looking at things is that different traditions may have quite different views and practices on the surface, but all are likely working to some degree at least with a common underlying 'substrate' of experience. Whether any particular Taoist branch or sect has 'surface views' which are close in some way or not to the concept of the four jhanas I don't know, but there should likely be at least some commonality in the deeper underlying experiences. Regarding experiences in meditation, I would say that we should be very cautious about trying to draw conclusions too quickly about any experiences we may be having in meditation. There can be a tendency to try to relate experiences we are having to descriptions of different states or signs or levels that are described about meditation, and if we see some similarities we may be inclined to assume too quickly that what we are experiencing is the same or a very similar type of experience. Often times those states that are being described are descriptions of states which may sound quite 'basic' on the surface, but which may actually be pointing to a much deeper degree of experience which can't be so easily described in words. So, although there may seem to be some similarities to what is being described, we may be experiencing something else. Also, sometimes in meditation we can get glimpses of deeper states, but because we are not really fully there yet in various ways, we are only able to get glimpses of what potentially is to come further along. Generally when one truly reaches a certain state, there will be little doubt that one has achieved that state, and when reading a description of that state left as a sign post by some former master, you will understand better the deeper meaning of what is being conveyed. This is of course just based on my own personal limited understanding and experiences with such things however.

Many Taoist meditation and neigong practices, and many martial and medical neigong/qigong practices include the concepts of the small heavenly circulation and the large or great heavenly circulation (microcosmic orbit and macrocosmic orbit). Some view this as the opening of a circulation in the Ren and Du channels (small circulation) and later the opening of a larger circulation through all of the eight extraordinary channels opens up (large circulation). There is also a deeper view to this practice, which relates to direct connections and direct correspondences to the world and universe around us which develop through these types of practices. If you have come across other perspectives on this, feel free to add it to this thread. Here is Yan Xin's view on the inner and outer connections and correspondences which can develop through these types of practices: ________________________________________________________________________ Small Celestial Circulation and Great Celestial Circulation According to some qigong literature, small celestial circulation and great celestial circulation differ in their circulation pathways. There is a common misconception about the circulation from the baihui acupuncture point (the top of the head) to the Huiying acupuncture point (midpoint between anus and genitals), which joins the "ren mai" (conceptual meridian) and "du mai" (governing meridian). Many believe this is the small celestial circulation. Actually, this is a very narrow understanding of "celestial circulation." "Celestial" means broad and universal, and "circulation" indicates that a new cycle is started when the end is reached. The body's interior is viewed as the small celestial circulation. The combination of the interior of the body and the external world is viewed as the great celestial circulation. This view is more in line with the true meaning of celestial circulation. Although the body's interior is viewed as small celestial circulation, it cannot be separated from the external universe. Therefore, the body's interior is always adjusted during the process of correspondence between a human being and the universe. The sensation of qi movement and adjustments within the body fall within the realm of the small celestial circulation. The continual adjustments inside and outside of the body, and the continual exchange between the interior of the body and the external world (especially long range exchanges) are the great celestial circulation. One can see that celestial circulation does not follow specific pathways. "Celestial circulation" is related to the word "celestial" in every way. "Celestial" means the universe or the celestial bodies. The human body can be viewed as a small universe that circulates within a great universe. Circulation can be as small as the human body, or as great as the universe, and should not be limited to specific small pathways. My personal experience has shown that without the limitation of specific paths for visualization and imagination, upon attaining a certain level, your entire body will have reactions, and all the meridians and channels of the body will become unobstructed. This is small celestial circulation. Great celestial circulation is not merely unobstructed internal