Ninpo-me-this-ninjutsu-me-that

Likewise, I'm sure

I don't believe they are one archetype. One is related to nature and the other is related to devolution. My meaning was the Christians perverted the view of one to make it look like another...not that it is the same as the other. The whole archetype argument is kind of moot in my view, as Jung himself drew heavily from the esoteric and mysticism and tried to present it in a manner acceptable to present day society. A repackaging if you will. But in any case...since everything is archetypes to you(which is fair enough)I'm kind of wondering if chi is too....and kundalini and so on. If not, how do you reconcile your view? I should perhaps point out why in the first place I picked up on your comment. I really don't want someone one day doing an online search for satan/nature and coming upon the idea that it's the same thing, and then running off and becoming a Satanist thinking it's all nice and natural. Although they will be told much the same as what you said by the Satanists, they will find, one day, they are in deep s***. I know you are not necessarily talking about Satanism the religion, but you can see I'm sure, how someone might make the link. For you, from your view of archetypes, I know it would perhaps be harmless, and Satanism is presented as such these days, but the truth, as far as my perceptions go, is otherwise... not that I'm necessarily saying there is one boogey man called Satan knocking about.... but there are definitely somethings that can be a real pain in the ass to get rid of... or perhaps I should say it in Jungian terms....an archetype that is difficult to assimilate. Whichever you choose is fine by me.

The horned red guy you speak of is 'Pan', a god of fertility that was demonized(literally)by the early Christians in Europe. That is where the 'red horned demon/Devil' got his 'look' from. And that is the point I'm trying to make, an earthy fertility God is not the same as Satan(archetype or not). Since you have spoken of Mr. Satan, I'm assuming you think of him in terms of Pan, as that is what you have previously stated. But Pan is Pan, and whatever Satan is would be quite different. Trying to have Satan fit the Earth God mold, and making him nice and innocent and natural, was a move the Satanists tried to pull(and still do), hence the reference. you're mixing up the two. The Christians turned Pan into a Demon, and the Satanists turned the demon back into Pan. Both religions did this for their own purposes.

I'd agree that the whole serpent thing is a bit off. I think there is a big distinction between the so called 'serpent Satan' and the Kundalini. I think the serpent Satan is perhaps a misnomer. One is breaking the connection with the divine(Satan, or the grouping of forces that are aligned with the Satanic)and the other establishes a connection with the divine(kundalini). Perhaps there is a dualistic black snake/white snake thing going on. There did used to be a rather poor rock band called 'White Snake', that, however, is irrelevant.

Are you going down that old 'Lavey' chestnut that satanism is just some kind of Earthism, and just man expressing his 'natural' self? The biggest trick Lavey ever played on man was getting them to believe that falsehood about Satanism. In general this makes sense to me. Tempted downwards and a separation in consciousness ensuing..... creating all so called 'evils' and the perpetuation of such.

Starjumpers direct experience of some form of entity. That always interests me. It's nice to read some direct experience. And, as you said, the mirror gazing also.

Just like to say I'm enjoying this thread.

Aww, you just put me on a real downer man. I always hope that with a certain few it will be like no time has past at all, I still think it's a possibility. Sometimes I think it's dependent on how deep the connection was in the first place and how true they have allowed their heart to remain and be. What I have found though is that they have re-framed their mind to such a degree that they almost convince themselves that what was wasn't in fact what it was. I have found that people are very good, over time, at adding a layer to themselves that covers the truth. Something of a protection mechanism. I'm reminded of something I read a long time ago about a psychological study of prisoners. When they first enter prison on a long term sentence their mind will rebel against it, then they go through the stage of acceptance, after that they actually really believe they like it and want it, even fear freedom. I see so many people like this in one form or another. There are very few fighters in life, willing to face the discomfort of what inner freedom really means..... most choose comfort and security, as opposed to their own truth of the heart. Perhaps they have the right idea.... but... I still think it's sad. Most put their first foot on the path of destiny and shit themselves and turn back. Luckily there is such a thing as reincarnation so they can try it next time round!!! :lol: (sorry man, I couldn't resist).

