Vajrahridaya

Yes indeed... I do recognize that possibility. I just want to make sure that this is the case though for Kate.

Yes, I know... The same arguments come up endlessly. Just our way of going about them changes as one evolves I suppose?

Clear as in one sees through phenomena and oneself clearly. The light of ones mind shines unimpeded by knotted identities, even infinite identities like Brahman. link... Luminous Mind

Who said I've reached Nirvana? Your sarcastic retorts at my arguments show what? Yes, I've delved into practice and have experience. I've written many poems reflecting many of these experiences. Like I said... it all depends upon the aptitude of the reader really. Some peoples expressions you will have a karmic connection with and others will bounce off of your karmic wall. The experience itself can only be alluded to through words. In the experience of course everything, and every word references the natural state though as well even if seemingly contradictory to it.

No, it's just two of you. Both of you seem to not contribute anything either... just bash. You seem to contribute a bit more than ralis though. I don't mind being arrogant towards both of you, though sometimes I take pleasure in being the opposite of you guys. Both of you do wrongly take my assuredness of understanding as arrogance. Why should I lie about what I feel is true? You don't try to lie about what you feel is true... you two follow me around and make sarcastic comments quite often. Both of you reveal quite immensely your lack of inner experience and contemplation at every turn.

Yes, I can describe emptiness, because emptiness in Buddhism is not a non-conceptual ground of being. Emptiness means interdependent origination. It means non-abiding self nature. It means all things are connected and malleable. Realization of this expands the mind luminously. This is not the same experience as Brahman.

Yes, I'm talking to ralis who say's he doesn't like Buddhism, but he wishes to practice Dzogchen by Namkhai Norbu Rinpoche. He is quite confused about what Dzogchen teaches which in essence is no different from what the Buddha taught. I'm talking to a particular person who has yet to show that he understands anything about Buddhism or Dzogchen but constantly wants to follow me around in a negative manor. I don't mind being arrogant to certain people. I don't feel any lack of peace in it. I get happy whenever I see a crack in his armor, in that good way.

I'm sure our mindstreams have met many times throughout endless re-births. The fact of the matter is that if you wish for the non-dual understanding as an ongoing life experience, then the above quote from me holds universally true. You are not intrinsically separate from anyone or anything, so why hold onto it? Why not use any opportunity to free yourself from the delusion of this comfort zone?

I've cited endless examples of many things here. So, this also is not true.

This is actually not true. The main practice is Guru Yoga. As well... plenty offer him the traditional white scarf in veneration of him and the lineage. We all do inner veneration of the Guru and lineage in the practices he teaches, which for me is more of a state of mind of deep respect. Plenty of students do 3 full pranams to him before even going up to meet him. If the pranams are sincere he reflects like wise. If they are just external show, you can see he just looks at them like, "what are you doing?... There's no need for this."

Strong ego clingings of empowered individuality, which can be both good and bad. It's one of the things that the Eastern mind set needs from the West, but the Western ego archetype as being strongly individual and independent needs to be balanced by the Eastern wisdom of interconnected egolessness. Because it can benefit the student and open the student up to receive. Also if a student focuses on the Guru in a state of veneration, these good qualities that the student sees in the Guru will naturally saturate the mind of the student through continual contemplation of these qualities. If veneration is not necessary for the student, or the student is doing it wrong or getting caught up in dualistic notions, the Guru will let the student know, or make the student go sit alone for example, in a cave, or these days... "just go home and read this"... offering something that is necessary. Veneration can actually be a key to enlightenment. Something the strong ego attachment of the Western mind set could learn a lot about. It's really just the ego that says... "I won't venerate him/her, they'll take advantage of me". It really comes from a deep sense of fear that masks itself in pride, or the idea that "I'm just being practical." The thing is, is that the goal of most Western paths are just not the same as the Eastern paths. Joseph Campbell was very interesting and many times correct in my opinion. But he makes a lot of assumptions, pulling little bits out of context and mushing the meanings together by skipping the particulars of the real meanings of the excerpts he took from the different traditions. This does not mean there are no genuine Western lineages that still lead to the same enlightenment as Vajrayana or I've heard there is a secret Taoist lineage that leads to Jalus... I don't know? But that would mean that they would teach the same thing in essence, even if the method is slightly different, the truth of the universe would be understood. It's just that particular methods lead to particular fruits. That's not what you are venerating, you are venerating the qualities of enlightenment that this person represents, basically the lack of ego. You understand that this person is a mirror for the highest realizations and is humble enough to talk with you about them and even share his/her energy with you and give you the tools of application necessary to make the same realizations of these universal truths the Guru lives as a mirror of. Sure, in a sense, but you are also venerating the specific accomplishments of the Guru which you yourself hope to imbibe from them through their teachings and their mind pointing through energy. Holding onto limited perspectives of yourself and others and ideas of intrinsic ego separateness from others and the world in general will never be one of them.