flow. Upon attaining a certain level, you will become aware of times when your body grows larger and taller or smaller and shorter. It feels as though one moment you are diving down to the ground, and at another moment you come up again. After some time, when you begin practicing qigong you feel the body is constantly centered in the universe. You feel things circulating within, and exchanging between the interior of the body and external world. This is great celestial circulation. Small celestial circulation (as manifested in a human body) should have visible changes each month while great celestial circulation should have visible changes each year. Earth's revolution around its own axis takes one day, the Moon orbits the Earth in one month; and the Earth revolves around the Sun in one year. Great and small celestial circulations are associated with the relationships between the universe, Sun, Moon and Earth. Small celestial circulation changes at least once a day, and undergoes a large change once a month. Great celestial circulation has a large, visible change once a year. There is a saying that "one day is one year." This implies that an entire year's time is spent like one day. If this is the case, then your great celestial circulation has opened up. Those with open great celestial circulation experience time at a different rate. Often, a day's time goes by very fast, a month's time goes by before their realizing. For people with open great celestial circulation, their life span can be easily prolonged. However, according to some old masters, as well as my own personal experience, authentic great celestial circulation is not easy to achieve. ______________________________________________________________________ I also have come across some interesting correlations to this in Sunyogi Umasankar's description of the 13 stages of his yoga (especially items 10 to 13): ______________________________________________________________________ The Thirteen Stages of Sunyoga 1. Conquer all material desires. (Sexuality, anger, greed, narrow-mindedness, ego & jealousy, shame, hatred and fear). Related chakras: Anahata, Vishuhda, Agna, Monipur, Swadhisthan. Related subtle body: Pratyahar body. 2. Develop Divine Energy. Related chakra: Sahasrar & Muladhar. Related subtle body: Dharana body. 3. Atma Darsanam - Discovery of Atma, the soul. Related chakra: dhyana & dhyanarodhak. Related subtle body: dhyana body. 4. Samadhi - Enlightenment. Related chakra: samdhi & samadhirodhak. Related subtle body: samadhi body. 5. Conquer hunger. Related chakra: amrit chakra & amritrodhak. Related subtle body: Amrit body. 6. Conquer thirst. Related chakra: Jivanmukta chakra &jivanmuktarodhak chakra. Subtle body: Jivanmukta body. 7. Conquer diseases. Related chakra: rogamukta chakra & rogamuktarodhak chakra. Subtle body:rogamukta subtle body. 8. Paramahansa - Adjusting the mind to all situations. Related chakra: paramahansa chakra & paramahansarodhak chakra. Subtle body: paramahansa body. 9. Having no enemies - all enemies will be friends (including animals). Related chakra: chaityana chakra and chaityanarodhak chakra. Subtle body: chaityana body. 10. Longetivity (this happens when the body's vibration becomes the same as the environment's). Related chakra:amar chakra and amarrodhak chakra. Subtle body: amar body. 11. The body's vibration and earth's vibration will be equal. Related chakras: Grahanusama chakra &Grahanusamarodhak chakra. Subtle body: Grahanusama body. 12. The body's vibration and sun's vibration will be equal. Related chakras: nakhatranusama chakra and nakhatranusamarodhak chakra. Subtle body:nakhatranusama body. 13. The body's vibration and the vibration of the Universe (Supreme Soul) vibration will be equal. Related chakras: brahmbhandanusama chakra & brahmbhandanusamarodhak chakra. Subtle body: brahmbhandanusama body. ______________________________________________________________________ I have no idea if Sunyogi Umasankar's yoga is legit or not, but there does seem to be some close similarities to Taoist practices and views in his descriptions of the stages of his practice. He also doesn't seem to mind the snow and cold too much as well.

Hello Captain Mar-Vell. I hope that one day I can get to level 1.

Yes, the last few pics I posted were artistic creations, but I thought they were interesting anyway. We are part of nature.

Hi tsiwt. I would suggest that when asking about a particular practice, that you ask people how long they have been doing that particular practice, how much they have been practicing, and what kind of actual benefits they personally achieved from the practice. Why do I say this? Because from what I have seen, some people will recommend a practice which they themself have little to no actual experience with, but they just like the 'idea' of something, so they recommend it. I would agree with others that you should not limit yourself at the beginning when searching for a practice, as you may need to try some different things to get a better feel for what they involve, and it is also helpful if you mention what you want to achieve with your practice.

