Ninpo-me-this-ninjutsu-me-that

Ya, what's even better to realize is all arguments are all true and false at the same time....or can be. I used to love argument for the sake of it, I was real good at it, then one day I realized I was taking arguments that I didn't really even believe in and winning the debate every time. If I could do that I knew it didn't necessarily make the argument correct, yet I could give examples and evidence that certainly made them seem so. And like you said, all you ever really win is silence. I knew that if this was so then there was always someone in the world who could come and 'win' the argument if they simply had the correct skills, it mattered not what the subject was. I then found it more interesting to argue with myself....the only times I ever lost was when I didn't have the knowledge or expanded viewpoint in order to win(on that side). It was then that, for the most part, I gave up, unless something was really important to me. Not easy having to slap the ego down every time it wants to open its mouth. But still, there were some benefits, intuition got better You know Goldisheavy, you really remind me of someone I used to know, you really really do.

It be Chinese, 'weichi', don't let those naughty Japanese claim everything as their own culture

Drew! The youtoobe link you provided is to the song 'every body was kung fu fighting' by carl douglas, as much as I like the song I was kind of expecting a little short documentary or something!

University of life! I have done extensive research online, just now, and can confidently say there is no such establishment of higher learning with the aforementioned name! It does not exist, save for a few mythical references here and there! How dare you! Your wanton use of the word 'and' throughout your posts quite obviously calling my parentage into question(many have)is a slight no man should have to bear! You have left me with no other recourse. I demand satisfaction!!! *glove slaps face* I propose a duel! The hurling of books at each others heads at ten paces(hardback)at dawn, until one or the other is unconscious! And Apepch7, do not be bringing your 'Herges adventures of Tintin, Cigars of the Pharaohs' unless your willing to swap it for about a week with my Tintin and 'the blue lotus'. And I'll thank you to return my 'Tintin does Bethlehem', it's overdue at the library. How dare you! Enlightenment is a hot Asian girl Little1?? I think you might be onto something there. The quest begins!!! It has always been thus. Hark! I hear destiny calling me, all be it in broken English and a short skirt.

How dare you be as highly educated as you are! How absolutely dare you! Thou dost offend thine eye!

I wouldn't if I were you, but if you really must. Lasts for 8/10 hours+ depending on strength and the last hours are filled with paranoia. And there's no getting off the ride if it's a shit one. If you have some unknown mental instability it can really bring it out. Acid is for life, not just for Christmas, stays in your body forever, although the effects don't, dependent on if it had some serious psychological effects at the time. I wouldn't bother if I were you, some practices way exceed the effects of LSD. Easy for me to say I suppose. Once was enough.

I think it's great that in that state I can learn instead of just chasing women ....... there's no guarantee I can catch them in my dream either! At least with a book I get something I don't think it is just subconscious information trying to break through, although I understand what your saying, dreams too, often have that element. The books have a distinct character all of their own and you can feel the writers mind coming through it. I do agree the subconscious has a great deal of information to offer though..... but I really don't think everything can or necessarily should be reduced to that. I will say though that's pretty interesting that you can give the information another form, and I can see why you view it therefore as the subconscious. I certainly couldn't prove you wrong, and I guess at the end of the day it only matters that it's useful, no matter what the source. The best part is it was for free right Can you remember what the information was about? Or, like me just the broad subject matter A7? I don't know what you all think, but in my own view I take it as the other/inner part of me doing its own thing. I believe that inner me/you has a life all of its own, existing within dimensions/areas where many things exist, some earthly, some not. It seems to have a life all of its own. Take this example I think almost all of us have had. You're in a 'dream'(which to be honest some of I think is the inner you doing the rounds and parts of the experience filtering back to your 'in body' consciousness)and you're talking to a good friend/s that you have known for years, with all the feelings and recognition that comes with that knowing........yet when you wake you think...'who the bloody hell was that!', the fact is you don't know them, but that part of you clearly does, after a very short while you will forget the face too, although you know for sure you have never met them or know them 'here'. I know it could be said that maybe it's the subconscious and of course you feel recognition because of course the subconscious recognizes aspects of its self, and maybe is trying to show you that for some reason, sometimes I do think that's true, but not always in my view. Not everything is Jungian psychology, and it should be remembered Jung drew heavily from many ancient cultures and systems and tried/made a point of presenting it to the scientific community in a way acceptable to them. Personally, I think Jung kept a lot back, stuff he knew would be a big push for people in general and would call the rest of his work into question. Having said that he definitely pushed the boundaries, especially when he started dealing with synchronicity, that really seems to split the psychology community, one side simply saying it's a psychological effect of cognition, the human mind wishing to group things together, Jung thought otherwise, I'm inclined to agree with him.

