Vajrahridaya

For your particular bag of karmas, that is quite obvious. I've known that for 2 years now ralis. I'm just dandy like a lion in the meadow with that...

"pleads the 5th"

Well... it's said that words can bring one to enlightenment if formatted perfectly for any one persons karmic resonance, as words are symbols of experience at best. Of course this is going to be difficult in this medium, partially because there is no real body energy connection as done in physical presence and because so many different karmic baggages are reading the statements to begin with, so, only a few will get what I am relating even from merely an intellectual standpoint. Plus... I'm merely a practitioner on the path and not a full blow realizer. Merely glimpse happy. I am happy to learn from a fellow Dzogchenpa! Yes, I find that the teachings of Longchenpa if one can get a hold of them... is all "I" really need. Well, that and transmission from a genuine Dzogchen master. Pleasure to see a bird of your type fly this region!

This is true. Which is why in the Buddhist tradition, debate is given place as a practice, not as a waste of time. One can actually become more enlightened through debate. Even while typing here online. The ability to attain enlightenment is available anywhere and everywhere under any circumstance if the inner primary conditions of "view" are ripe and juicy.

Yes, I didn't mean it to blow up. I just wanted to comment on a link which I felt leads to confused commentary on Buddhist "jargon". I also appologize!

Muktananda said that you have to transcend being a Swami too. Plus all these cars and jets were gifts from wealthy practitioners who just gave things and wanted him to be comfortable, he refused many of the gifts and at many times just received, then offered them to someone else. I remember when they were building his private rooms at various Ashrams he made them change the plans because they were making his rooms too ostentatious while he just wanted a simple room. Plus this secret entrance they talk about in the Ganeshpuri Ashram is a joke as his room was surrounded by the meditation cave. Also the sex practices were a part of his liberation experience as when you reach a certain level you are supposed to in many cases, not all, but in many cases take up a karma mudra in order to blend energies and ground enlightenment even more. All his "secret" stuff is in various Goddess tradition scriptures of Hindu lineage, arguably integrated from Buddhist Tantra... but that's another debate. There is also a practice where one receives nourishment and can elongate ones life through sexual contact with a very young women if an enlightened being is aging or almost finished his body karma. This as well is spoken about in various secret yogic texts in the Trika tradition of Kashmir and also South Indian Siddhar traditions, as well as Buddhist Tantric texts of antiquity. All these leaving Siddha Yoga sites really reflect peoples lack of education in the traditions of India and the power of ego projection than anything else. People have no idea how subtle Muktananda was (man was he deeply powerful) and most puritanical ideas around enlightenment keep people judging his life which was exemplary. Of course, he did these practices in secret due to the fact that most people would just not understand and be confused, which is exactly what happened. But, having liberation, wealth and health are the 3 goals here on Earth. He satisfied all of them, well from a Buddhist perspective he didn't fully realize Liberation, but he did according to his tradition, having merged all his activities into the Nirvikalpa state of awareness realizing Sahaja Samadhi. If any of you have the blue light experience, you know what I'm talking about. Buddhist Tantra considers this the light of the pure awareness of infinite space and not cosmic consciousness or the source. But that again is another debate. For those of you that commented on her... All that junk food for the brain online about Gurumayi too is a total put off, like those magazines at the check out in the grocery store. She is so highly realized and deeply powerful of a Siddha in the Shaivite tradition... forget about it. If you get nothing from her, that's just your karma, you don't have a connection to that lineage or path. Plus she never had a face lift.. wow! She has all the signs of menopause including slightly drooping cheeks. Anyway... end rant.