Tai chi is definitely a good practice in my experience. Much potential. A complete mind - body - spirit practice in itself. Also see these videos on the zhan zhuang style of qigong. Both tai chi and zhan zhuang can be a life long practice with potentially no limit on what can be achieved. Zhan Zhuang: http://www.youtube.com/user/StandStillBeFit/videos The guy doing these videos has some books on his zhan zhuang practice as well. Whether you practice tai chi or zhan zhuang or both, my advice would be to keep it as relaxed and natural as you can. What do I mean by natural? It means no attempt to control anything or deliberately move energy or to deliberately breath in a certain way, etc. You relax as much as you can and allow progress to occur naturally, without any interference or attempt to direct or control your breath or energy on your part. Mind is relaxed and body is relaxed. Breath is relaxed and natural. This is the way to proceed. Natural. Sometimes referred to as dao. Best wishes in your practice.

I see. If you are progressing so far with no major issues then I guess this can't be so bad. I appreciate your comments on internal alchemy...

Charles Luk (Lu Kuan Yu) was actually just the translator, and he also added lots of useful clarification notes to his translation. There are few books in English that go into much detail about authentic internal alchemy practice. The original book which Charles Luk translated was written by Zhao Bichen in Chinese, and was originally entitled something along the lines of "The secrets of Cultivating Essential Nature and Eternal Life". The book was probably not written to try to appeal to the general population, but was probably meant as as an overview and guide for people seriously interested in pursuing internal alchemy meditation. I doubt this book was ever intended as a complete guide to practicing on your own however, but meant more as an overview of the practices and teaching approach so a potential student had something to judge by when trying to find an authentic teacher. The author, Zhao Bichen stated in this book that he himself encountered some fake teachers when he was looking for a teacher, and his book may be used as a guide to give an idea what authentic teachings on internal alchmemy would entail. I think most people with internal alchemy experience would agree that authentic internal alchemy training requires a good teacher. Also, there are different branches and lineages in internal alchemy, so not all lineages will be teaching practices similar as are described in this particular book. Edit: For a little more about Zhao Bichen and his teachers and lineage, see this web page (thanks to Adept for originally posting the link): http://chanbuddhismuk.proboards.com/thread/511

Hi Marblehead, sorry, just couldn't resist ribbing you a little bit. Edit: "Using this knowledge, I would be more justified believing in the Tooth Fairy than believing in some god. Atheism is a non-belief. I do not believe gods exist. There is not one single drop of proof that any exist." While technically atheism can be just about not having a belief about God, in practice many atheists do seem to insist that there is no such thing as God (a belief that God does not exist) which can only be blind faith, since it can't be proven that God does not exist. It is also not reasonable to say God can't exist because I don't see physical evidence of God here on Earth, because God is not supposed to be viewable from Earth, but that is diverging from the topic of this thread, so I will leave it there.

When in doubt, consult the dictionary. be-lief - noun 1. an acceptance that a statement is true or that something exists. "his belief in the value of hard work" 2. something one accepts as true or real; a firmly held opinion or conviction. "contrary to popular belief, Aramaic is a living language" So, anything a person holds to be true is a belief. Related to this, blind belief or blind faith is where a person believes in something in which there is no real demonstrable proof or demonstrable supporting evidence. For example atheism is a form of blind belief, as you simply cannot prove or demonstrate the non-existence of something like God, which is not supposed to have form (at least not normally) in our physical dimensions. Actually you simply can't prove non-existence at all. Therefore to insist that something doesn't exist such as God, is clearly a form of blind belief or blind faith.

Hi Exorcist_1699. I am wondering, what is your experience with internal alchemy practice? Are you practicing under a teacher, or have you just learned from books and writings?

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Because they do not contend, there is no one to contend with.

Some people here seem to be trying to compare apples and oranges, and then judge or come to conclusions based on their personal preference of apples versus oranges. Qiu Chuji appears to be speaking from practical personal experience. Some others appear to be trying compare practical personal experience to intellectual concepts which appear to make 'sense' to them, and to which they personally hold dear. Personal and practical experience is personal and practical experience. It is what it is. There is no requirement for it to make sense on an intellectual level in regards to such concepts as are being discussed here. This is where so many people in these modern times seem to get tripped up.

