TexasNative

What is the point? FORGIVENESS Forgiveness may be considered simply in terms of the person who forgives including forgiving themselves. To forgive someone is to forswear resentment, anger, or other reactions to their having done something that justifies such responses. The philosophical problem is that this is apparently treating them better than they deserve; but how can it be a requirement, or even be permissible, to treat someone in any other way than as they deserve? The advice of Augustine, that we hate the sin but not the sinner also suggests an objective or impersonal attitude towards the sinner, as if the character of the agent is only accidentally connected with the hatefulness of his or her actions, and it has been argued, notably by Strawson, that this objective stance is inconsistent with full recognition of the personhood of others.

Some of us are aware of when we engage in drama. You son have no recollection of having done so many times.

There are tons of posts to prove you flipped flopped back and forth and even called what Max was doing as being irresponsible. You whined, and it was okay and reasonable. It was easy then for you to stop whining and move on once Chris and Max helped and cleared up a couple of things was it? Now ain't that a surprise. I am truly happy for you Scotty, some of us weren't so lucky so please forgive us and allow us to take a little more time before we move on.

I know I behave like a real ass sometimes but the difference is I always know when I'm doing it. Max is not teaching anymore but how many instructors and facilitators are? None of this will get to them either, and you said you won't be teaching so I have no other issues with you Chris. What do you care now if I rant, rave or whine? You are no longer responsible right?

You would know Scotty because this little bit I wrote was about you: "some can't make up their minds first loving it and voicing praise, then hating it and speaking out against it and moving onto other practices, then coming back to it, back and forth, back and forth, back and forth."

What exactly has changed now? Max or those representing him have never admitted that he might be doing something wrong. It's only when you started writing about how people had been hurt that everyone started to consider it as a possibility. What real change can there ever be if the teacher assumes no responsibility? You've mentioned that this same pattern will filter down to all the instructors and facilitators. If there is a problem won't it continue to get bigger? You pointed out that Max likes to disappear when things get bothersome. Chris has pointed out that Max has done that as a test to see what the students do, some survive or damage their minds, others look for help with other teachers, some can't make up their minds first loving it and voicing praise, then hating it and speaking out against it and moving onto other practices, then coming back to it, back and forth, back and forth, back and forth. The worst scenario is that some consider themselves teacher material and pass the teachings along to others. This has all been bullshit and needed to be fine tuned before taking it on the road.

Well now...I'd like to thank all the whiners for their courage in the face of the repeated abuse. I think Oceanside said it best when he said that Kunlun/RP was the path to madness. Amazing ain't it what you have to do to shed a little light. Chris/Satori you behaved like an insane egotistical vile and vicious S.O.B and your mother as well as your teacher should be ashamed. I've come across rattlers with better manners. I wanted there to be peace yes but as for forgiveness well, I'm just not feeling it yet. To -O- thank you is appropriate, as well as sorrow to hear about your mother. I'd still be harboring a good deal of hate about that and wouldn't be able to speak or recommend a teacher or his methods if that had happened to someone I loved, you are a better man than me, even if turns out to be that you are a woman. I have to add this too, you wrote that your mother was ill before you introduced her to Max. How had the practices affected your judgment by that point so you couldn't see that what your mother needed was a doctor instead? How is it that Max couldn't see that either?

The Kunlun Poll thread gives a good overview. You called it a swamp, yes there is lots to wade through that the practices brings up. As is, and especially including RP I can't recommend it to anyone. I'm gonna do a two-step out of here now.

The question was answered by -O- on page 34. The books may be "crazy" free but the seminars and forums, Kunlun as well as The Tao Bums are not.

I edited my previous post. Please read it. This is the reason why training/preparation with these powerful practices is important. Teacher and student both run a risk of having difficulty determining what is happening.

Very good -O-. It's important for everyone to know what can happen with these practices. Teachers and students need to be aware and prepared/trained properly.

This question needs to be answered publicly for this all to come to an end. This is something that all Kunlun students should know. Then all the questions will be answered and there will be nothing left to say.

What would be nice too is to reimburse the course cost to those who have been ridiculed. I think that would be fair and very fitting don't you?

