Vajrahridaya

Lino, Only relatively is there no separation due to interconnection, but without compassion, you will be a victim of this perceived "trojan" as a trojan does not inherently exist, but only relative to your experience. As all beings do. ralis, You relatively exist as a reminder for me to be patient, and I relatively exist to you as a thorn in your foot. In general, Without compassion there will be the feeling of being a victim and the world will reflect that, like a big and empty (not in the Buddhist sense) black hole. If you have compassion, then you will see through the others eyes and will not suffer as you will see right through the experience, thus it will be empty of it's power of bondage and full of infinite potential instead of some seemingly inherently negative experience. Everything is relative.

Oh! 3bob, by the way... Om right back at cha! :lol: Thanks for being nice to this seeker.

Mutual co-origination... not independent origination. See this statement above seems vague to me, unless I think of it within Buddhist terms, then it makes sense. But that's just me. I think I understand more of what apepch7 said some time ago in this thread and I agree with him that it is not in the ultimate sense, but only in the relative sense, which is an ultimate insight rather than an ultimate essence. But, to say that "Tao follows it's own nature" seems to be very much in contrast to the Buddhas statements' saying that there is not 1 thing nor is there many things, nor is there a non-thing that has it's own nature, neither relative, nor ultimate, and there is not even an infinite thing or non-thing that has it's own nature... according to my spiritual tradition which when you enter this website say's it's ok to talk about. Disclaimer: Do I have to be a new age monist universalist to be here? (please think about the meaning of those terms) Or is it ok to be a Buddhist but open minded individual to be here, no matter how wrong some of the general public think it is to be so? I, personally... really don't mind opposing views and being debated with, without personal attacks. As long as the point is argued, not the person. Attack my belief, intelligently... fine... yes!!

I don't know if it's unconsciously or consciously , as I don't know you personally, nor do I know how you personally internalize concepts. But in Buddhas wisdom which I agree with, everything doesn't come from one transcendent beyond time, name and form. This is why he came to the insight of dependent origination even after having the experience of neither perception nor non-perception which it seems you are talking about as being the source of all things. This would mean independent origination, not dependent origination and not the insight of infinite regress without a leg to stand on. You seem to be taking silence as a source, or the common denominator of everything? I know this experience quite well and used to agree with this very deeply. This is why coming to the Buddhas wisdom was very difficult for me as I believed very deeply and on an experiential level in the wisdom of the Vedas. The mind does not inherently exist, only relatively, so even the insight of Buddhahood is relative and does not inherently exist or transcend anything. This is why I don't feel that the standing in oblivion in Taoism or Zen is equal with the Apophatic prayer as they are still considering an ineffable source in the same way the Upanishads say "neti-neti" or "not-this and not that" in reference to God. They are still saying that which is neither perception nor non-perception is the source of all existence while Zen is not. So you see... what I'm saying is actually quite in line with what the topic is.

Oh I know... I've had both and cats are definitely more moody than dogs, like almost schizophrenic! I think it's just because they are super sensitive to outside stimuli on an extra sensory level while dogs can sometimes be quite clueless and goofy,

The Buddha has a different interpretation of Om from Hinduism. The experience of Om as it arises in meditation is from the experience of inter-connectivity and it's endless awesomeness leading to the experience of still "aaaaaaaahhhhh" even without utterance, so called beyond time. But to take the experience as a supreme source of all things is not recognizing it's emptiness or non-inherent existence and is merely falling into the formless realms and calling this ultimate. The experience of silence also arises dependently and is not independent. There is no non-phenomena that transcends everything. In Buddhism, everything is a phenomena, thus nothing is taken refuge in, except this insight. Buddha doesn't take refuge in the mind, but takes refuge in the fact that mind arises interdependently and is empty of self existence. Thus all experiences had by the mind, even in exalted states of "roaring silence" are also empty of inherent existence and arise dependently, thus is not an ultimate source of existence as if an independently existing source. So, to see silence as a Self of all, the oblivion of the roots of ego is not realized. Your interpretation above is quite Vedic, which the Buddha denied as leading to Buddhahood. Though it's a nice interpretation which leads to higher states of conditioned consciousness, it doesn't uncompound and free one ultimately, as emptiness is not recognized.