Thanks for the interesting comments. I was not however speaking of dao as some 'thing' that is, if that helps at all. ("it is not dao"). Think more in the context of 'the way'. I think it can help if people keep in mind that this type of expression of personal experience is usually going to be very context oriented. I was attempting to express a personal experiential state, which I found quite difficult to express very meaningfully in words. There is an intended outer or surface meaning in what I wrote, and the words and sentences were chosen so as to try to convey that certain surface meaning, but the surface meaning was written with the intention of pointing towards a 'deeper' meaning in regards to a personal experiential state which I wanted to try to express, but which I think just can't be directly expressed very well at all in words and sentences without causing misunderstanding at least to some degree. I think the more directly I would try to express this in words, the more likely it would be that the meaning would be even further misconstrued than otherwise, while the more indirectly the experience is written about the less likely for others to get hung up on a particular surface meaning which they may personally see conveyed by the words. The sentences and wording were chosen with the intent to try to make it clear that the surface meaning was not the full intended meaning. It seems I may not have done a very good job of it. When I mentioned that assuming and knowing, etc., are not dao, it seems it was overlooked, but such statements were worded to try to give better context to what I was trying to express. When trying to express something which involves personal experience in an area in which there are not really adequate words to describe the fullness and subtleties of the experience, I don't know if there is any better way to try to express the experience. It is not like writing about experiences such as 'happy' or 'sad', in which there is probably a fair degree of commonality amongst most people's experiences and understanding of such things, to get at least a fair idea of what you are talking about across to others. We have words for much of the more mundane and common things which may be experienced in a particular culture and environment, which can get the meaning across reasonably well for these areas of common experience, but for things which may not be so much a part of everyone's common experience, then words and sentences can be more of a hindrance than a help. It should maybe not be so hard to understand why there can be so much misunderstanding about any writings on certain types of personal experience then, I think. So then, what was I really trying to get at? I could try to express it more directly than I did, but I don't think it would be helpful, and might well cause even further misinterpretation. Imagine now writings such as the dao de jing or on chan/zen buddhism etc. in which certain types of experience were being written about in which there are really no words or sentences at all in common language which can really convey to any extent the types of deep and profound experience being discussed. That there will be much misunderstanding of the intended deeper meaning would have to be pretty much a given, but it can maybe still be written in such a way that the surface meaning still conveys at least some degree of meaning in regards to what is being expressed, although even that may still be misunderstood by many people coming from different backgrounds and points of view and with different assumptions and opinions. I think it helps to try to put assumptions and 'knowledge' aside as much as possible and to at least make an attempt to try to understand the context better before even beginning to try to dig deeper into the intended meaning. However, without at least some degree of common experiential base of some sort to compare and relate to, in my opinion we will likely be grasping around pretty much in the complete dark in trying to relate to what is being said.

Hi PLB. I personally don't take anything by any particular teacher as if it were written in stone, as of course much of the stuff said or written about tai chi can be a bit obscure or open to varying interpretations, and different teachers do often seem to differ somewhat in what they emphasize and in their point of view. I did see something in one of the 'songs' of tai chi about keeping awareness of dantian, but not sure off hand who that particular song of tai chi is attributed to. Anyway, Fu Zhongwen was a very notable student of Yang Chengfu and was known for his own high skills in tai chi, so his views about tai chi should probably not be taken lightly in regards to Yang ChengFu's style of tai chi anyway. Also Fu Zhongwen's style of tai chi is probably about as authentic Yang Chengfu style as you can get since Fu Zhongwen says he made no attempt to change his tai chi from the way he learned it from Yang Chengfu. Regarding the length of the tai chi set, Fu Zhongwen seems to be of the view that practicing tai chi too slow is not beneficial, but yes, maybe the higher the level you are the slower you can go without restricting or hindering your qi and blood circulation. Anyway, I think it is always interesting to hear or read comments from a master on different aspects of their art. If statements by different masters didn't cause at least some confusion amongst students, then it wouldn't be internal martial arts.