Cut and paste is a patience gathering gift of modern technology... yes! Yes, it's a Buddha interpretation. What it means is that my Hindu Guru takes up the experience of non-duality as a source of all existence, rather than merely an insight. She doesn't understand emptiness or dependent origination, so doesn't have the "view" that liberates. For her, the entire cosmos arises out of this non-dual experience and will go back to, so her and along with all those that believe this will be re-absorbed at the end of the cosmic eon and liberation from Samsara as defined by a Buddha (awake one) is not attained. Though this state does have lots of bliss and powers of perception, etc. It is not the state of Buddhahood, but rather just being trapped in a formless Samadhi integrated with all matter through assumption or experiential excuse. This is deeply subtle, the difference between Monism (the belief in "one" that manifests the all) and Buddhism (the awake view that cuts through all pit stops). Basically this is why my Hindu lineage that I was born into has an incorrect view, simply because they take up a view as ultimate. What makes the Buddhist view as "right view" is that it's a viewless view and the only tradition that teaches the viewless view with clarity. I'm not saying an individual can't come to this insight by themselves. But as far as a tradition goes... Buddhism is the only one that really teaches this viewless view which never takes one view or the other as ultimate. The End Game of Buddhahood just means that you have direct insight into all the states of awareness and experiences possible, but also manifest the 3 kayas (3 bodies), the body of emptiness which is really just the direct and constant insight into the empty nature and interconnectedness of all phenomena and ones awareness becomes all pervasive or omnipresent as the Dharmakaya, then the enjoyment body made of the energy of this realization of emptiness which is deep and free bliss known as the Sambhogakaya, and the body of expression which is utilized as a teaching body for those caught up in density is the Nirmanakaya. Though highly realized yogi's can get teachings directly from the enjoyment body of a Buddha, the Nirmanakaya is for the general public that has to see a dude or a lady in front of them who is a living example of the insight of Dharmakaya. So as a full blown Buddha, you are free (through realization of Dharmakaya), blissful (Ones energy is unlocked as Sambhogakaya), and you teach (Through the physical as Nirmanakaya). Through the realization of Dharmakaya, you are not re-absorbed at the end of a cosmic eon during the "big crunch" the opposite of the big bang. Clarity is pristine cognition into the nature of things. As in... you know directly how things work, including ones own mind and awareness. Mis-cognition would be a lack of clarity or seeing with confusion. Please do take your time. Living happily is a goal, but to always live happily and not die ignorant of the nature of death and not be re-born unconsciously through darkness is what it's about. Ones inner potential is completely illuminated and basically there is no more unconscious realm anymore, nor is there a subconscious realm for the enlightened. It's all illuminated. You are aware of where you are going when you die and you are happy when you die and you know in what realm you will take re-birth in and how you will take re-birth and you have clear intentions that are not muddled by selfish desire anymore, even though you still fully enjoy what comes including food, a wife, whatever... it all serves the greater good. Basically you have a certain type of omniscience into the nature of your own personal existence that transcends merely being happy in this life. So... enlightenment in Buddhism is always being happy, no matter where you travel to, and you are aware of what's happening, totally and fully, while fully enjoying what's happening as well. Even if you were to go to jail or something. Though generally this doesn't happen to Buddhas as they've purified their karma, but you never know... they would turn it into an opportunity to teach jail birds how to fly free while in the cage. :lol: Yes indeed! Thank you for the opportunity. I hope your enjoyed your tea!

In Buddhism, enlightenment is not an experience, but rather insight into all experience and how it all works, leaving one free, as a direct experiencing. If you'd actually read some Buddhism, like the explanation of the Jhanas/samadhi's, you would see that there is outlined different depths to the wooowwie experience and yogi's with merit in meditation can attest to these truths. Enlightenment in Buddhist tradition is quite specific and not merely a woowwie experience. It's not that Buddhists have a monopoly, it's just that Buddhism does in our era have the clearest system and methodology of approach. The Buddha was the first one to really systemize the path with so many variables for different types of people with a full on clear cosmology without the need for human or animal sacrifice... kind of new at the time. Sure there were extreme forrest yogi's and probably as such all over the world. He even said there were those that attained Buddhahood alone and they are called Pratyekabuddhas, but they don't teach, so no one generally knows about these ones. Shakyamuni Buddha was a Samyakasambuddha or a wheel turning Buddha who teaches a specific path of Buddhadharma with all it's variables, when no one else knows how in order to teach others how. Most other Buddhas are Savakabuddha or ones who attain by hearing of the Buddhadharma. People don't realize how much the Buddhas teachings actually inspired so many other spiritual traditions to clarity. Of course Taoism has it's own approach, but most of the really enlightening traditions are quite secret. Most people are only aware of folk Taoism or martial Taoism or the Tao as an all pervasive essence of things. This just wouldn't hold up to "Awake" (Buddha) criticism. Anyway... here's an explanation. Jhana via Wiki Jhāna (Pāli: झन; Sanskrit: ध्यान dhyāna) is a meditative state of profound stillness and concentration. It is discussed in the Pāli canon (and the parallel agamas) and post-canonical Theravāda Buddhist literature. In the early texts, it is taught as a state of collected, full-body awareness in which mind becomes very powerful and still but not frozen, and is thus able to observe and gain insight into the changing flow of experience.[1][2] Later Theravada literature, in particular the Visuddhimagga, describes it as an abiding in which the mind becomes fully immersed and absorbed in the chosen object of attention,[3] characterized by non-dual consciousness.[4] The Buddha himself entered jhāna, as described in the early texts, during his own quest for enlightenment, and is constantly seen in the suttas encouraging his disciples to develop jhāna as a way of achieving awakening and liberation.[5][6][7] One key innovative teaching of the Buddha was that meditative absorption must be combined with liberating cognition.[8] Just before his passing away, The Buddha entered the jhānas in direct and reverse order, and the passing away itself took place after rising from the fourth jhāna.[9] The Buddha's most well-known instructions on attaining jhana are via mindfulness of breathing, found in the Ānāpānasati Sutta and elsewhere.