Ya, and it's really annoying when you cant remember! I don't know that I've had scrolls, mostly books that were really good related to esoteric knowledge that I knew I'd never read before. But then just as I become left brain conscious it all slips away, I still retain the overall feeling of what I read, although a few seconds before I understood it completely. I guess it pops out into the conscious when it's needed I suspect. That inner sight has to be tricked, the moment the conscious mind engages, that's it, it's gone. It has to be allowed to impact your mind rather than consciously thinking about it.....but, of course the moment you realize you shouldn't consciously think about it, it's too late, you just have. Game over. edit: mixed 'me lefts and rights up.

Well, good luck with it, it can't be too bad or everyone would be going for the refund, I'm sure he makes a point of replying to emails to make sure that doesn't happen. Make sure you tell us how it goes. It's always good to know if it is bollocks

Money comes and goes, but experiences stay for a lifetime(unless you go senile), good and bad. You can always make more money, but some experiences don't always come along again for one reason or another. In my experience it's much worse always wondering 'what if', really what have you got to lose...... I mean in the grand scheme of things. And it sounds to me like you wanna go. His earlier books are good, if that's any help. Edit: It's got a money back guarantee too if you don't like it.

I think I've cracked it Neichuan! All the advice you've received is really good I think. But I've thought about it trying to find an almost fool proof one, and by God man, I think I may just have done it! Here it is with a couple of variations: When you're in your room practicing and suddenly one of your parents knocks on the door disturbing you, simply shout this at the top of your voice in an irritated tone "Do you mind! I'm trying to masturbate!!!!".... I don't think they'll bother you again Neichuan! If you can handle the embarrassment after it's a real winner! Alternatively if they are used to just barging in you have two options, 1. put a porn on at top volume, they will assume your masturbating, and no parent wants to see their offspring masturbate, I'm fairly confident of that. There is a problem though with blue balls but just don't focus on the porn, tune it out in your mind. 2. Actually masturbate; when your pretty sure they are gonna come to your room at a certain time assume the position in all your glory and get to it, when they open the door and are confronted with one of the new seven wonders of the world just smile, give a wink and a salute(with your free hand of course). They will never bother you again!!! Ps. What sloppy Zhang said is true, people do start to come out of the woodwork when you cultivate, maybe attracted to the energy. I get it all the time with the phone, drives me crazy, thank God for the off switch.

Oh it's ok, I'm not really sure what quantifies one as having studied Daoism anyway, everyone has their own way and observation. Your views and opinions are as valid and as interesting as anyones. So don't stay in the kitchen too long will you.... you may be needed here! And as for making a fool of yourself I doubt it, fools are very Daoist in my view, lowest position and all, like water. It's a much maligned path filled with sudden realizations. So keep 'em coming! It's all helpful you know. No spoons at dawn today I'm afraid, I really got what you were saying. But my spoon is ever at the ready (but only when scooping is required)

I've got a great idea Neichuan! When your in horse stance make sure your back is to your bedroom door, this way when they try to come in to disturb you, the door constantly hitting you in the back will train you to maintain your balance and further strengthen you! If they start getting verbal then simply train your mind to cut out these extraneous sounds. Unless they say "dinnertime!", 'cos you'll miss that one day when you move out(trust me). It's not perfect I know. ps. I did consider suggesting electrifying the door knob but that may be a bit extreme.