All I know is that Lama Zopa is great!

I want to go to Love Island!! :lol:

No, probably not... but, dog's are moody as well.

One of my favorite yogi's.

A person is indifferent out of fear of connecting or fear of vulnerability, fear of feeling... etc.

Thank you... yes, I had to uphold the practice of awareness in places all over Harlem, Jamaica; Queens and Bedstuy; Brooklyn as I lived in these places during various times. Not to mention Oakland, Cali which is actually even more intense in the negative sense than anything NYC has to offer as there is much less police presence getting in the way of violent crime. So, just going to the store was an inner battle in maintaining light, peace and goodness within and cloaking it around those that do indeed have extra sensory perception. Whew...

Though, as a disclaimer. I do respect Meister Eckhart very deeply, but I still feel that his wisdom comes from the experiences associated with the formless realms of samadhi or jhana and thus is not complete insight into the how and the why of everything. Explanation of the formless states of meditation: "The Arupa Jhānas Beyond the four jhānas lie four attainments, referred to in the early texts as aruppas. These are also referred to in commentarial literature as immaterial/the formless jhānas (arūpajhānas), also translated as The Formless Dimensions: 1. Dimension of Infinite Space - In the dimension of infinite space there are - "the perception of the dimension of the infinitude of space, unification of mind, contact, feeling, perception, intention, consciousness, desire, decision, persistence, mindfulness, equanimity, & attention" 2. Dimension of Infinite Consciousness - In the Dimension of infinite consciousness there is "the perception of the dimension of the infinitude of consciousness, unification of mind, contact, feeling, perception, intention, consciousness, desire, decision, persistence, mindfulness, equanimity, & attention" 3. Dimension of Nothingness - In the dimension of nothingness, there is "the perception of the dimension of nothingness, singleness of mind, contact, feeling, perception, intention, consciousness, desire, decision, persistence, mindfulness, equanimity, & attention" 4. Dimension of Neither Perception nor Non-Perception - About the role of this jhana it is said: "He emerged mindfully from that attainment. On emerging mindfully from that attainment, he regarded the past qualities that had ceased & changed: 'So this is how these qualities, not having been, come into play. Having been, they vanish.' He remained unattracted & unrepelled with regard to those qualities, independent, detached, released, dissociated, with an awareness rid of barriers. He discerned that 'There is a further escape,' and pursuing it there really was for him."[11]" You can see that all of Meister Eckharts poetry aligns quite nicely with these attainments of nothingness and infinite consciousness, but it does not yet see dependent origination as he associates these deep formless states as a source, or Self of all. Thus he is still seeing independent origination, that all things come from an independent and ineffable source. Ineffable: 1. Too great or extreme to be expressed or described in words. 2. Too sacred to be uttered. He very well teaches the platform for benefiting the 4 immeasurables though which is very, very good; "The sublime attitudes (brahmavihāra) are a series of four virtues and Buddhist meditation practices designed to cultivate those virtues. They are also known as the four "immeasurables" (Sanskrit: apramāṇa).[1] According to the Metta Sutta, Shākyamuni Buddha held that cultivation of the four immeasurables has the power to cause the practitioner to be re-born into a Brahma realm (Pāli: Brahmaloka)[A realm where one still has blissful belief in a prime origin, will, source or God of all].[2] The meditator is instructed to radiate out to all beings in all directions the mental states of: 1) loving-kindness or benevolence, 2) compassion, 3) sympathetic joy, and, 4) equanimity. The four immeasurables are also found in Patañjali's Yoga Sutras (1.33),[3] a text composed long after the beginning of Buddhism and substantially influenced by Buddhism.[4][5] These virtues are also highly regarded by Buddhists as powerful antidotes to negative mental states (non-virtues) such as avarice, anger and pride."