Yes, but not the same realization. Not necessarily, much also depends upon the aptitude of the reader.

Actually intrinsic existence in this case means concrete existence, as in absolute existence, which the Hindus feel is Brahman. For Buddhist interpretation of the experience and further letting go and for final liberation, one realizes the experience within the context of dependent arising, thereby erasing any idea that the clarity is self existent. It is self discerning because it is awareness that arises with the wisdom of dependent arising.... so it discerns itself as relative to all else.

Very good! I find bullies respond better to fearlessness. Also, no one is saying that ignorance is a Western invention. There are just certain archetypes that are prevalent in Western society and attachment to them causes limitations in perceiving Eastern born spiritual paths. Many Westerners expect traditions that are thousands of years old to change for their huge egos instantaneously. It's easier to just question oneself and loosen these archetypes a bit to even letting many of them go and evolve as these Eastern paths can and do bring enlightenment to anyone willing to be internally flexible. Meanwhile, the Eastern paths will automatically evolve over time to suit the new needs of the world as the enlightened teachers of these paths more and more include people born in the West.

It's Amazing! Tulku Urgyens life experiences are absolutely incredible!! That book can reveal the power of the path of Tantra quite genuinely. Also, his humility is uncanny... himself being quite the master!

I said the masses are deluded and this includes both East and West and yes, meditation Masters do exist from a higher space of being than you and I and they are worthy of being humbled to by you and I.

The Universe does have Universal Truths. Like I said, put me on ignore. You will suffer less through ignorance. At least until someone comes a long and pushes the same buttons. Because the buttons exist, they will keep getting pushed, one way or another. You obviously don't have the capacity for Buddhism. Which is also why you don't understand many of my posts and see them very superficially. This is not my fault.

For ralis, Buddhists don't believe that they don't exist, just that everything exists relatively (as in things and ones self arises dependently upon causes and conditions seemingly outside of itself) and not inherently (as in not from it's own self) and that there is no absolute "self" existence (as in an existence that exists from it's own nature). Also, Buddhists don't believe that there is an illusion, just that absolute self existence is an illusion of appearance that falls pray to impermanence eventually.(An illusion does not exist, but one can be fooled by ones perception of things and through the illusion of permanence comes attachment and suffering when that illusion is destroyed by the fact of impermanence.)

I'm on the East Coast of Florida. I work on Beach Drive for a living. Anyway... these are my own words coming from my own experience and understanding of the Dharma. It's not rhetorical, you just don't have the capacity to understand my use of the English language. I don't take your mis-understanding as a sign that I should change for you, because I speak in a way that comes naturally for me in reference of experiential understanding. Plenty of people understand the meaning of my words and compliment me. Are they wrong and you're right? Maybe you should read more slowly, or ignore me.

The tools of being human grant: the ability to see more deeply than lets say being born through the karmic tools of a fish. Ok... good ralis. I'm much happier about you to know that you are not as superficial as I have come to believe through our debates.

It's also what Masters say who are far beyond the points of views of the deluded masses. It's just a fact of non-duality that your own enlightened nature will pop out into a seemingly other being in order to mirror your out-turned awareness back in on itself. It is in fact a universal Truth. Eventually, everyone comes to meet their enlightened nature in a seemingly other person in order to get through the more tenuous self attachments. At the same time... there is an ignorance there, and it's really just the fault of the philosophy. So no, it's not squeaky clean, even philosophically. If you don't have a karmic connection to something, this will make itself very clear through mirroring this truth to you in some way. The people there don't open their arms to you but greet other people without knowing they're ignoring you, the teacher makes movements that bother you somehow and remind you of something creepy in your subconscious or forgotten past. It's really just you though.

At the same time, being born with the ability for self awareness on deep, deep levels as the tools of being human grant, is a seriously wondrous blessing! So, being human is also a seriously great place to be, in order to cultivate deeper awareness of things because this body too shall pass, unless you realize Jalus of course.

You're kind of a black and white thinker aren't you? It's as if no other information makes a dent on your brain, so I question the openness you have experienced in meditation practice. It seems your peace and simplicity is merely a comfort zone and new perspectives bounce off of this comfort zone? Once again though... I'll share with you the Buddhist position. Buddhists don't believe that they don't exist, just that everything exists relatively and not inherently and that there is no absolute "self" existence. Also, Buddhists don't believe that there is an illusion, just that absolute self existence is an illusion of appearance that falls pray to impermanence eventually.

No one gets to the later stages of development without enlightened guidance, either living or from beyond, or after death from another realm of existence. That's just how non-duality works in order to make some final crushes to the ego and sense of concrete separation from other beings. You don't inherently exist by yourself to begin with. Clearly of course, there are going to be more people not ready for later stages than those that are. But, even reading a good book by a good teacher from a good lineage is enough to make a sub-conscious connection that lasts beyond this life.