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So i guess i had to post this, i used to be active under same account like 8 yrs ago. I dabble with KAP and other western systems

What is illegitimate about this? Not trying to incite an arguement, i'm genuinely curious... (I have been gone from this site for a while and I remember this was a real hotly debated topic before)

I highly, highly reommend KAP. Even with the price, you can retake it again for $100. I'm on my third try. This time with Tao Semko who is very much my style of teacher. He is very analytical and breaks things down so that its clear to everyone. Santiago is very good as well, just different. Thats the beauty of being able to re-take it... you can try out the different teachers and get different layers of understanding. Overall, KAP is facilitating some very positive changes in my life!!

awesome!! I'm a fan of that book and how it relates to Robert Anton Wilson and Timothy Leary's stuff... Are you going to sign up for the class?

Indeed. I thoroughly enjoyed this flick! I'd say it was a "food for the spirit" kind of movie!!

K: That's a good question... It's one of the big philosophical doozies that people have constantly trying to explain. Like "why do bad things happen to good people" This is something I constantly think about also. Why everybody experiences trauma (or suffering to some degree) so much. Some consider it "karma". Suffering is just part of life, just like pleasure. In fact, in this dance of duality; one is defined by the absense of the other. Can't have pleasure without suffering. On a more practical level, there simply aren't enough resources to meet all of our needs; physical, emotional, spiritual, etc... Then the fact that other people/creatures are trying to get their needs met also, so there's inherent competition. That's what war is, ultimately. Dude talks about the difference between hard and soft traumas also. So whereas everyone hasn't experienced straight up war zones, most everyone has come across some kind of emotional traumas in their life. I think these have their cause in ignorance about and pursuit of getting out human needs met. For example, a kid feels self-concious at school so he picks on some other kids lower in the pecking order to make himself important. Hopefully us humans will figure out the difference between what we need and want and come up with more clever ways to meet those needs. Like sports is a good example. Instead of raping and pillaging, guys can play competetive sports to harness those instincts in a positive way. anyway, that's my sunday morning ramble... booyah!

I do some squats... or I do "earth shaking" with is something I learned in KAP... have been loving it! basically it's a mix between horse stance and a squat... just go down so your in horse stance and then bounce up and down! Do that for 10 or 20 minutes. I wondered the same thing as you in regards to being above ground level... and i find doing something physical is better than just mentally visualizing something! Or you can always visualize WHILE your doing the physical!!

Ill have to check these out also. I read his The Secret Teachings of All Ages and have the companion to that marked on my amazon page...

I just wanted to chime in that Eastern Body, western Mind by Anodea Judith IS a really good book, I just picked it up in fact... Kinda synchronistic you guys mention it actually! She really talks a lot about importance of grounding... And ties in a western psychological perspective... I know that for myself at least, imagining spinning intra-dimensionsl balls of light can be a little out there at first

Well... there's always NPR, if your into that... ...or the Daily Show... seriously though, you get more scoops from there than the "real news"!

IM by no means his biggest fan... like I said, he was pretty much a jerk on a personal basis (from the sources, it seems); but I dont think he ate babies and tortured puppies. Although there is a story of him killing a cat, which i find very disturbing, as I like animals, especially cats. I was really into his stuff a while back, but much of the western "magick" stuff is very much in the HEAD. Like memorizing all the Kabbalistic correspondences... ugh! I'd rather do some qigong. Still, I do live in my head a lot so I am drawn back to that stuff a lot. Like this am, spent my morning free time reading The Baptists Head instead of doing any physical exercise... And I have heard good things about Franz Bardon. Been meaning to check him out.

nah! His comments about sacraficing babies had to do with "retention" or in his case; "anti-retention"... ie, he liked to let his "babies" get sacraficed for pleasure... ya dig? Yea, he was a jerk! ALso a junky and and bisexual... but if you read his stuff he was f'ing brilliant. Responsible for bringing attention to a lot of practices we wouldn't know about today if it wasn't for him. He deliberately provoked people by making comments to offend their sensibilities... remember; he lived in Victorian England, a place where piano legs had to have covers so as not to be "indecent"... sheesh... If you actually read his work he was a Christian. He just hated the organization that uses that name. Read The Eye In The Triangle, by Israel Regardie for the best analysis of the man.

There's also some interesting connections between the mythical Prometheus and Lucifer. Prometheus was the champion of humans and brought us knowledge of fire, and was punished as a result. Lucifer means "bringer of light", which is different than the Christian notion of him as just the ultimate evil. Also, a lot of the notions we have of 'the devil' are Christian twistings of earlier pagan teachings that were a lot less nefarious than we come to believe. I believe the image of the horned goat is a twisting of early fertility gods, like Pan. Thus the root of the word "horny". Basically a demonization of our sexual impulse... and we can see how that's working out for the Catholic church (ie; sex scandals). Even the word HELL didn't mean what we believe it to be today, I think it was just a place in the earth... I remember hearing that the native americans where really put off with the christian idea that the center of earth was supposedly a place of great evil. Maybe that explains why Western culture is so destructive of our earth. Un-grounded. Interesting that the base chakra (muladhara) is associated with RED (the color of the devil). This isn't to say there isn't actual evil in the world, or to say that evil is a good thing. of course not. Just that many of the things that masquerade as good are in fact evil and likewise... it gets complicated

Yeah, that's a very fundamentalist view of THELEMA. I wonder what dude thinks of it's prophet: good 'ol Aleister Crowley. It's VERY black and white... geez, did you hear what they said about grey tantra? like one like "it inevitably leads to black tantra (which means your soul will suffer everlasting misery)" That's a lot of pressure!!