Oh I know what you mean Hardyg. I'm often told by Chinese people when I have a fairly recent ache or pain that it's because I slept when there was a draft on or close to that part of my body. When thinking back I have found it to be true. Either a window was open or a fan was on and directly blowing on that part of the body such as a joint or muscle group. It's quite a common thing for Chinese people to say to each other; when I first heard it, I must admit, I thought it was a bit naive. But I have to say, they are right as far as I have experienced. They always(as far as I know)associate it with when you are sleeping, as one part of your body(or all)is remaining fairly immobile. The general idea seems to be the cool air somehow causes the muscle to contract, not a problem if your moving about as sufficient blood is moving through it if your active, but not good if the area is not moving. I have been massaged in that area after I have been told that has happened on various occasions(it has to be a specific point though)and sure enough afterwards it's completely fine(massaged til the pain of the massage is gone). When the area has not been massaged the pain has stayed for days though! I usually get admonished that if I do it again they are not gonna bother to massage it for me. I never heard about a draft that is indirect. But perhaps it's the same idea as a cooling influence will cause the muscle to contract in some way. I'm not sure.

Why don't you say goodbye Mal? It's been nine pages now and we've only had two, something of a disappointment really. It's ok, it doesn't need to be a real goodbye, you can take it back after about ten minutes, when everyone says "awwwww Mal, please dun' go!".

I didn't think of that! It's more of an 'o' sound rather than an 'a' sound. As is "oh oh oh ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh"

haha Chinese make the sound for a dog as 'wang wang wang', which seems similar to 'wang(le)' meaning 'forgot'. Different tone mind you, but they play with the tones so I don't know why I can't.

You big softee you. My solution is no one ever says goodbye then. That way then there's always the possibility and hope they may come back..... like a lost lover!

Well.... that's two more pages of 'Durkhrod says goodbye/not goodbye'. Who's saying goodbye now then? Maybe we should have a new section on the site, just like there is a lobby for saying 'hello', there can be an exit point for 'goodbyes'.

That's very applicable to all kinds of ambitious action isn't it Marblehead. It's very true too, really sacrificing for something that actually won't bring much actual internal benefit except a bolstering of the ego. When all that happens is a person causes themselves pain in some way. Sometimes, like you said, being sagely is simply knowing what and what isn't worth striving/sacrificing for.

This saying goodbye stuff is certainly infectious!

You know me so well. There's not a day that passes that I don't imagine myself running around in pads so big they could protect me from an oncoming train whilst playing 'football'.

That sounds like a good course. Link?

I feel so sorry that all of you have attracted these new age bullies into your life. The other day one stole my lunch money, and ran off saying "you can blame it on your resonant congruence with the all that is!". I remember the good old days when bullies would simply give me a slap and hang me upside down until the pennies dropped out of my pocket and call me a wanker. Nothing like a good old fashioned 1980's bully if you ask me.

Take care man.

I wouldn't worry too much about it Gauss, just because technically speaking they are not allowed to believe it or practice it, it doesn't mean they don't. There's a group of 'falun gongers' that are old ladies that practice it in the park near me, in broad daylight. They don't give a f***. Now that's a real woman!!!

Yeah, you're strictly a 'custard pie in the face' kinda' guy aren't ya marbles *splat* (Don't act like that doesn't amuse you) I enjoyed the post Gauss, I'm not overly keen on too much end of the world stuff myself, but that's a good one. I mean as good as any that have come out anyway!

Very interesting, but where did you get this from Gauss?

Ya, I agree. That's part of what I meant without elaborating. It happens when you don't know it's happening. And even if one did know it was happening it wouldn't matter due to the intensity of the experience before the balance point being reached.