Ah there it is again. How you humiliate and ridicule. Did you for a moment give a thought and consideration to your students that you continue to ridicule and humiliate. You aren't sure who I am. As no one is now sure you aren't and haven't always been Satori. What if I'm not them? There is that possibility you know. Things were progressing here but then -O- suspected oceanside of insincerety and all progress stopped. Suspects. Instead of students. Ridicule instead of immediate help. How many ignored emails have their been? It's been explained that if they aren't answered then they don't deserved to be. These are all diversionary tactics to avoid answering questions, you take pleasure in sacrificing your students and ridiculing them and creating argument so all discussion is destroyed. You've illustrated that here. The start, progress, rise and fall, effective at halting all discussion, perfected with repeated use. This forum is littered with such conversations where the provoker Satori (an egotistical SOB) did a nice job at it. Those 5 or 6 students who have spoken up and voiced their concerned could have been prevented. You still haven't answered the question and all the other valid ones asked here. Why didn't Max heed -O- recommendations? Why didn't you? As a student of Kunlun I have a right to my anonymity, please respect that. Consider also that maybe Kunlun allows everyones courage to grow so finally, finally, they too can start pushing back. Ensure to me that you will prepare the students better for the Max practices and provide immediate help for all health issues and I will stop posting.

Be a good person. I understand it now. Now is what is important, not one day. I've watched you do this to countless people, on the Kunlun forum and here. You keep focusing on just a few, saying it's just a few but there's been more than that. People stop practicing because they can't fix their health issues and because practical and technical knowledge is lacking. They move onto other teachers for help. That stops them from completing this path. You do want them to leave. Be a good person. Make the effort. Don't let this happen to anyone else. You can prevent this from happening to anyone else. Chris/Satori, Eileen thank you for showing everyone what kind of treatment they can expect in the event they should need some guidance/help with the practices. How you responded throughout illustrates perfectly the treatment they will receive and what oceanside and I had become accustomed too. My thanks to -O- for being the only voice of reason. I hope the Kunlun crew learned something from you. I noticed in some of their responses they gleaned heavily from your wisdom. It's been sorely lacking in the past. I know you helped them too.

Why would anyone tell you who they are so you can bad mouth them, humiliate them with personal information that was given in confidence? That's another thing that you've established a pattern with. You are not GOOD people. YOU miss one of the most important elements. YOU ARE NOT GOOD PEOPLE. To protect a student who has been trying to obtain help from you I would send you and recommended they send you on a wild goose chase all over the world. You have illustrated perfectly the regard you have for your students. Why would anyone risk this kind of torture speaking up? You ridicule and humiliate them and take great pleasure in it. YOU SET A BAD EXAMPLE. YOU ARE NOT GOOD PEOPLE and that filters down to everyone. YOU INFECT EVERYONE you profess to love and want to help and lead to enlightenment.

You are big on conspiracy theories winpro. Check this site it's littered with them. I'd get help with the paranoia. Oh, that's right you have to come here and ask "what do you think"? Do they ignore you on the Kunlun forum, ignore your emails? You may be going GDB and need some help. I'd get that checked out. In the end, we all pretend. We all pretend that any of us know a damn thing. Well now...here's the sad thing, breaks my heart. You people care more about badmouthing the students that have had problems than you do with finding a way to stop it from happening in the first place. There's a pattern here that you've all illustrated with that, you blame the student for health issues that result that causes them to leave your practices. You don't see a problem with that and how it reflects negatively on you? Enlightenment may bypass you this lifetime, work on seeing first. You are blind driven by a dream, that could work but you're too egotistical to get out of the way to ensure that it does for everyone.

PLEASE NOTE: Don't go back to ass kissing now, you were doing just fine. Chris still hasn't addressed why he lied yet. It negated his post completely but he hasn't addressed that yet. Consider that if Max had heeded your advice there wouldn't even be those 5 or 6 here on Tao Bums. You answered oceanside's question. YOU. After 2 years of trying and having to come onto another forum YOU helped him. I forwarded your advice to oceanside. He told me to thank your daughter. Oh and -O- I think the Kunlun exiles end up here. Those that don't get any kind of help with their health issues don't have a choice, they have to give up the practices. Or it may just save a life. I am concerned about it. These people don't know what they are doing. There isn't enough experienced help with these practices. I would greatly appreciate it if they prove me wrong and no one ever gets hurt as a result.

As to what the others are doing out there I don't know. I am not involved with that program. Well now...it's just been part of your job to pump em out and ship em out and then....and then you wash your hands of them right? You of course are in no way responsible for what they are doing right? Of course not, hell no. Sweet Jesus. None of you know what you are doing.

Well now...could have timed precisely the arrival of the troops. You can't distract anyone from the truth anymore Chris. None of you know what you are doing. It's illuminated brightly. Shiny bright.

Read what you wrote, then read what I wrote, none of you know what you are doing.