You could also try some tummo. I know that gets things cookin' for me!

Yeah it felt literally like "use it or lose it" ...now this was due to medication issues partly but it seemed to just shut down. There's a lot of guys on the boards who talk about people going way too far with retention and do serious damage to their bodies. I think this can be true. Like with most things; balance is good. Not too little, not too much.

night is darkest right before dawn... You dig?

whoa.. I'm in NO WAY the KAP spokesperson or posterboy by any means... I just remember Santiago (from his posts here, of some videos or KAP classes) talking about how people went overboard with "retention" and that it was alright to ejaculate like once a month... Just direct that energy towards the greatest good. This coincides with my personal experience also... when I had long periods of retention (without proper accompanying cultivation) it felt like the whole system shut down. Now, going to the other extreme and busting multiple nuts a day is (in my experience, and according to the literature) draining for sure... So it's a balance... There's shit you can problably do to Re-Direct that energy more effectively than just not nutting. I wonder what the study would show for dudes who did that Deer Exercise or something like that... You know; Proper retention practices ...a side note on KAP; supposedly in higher levels they teach you how to absord the chi from sperm after it leaves your body. This is mere conjecture on my part and have not been instructed nor witnessed this... I really wish other KAPers would join in with their experiences cuz I'm not a good representative for the whole system. Edit: I remember also on the AYP forums someone recommending once a month as a happy medium between being "ejaculation-crazy" and "retention-crazy". It makes sense...

this meets my experience also... BUT, there's also a "use it or lose it period" also... That maybe that center shuts down after not being 'utilised'. I know that an occassional nut can be good for the soul In KAP they talk about once a month ejaculating... that seems like a good happy medium... all jacked up on testosterone but still keeping the "pipes clean"...

Go KAP!! Big-ups to Dr. Morris!! _/\_ Just the secret smile itself is magical. It's like soap & water for the soul!! ...and mine was getting FUNKY!! It really needed it!! I can't imagine how awesome KAP2 and PSD must be...

Ok. Here's the deal: I looked up certified acupunturist for my zip on google and came up with what looked like a good lead. The guy had a good shpeal and was close. So I made an appointment and hoped for the best. I get there and when I talk to the actual doctor it seemed all good. I explained to him about my desire to have acupunture, chiropractic work, qiqong, whatever to help me in withdrawing from the methadone, and for posture/alignment and acne too... Then he takes me in this room and does this test where he puts a vial of "chi" in my hand to see how my system reacts to this. Like I hold a vial of clear liquid that says "grains" or "sugar" and he tries to push my arm down as I lay on my back and hold my other arm perpendicular to my body. Of course some times my arm is able to be pushed down easily and other times I can resist his pushing. He does this with like 15 different 'substances'. Then (because my main concern was addiction related) he has me hold vials that said(I'm assuming it wasn't actual drugs lol) the name of drugs on them. Now was when I started to get wary, cuz I could hold my arm for 'Heroin' but not 'Opium'. Now, they're both opiates so it should be the same fuckin result. Same thing with 'Marijuana' and 'Hashish'; different arm reaction!! And he's unclear about what exactly my arm's reaction means. Like if I can resist his pushing my arm down then I have a tolerance or what... I realize he's pushing my arm at different angles to engineer the result. sometimes he only pushes down, so it seems like I'm strong and able to resist... then he uses only a finger but the angle is perpendicular to my arm so it goes down no matter how much I resist. So i was thinking wtf?! Then I talk to another dude who does the actual acupunture and he seemed more knowledgable and actually had some insight into some physical symptoms. The actual actupunture session seemed to go better but at that point i was wary of the whole deal. Now, has anyone else had experience like this? Am i correct in assuming that this was mostly bullshit? I mean, I believe in "hokey/unscientific" things like shaktipats and transmissions and chi and kriyas and all that... but this seemed like bullshit. Please Tbums; help a brother out!

yeah... that's exactly what it was: Hold this vial and see if I can push your arm down. I was laying on my back with my arm pointing straight up to the ceiling and he would try to push it down. He would say things like "oh, I feel this one is going to affect you a LOT" and shit like that. Like I said, I've paid for shaktipats and other things that I would have a hard time convincing a skeptic about, but this was over the top. And I could tell the angle he was pushing me at... Like he would push DOWN on my arm (cuz im layin on my back, right) and I could hold it steady; but the affect was like "whoa, he put a lot of pressure that time"... but he was pushing DOWN. Then he would push my arm towards the wall (perpendicular)and it could move easly; only with 1 finger.

Yeah... the more I think about it the more pissed off I am... Luckily I had a print out from the internet that said the initial consultation is free, so I only paid for the acupunture; which was the legitimate part of the whole thing. What kind of a person takes advantage of people like that? I bet a lot of people fall for shit like that.