I had fun reading your post Mikaelz. Nice wit! You'd be a fun teacher when it comes time. (Not that your post wasn't already a good teaching, but you know what I mean) Thanks for the compliment as well. Happy Mahamudraing!

That is true, like the Alchemical Siddhas. Sattva means pure, rajas means action and tamas means darkness. This is translated in different ways, sometimes as light, dim and dark. The 3 gunas takes different connotations in different contexts. Basically all of our universe is made of these 3 qualities, yes. Yes, these are generally only partaken with during a ceremony where various deities are called upon as well as the inner state of Rigpa, or illumination. For those that don't know... Ida is the fire side or sun side of the central channel and pingala is the moon or cool side. Sushumna is the central channel where kundalini or the winds (prana) stills. Yes, these similar descriptions exist in Vajrayana which is originally Indian Tantric Buddhism but was moved to Tibet soon before the Muslims invaded India and destroyed most of Buddhism in India giving space for Hinduism, mostly the Hinduism of Shankaracharya to become the dominant religion of India again. Before this Buddhism was the dominant religion of India for 1,000 years.

The Buddha said, "I am awake". He was the first in our eon to really define enlightenment with many descriptions in order that different perspectives could be had on the phenomena.

You are right... the questions should have been fielded outside. But... alas, mutability. I first posted here because someone posted a link that confused Buddhism entirely... so I was offering a correction of perspective. I didn't mean it to become an overblown debate. Actually my first post was on the subject directly. So my second post was an offering of a correct view on the Buddhist terms being used that were being abused.

He actually realized through samatha which is slightly open eyed for the sake of integration. Also through Vipassana which is a walking meditation where one consciously integrates the contemplation of right view, "dependent origination" with all processes of the body. It still sounds like you take up silence as a oneness of all. The Buddha said, "I am awake" thus the name Buddha which means awake. The conditions for bondage are formless. It does sound like you take silence as a substratum and source of all. All full blown Buddhas got guidance because this is what grounds the pristine cognition of dependently originated phenomena and not-self. One doesn't fully realize without transmission of some sort from realized lineage, either while in the physical or not. There is no self existing source of enlightenment. Even enlightenment arises dependently. There are stages of Buddhahood or types of Buddhahood where one realizes on ones own, but these beings don't teach properly as the conditions for this expression have not been accumulated. But, they still see directly the 4 marks. Anicca (Sanskrit anitya) "inconstancy" or "impermanence". This refers to the fact that all conditioned things (sankhara) are in a constant state of flux. In reality there is no thing that ultimately ceases to exist; only the appearance of a thing ceases as it changes from one form to another. Imagine a leaf that falls to the ground and decomposes. While the appearance and relative existence of the leaf ceases, the components that formed the leaf become particulate material that may go on to form new plants. Buddhism teaches a middle way, avoiding the extreme views of eternalism and nihilism.[2] Dukkha (Sanskrit duhkha) or dissatisfaction (or "dis-ease"; also often translated "suffering", though this is somewhat misleading). Nothing found in the physical world or even the psychological realm can bring lasting deep satisfaction. Anatta (Sanskrit anatman) or "non-Self" is used in the suttas both as a noun and as a predicative adjective to denote that phenomena are not, or are without, a permanent self, to describe any and all composite, consubstantial, phenomenal and temporal things, from the macrocosmic to microcosmic, be it matter pertaining to the physical body or the cosmos at large, as well as any and all mental machinations, which are impermanent. Nirvana is peace. Nirvana (blown out) is the "other shore" from samsara. Thank you CarsonZi... very much! I did enjoy the mango curry. It was delicious! Blessings!