Indeed, ignorance may be blissful, but it's not the bliss of liberation which sees through all knowledge through actually seeing it directly and thoroughly. This is a nice image and I've definitely had this image plenty of times. Many times in NYC, shooting my energy down towards the center of the Earth was my only way of over coming many walking demons on NYC subways and streets who mistook my light for inocense. So... had ta show dem a ting a 2 bout grounding power. At the same time, the Earth does not come from itself, so this too is not the end all be all and finding a comfort zone here is thus also not the path to complete liberation. Though this view you have imaged is definitely a way on the path. Buddhism sees right through the Earth and grounds itself here quite well while seeing through it's impermanent nature. Our higher examples of this take conscious rebirth here again and again in order to show the way of how to properly be here, without being attached to Earth as some sort of ultimate nature. The Earth comes from the Sun and this sun comes from this galaxy and this galaxy comes from the universe and this universe comes from the multi-verse of the cosmos and this cosmos comes from the previous cosmos... so on and so forth add infinitum. so to take up Earth as an ultimate refuge would not be a reflection of full awareness.

Oh yes, the current Poop head of the Catholic Church. Yes, I've read everything available from Meister Eckhart... well, that's available in English at least.

I like bikes and skateboards, but without my computer!? Uh oh! Of course we can run cars on electricity empowered by wind sources and thus computers too... sooo... why do we need so much oil?

Yes, but we sometimes think that what makes us feel really great inside is the wisdom and we get attached to this idea, so it's always good to continually look higher and we do have examples of what we can evolve more towards, in the most non-dualistic sense of that statement. I don't recall if I have. But that's awesome! I have the same occurrence. I remember things that someone in my past has said that really made an indelible impression on my mind. I like it when they are more towards the positive impressions... eh? Oh yeah... I think my stepmom used to watch this, she's Chinese. EDIT: That's so funny... it's like he's a sports commentator and massage teacher for a coroner.

Yes, if you can't love the trojan then it will remain a trojan out of a reflection of your own inability to de-condition love. Love offers, the opposite does not. EDIT: In case.. the opposite of love is fear.

Well... Buddhism doesn't aim for union in the same sense as most traditions consider. Only the union of method and wisdom, or insight and action... not union with an inherent existence of all. Buddhas cut through "that" and empty "that" of the potential for absorption. Basically, "that" is the pull of the unconscious mystery that underlies all our conditional joy's and suffering and to merge with that mystery as a primordial self or primordial nature of all that is or is not, is a high goal, but not Buddhahood. Disclaimer: This is according to the Buddhist teachings from Pali Suttas on as well as my own direct experience based on insight drawn from meditation and contemplation. :lol: It's funny that I feel like I have to put this in order that the overly sensitive may feel a sense of justice. But, compassion is an offering of compromise from the intention of selfless service. "I come in peace," said the alien.

The Buddha knew when he entered the 4th jhana at death which is connected to the celestial manifest realm of peerless devas from where he could still enact the Sambhogakaya, or the enjoyment body of energetic teaching for those available to that level.

His teachings didn't come from that, they came from transcending all classes and seeing all connectivity; inter-dependency. It seems to me that your issue is that you are still seeing separation where none inherently exists. You need to open up and accept this "trojan" as part of the vastness of experiencing and expand your awareness into constant rotation of acceptance and giving; mutual co-origination. Don't contract so much, but rather open up more and see the infinite nature of everything without fear, hiding or pushing away. That black hole that sucks will become an endless well of offering.

Only if you're doing it wrong, otherwise the opposite is true and there are endless testimonies to that. Including my own mother who's been doing yoga for well over 40 years, maybe more like 45 years. She's a lively, healthy and vibrant women with tons of juice, power and muscle in a petite frame! EDIT: What I mean by wrong is, if you are opening up your chakras through yoga then doing other things not conducive to the 8 fold path of righteous living as talked about by the Buddha?

Thus there is no absolute self, only relative.

Ain't that the truth!

Yes, that is a nice sentiment. But, also in a sense, we actually are attaining liberation from an "it", our ignorance. At the same time, what you said works in the Dzogchen sense when the experiencer and experiences are self liberated in the cognition of the fact that indeed, everything is free as it is, as all is inherently empty of independent self existence, so free, fluid and without hindrance. Yes my Buddha-Buddhy... I've read this. Very nice! Any symbol can reflect the wisdom you wish you perceive if you want to, as anything is self liberated as it is and without boundaries. It's just about right view applied to all aspects of perception. So, I to appreciate the symbols present in other traditions. Please don't walk into walls as you still have to re-become for the next moment in the practical sense, but without craving and with selfless intention is all.