Man it was good! It really only take purifying the cognitive process, or intuition if you prefer. Yes a process of purification naturally occurs if one is working towards the constant liberation. No, it's the condition of correct cognition of conditioned phenomena, then awareness is free, arising due to the condition of insight... all empty of inherent reality due to arising dependently. Oh ok... yes. Past, present and future all are transparent and non-inherent. One finds liberation from the now as well, in the now of course. Ah language and metaphors. No, this is where Buddhas view differs. We are not everything, our mind stream is individual and unique and we have all experienced a unique type of infinity and beginninglessness. In Buddhism, we are not one, we are only connected. Right view is vastly important to realize Buddhahood. It doesn't seem that you have right view, just refuge in the non-conceptual.

You are taking the non-conceptual as a refuge here. What is the reality of what is? It will always be through the condition of seeing inter-dependent origination/emptiness directly. How is time not a relative reality? This doesn't lead to liberation. Liberation is specific as Buddhahood. One must take up right view. You are taking up this non-dual experience as an absolute truth of things and not respecting how important the relative is. Non-dual in Buddhism means the non-separation of the non-dual and dual as well as the lack of inherent existence. Thus, not one, not two. Neither does the flow of phenomena and concepts. Yes, but there is no absolute reality either. It seems you are taking up a fundamental view here. You are taking refuge in the non-conceptual as the truth of things. Your experience of a formless peace is just a state where the aggregates are repressed or at rest for a while, thus the experience of no-sound and concepts arises due to this condition. Self liberated, but not liberation as a self. Unless one is speaking relatively. Blessings...

There is no inherent reality... only relative reality. What is this grace you speak of? In Buddhism the only grace known is the influence of enlightened beings. Otherwise there is only our effort and the blessings of enlightened beings. Relatively speaking, I do deserve this. Living as Reality? It can be. Yes, you are mistaken. There are plenty of places in the Suttas and Sutras where he talks about the afterlife, past lives, different realms and dimensions one can go to and experience directly through meditation and insight. He wasn't limited to perception through the 5 senses. Simple is complex and complex is simple. One shouldn't take refuge in silence, as this could be an obstacle and a suppression of various important experiences that may need to arise. But, silence is necessary in practice, yes. One would be hard pressed, although there are examples where one who has the capacity to do something when ones family is being robbed but doesn't due to a concept of non-violence is actually performing a violence out of fear and/or attachment.

No you are not. All that you said is very true. But it's not absolutely necessary for liberation, though it can truly challenge and help one go beyond limitations. We practice this in Dzogchen in the Ganapuja but we just eat meat, considering the animals karma represented as the flesh of the animal as being integrated with our own so that when we realize liberation that they may also have a connection to us. Animals find it hard to evolve out of being an animal without help due to their capacity as an animal. Chogyal Namkhai Norbu Rinpoche talks about this stuff in Crystal and the Way of Light.

Sure, but even non-conceptual is a concept and arises dependently and is not an independent phenomena as well. So, zero point experience happens due to the fact of multiplicity, this is interdependent. Concepts and no-concepts... it's all phenomena. There is no substratum of refuge. Only insight into the nature of things is refuge, even insight into self reference and seeing that as originating dependently. I re-wrote what I wrote a bit for more clarity above. So you might want to re-read it. Like I edited into the above. Emptiness doesn't mean nothingness. It doesn't mean empty like in a jar. It just means non-static existence basically it's the key to understanding how movement works and how relativity is.

If you take refuge in the triple gem, you are a practicing Buddhist, or a Buddha.

All phenomena are interdependent, not just concepts, but also the mind and all the different minds are all interdependent and without inherent essence. What you said about Taoism depends on the type of Taoism as some Taoism thinks of the Tao as a static and unchanging source behind all phenomena. Buddha would criticize this view as Samsaric. Even the Dharmakaya or Tathagatagarbha in Buddhism does not have inherent existence and is basically the experience of insight into inter-dependent origination, so is not an independent source of things. These are describing the insight of emptiness not an inherent essence. No, emptiness is not a substratum. It's the quality of all phenomena, so emptiness does not inherently exist either since it's the quality of phenomena that don't inherently exist. This leads to a subtler clarity than the belief in ones experience is a substratum. This also leads to an entirely different way of seeing how the universe works and cycles and what is necessary for constant liberation beyond the unconscious cycling of the masses. As in, one wouldn't take refuge in an experience of formless bliss in meditation calling this the universal Self of all beyond subject and object. One would understand that this is just a state of altered consciousness and not a substratum. Even Zero is empty of inherent existence. Emptiness doesn't mean zero. It doesn't mean nothingness. It means malleable, and non-inherency. Though one can have the meditative experience of zero and this experience arises dependently as well. The realization and luminosity of realization goes deeper than this experience of zero point energy, which arises dependent upon the fact that all things are empty, and that the awareness of mind can focus. Awareness can focus or waver because awareness is not static and unchanging either and arises dependently. It's tough to think about this through concepts as one should have a direct intuitive experience and one can have this without closing ones eyes. As one experiences more deeply the insight of inter-dependent origination/emptiness, the easier it is to understand the logic of it.

I see the opinions and other perspectives. I just don't agree with all of them and debate that. Debate has a long history in Buddhism starting with the Buddha. It works to refine the view and diminish the ego. For instance, you are reacting here and you feel offended, creating violence. There is no need. One can disagree without resorting to such things. No, I experience that the Buddha is right and those that agree with Buddhas are also right. If you want liberation from Samsaric experience that is. The Buddha did not teach that there are many paths to Buddhahood, and he listed the reasons why in so many different ways. There are plenty of Suttas and Sutras that talk about this. Actually my view is not extreme. But Buddhism is a superior tradition, yes.

Most people only think that they have freed themselves from conditions, due to the condition of one level of experience or another. Thus the view of inter-dependent origination is a necessary insight, no matter what as it truly reveals the inherent emptiness of all arisings, including liberation. Maybe you do, maybe you don't. It's hard to tell sometimes through words alone as bondage is deeply formless. Liberation as well is a conditioned phenomena. So liberation must be emptied at it's basis as well to truly be liberation. I know it sounds like splitting hairs, but it's important as the seed of bondage is deeply subtle. We do that through meditation and chanting with mudra, etc. For integration. Still... to know how to manifest enlightenment for the sake of all is also a conditioned phenomena. If you are a self awakened one, truly free from self completely. Then you have omniscience into your personal cosmic history as you've emptied your storehouse consciousness. As in, if you haven't just pushed your seed of self grasping into a formless, concept-less light of bliss and you have transformed all your seeds of bondage into seeds of blessing, then you have realized the body, energy and mind of enlightenment and you will continuously manifest for beings the teachings of the great liberation. As Buddhahood is not just freedom from concepts. Just going inwards leads merely to absorption. One has to have an integrated approach, the middle path, otherwise one just alters the consciousness without cutting through. Hmmm... It's very rare, and generally if a being does attain the first type of cessation, they do come to the Buddhadharma eventually, in one name or another. I doubt those that say they are self awakened of their own accord, as they generally don't show real humility. Most of them are just stuck at a blissful pit stop. But, everyone is unique. Without guidance, it's very, very difficult and next to impossible as the roots of attachment are very deep and we are mostly blind. Generally one needs an objective opinion from someone without self grasping. That's it for now... I have to give the computer over to my wife and finish cooking the mango curry and veggies.

Goof!

A great realization to be is to be able to see the naturally liberated quality of all beings, even if they are throwing ice balls at cha.