So.... what your saying Vortex is essentially I should contemplate my navel? Focus on the dan tien is Daoist meditation? The be all and end all. The other part about emptying the mind sounds rather Buddhist to me. If this is 'The' Daoist meditation then what's the difference between the Daosit form and the Zen form apart from the goals and that perhaps in Zen they don't focus on the dan-tien(as far as I know). Then again, I suppose there doesn't have to be a major difference....perhaps the dan-tien is the major difference. What does everyone else think? Edit: Because your worth it!

yes yes yes yes(without commas' 'cos it excites me) That's exactly what I've been looking for. That's what I've been trying to get at but didn't know it. That says it all for me, it really does, that's part of this other kind of awareness, like a 'born again Daoist' as Marblehead put it earlier. A natural kind of flowing, efficiently and effectively acting and reacting to various situations and circumstances due to the many and varied experiences of life, resulting in the beginning with thought/wisdom/awareness as to correct/effective action and yet after some time even those thoughts dropping away and becoming perfect....... instinct. You just hit it right on for me there. Now that's awareness! Daoist awareness......possibly Buddhist too but lets not go there. It reminded me of some direct practice within Ninjutsu(not to go all martial on you or anything), part of the root philosophy of Ninpo is Daoism, now this is expressed as in the beginning learning various set techniques but very soon it goes to the point where with a partner you will practice not knowing what he is exactly going to do, by that point you have usually a certain amount of technique and form, but as this is practiced further and further the mind and body then seems to develop a flow/knowing/awareness of its own. The idea is many thousands of attacks come about but yet cannot really be set/predicted. So this practice teaches the body it's innate combat wisdom/awareness, enabling it to instinctively react in ways that are protective and result in survival and a limitation of possible damage. And it really works.... after some time you find yourself kind of observing the body/mind doing stuff you hadn't even considered. Instinct. What you said right there is this Daoist awareness for me. Is that not the same as A7 is saying? An instinctive knowing...to let go of all notions. labels and 'past conditionings', I'm guessing past conditionings is the main thrust........ but I don't know exactly how that would be truly possible...... which gets me onto the next part I think........ Meditation. I don't think we've established what exactly Daoist meditation is. Can we establish that? Marblehead said it's related to a kind of developing awareness, I myself still think it's something similar to what Tao99 posted related to qietude, which frankly to me looked a lot like Chan/Zen Buddhist meditation. What is the actual A + B = C practice in Daoism, or is there one? Or is it more a form of developing awareness over time as Marblehead said. What is this meditation Cowtao? Apologies if I have missed your thoughts on this earlier, but I'm still not clear on this meditation aspect within Daoism. Edit: fur bood spilling mystics

This wouldn't be a 'Happy Bunny' of "I'm not a happy bunny" fame would it? I don't mean to get on topic or anything.

I'm not convinced I think it's missing one part....'experience', I have met quite a few knowledgeable people as I'm sure we all have, but I have to say many of them were planks. Not aware in the sense it's being used at the moment. I think if you put experience+knowledge it = awareness/wisdom. But it is their kind of awareness related to their experience and doesn't necessarily go beyond to what I might consider true awareness. Then again, I'm not exactly sure what true awareness might look like, I don't know if I'd know what it was even if it jumped up and poked me in the eye..... but I think it may be way more than a normal kind of wisdom. I've been thinking about this and I think my problem is I'm defining things from my own perspective as opposed to taking something new and seeing it with new eyes. This leads me to a further question, which is: is my awareness in fact limiting in that it relates simply to my personal experience Then I'm gonna go again with the 'surely awareness is more than this' thing. I feel those quotes you gave are really going deeper than just wisdom/knowledge. But..... the problem is that's what I'm seeing from my own biased view..... I'm going round in circles now. I always thought that the Daoist kind of awareness really kind of hints at something way deeper.... indefinable, but a feeling within the sage that is perhaps indescribable in words(that doesn't help matters). So then I guess the question is do you think it's simply wisdom that's being referred to and if so does that not mean every wise person has achieved/become one with the Tao? I will say though that this wisdom that's reffered to does make life easier as it kind of makes more efficient decisions and actions based on the knowledge/experience, and that is very Daoist I would venture. I like that a lot Cowtao. I also have a thought slightly disconnected/connected to what we have been discussing. I've been wondering if in fact Chan Buddhism which became Zen didn't in fact pilfer a great deal of philosophy from Daoism during it's time in China, making it more palatable to the masses, in a somewhat similar way that Christianity built their churches on ancient pagan worship sites in England so that the people were already used to going there to worship, same with the festivals too. Buddhism wasn't instantly popular in China, it took some time for that to happen. What better way than adding a bit of the indigenous words or phrases from their philosophy/religion. I don't know, it's just a thought. I don't know enough about the original Indian Buddhism to make a clear judgement. I know they go different ways, so, Chan Buddhism has kept it's original focus and goal but some of the references are glaring to me. It may just be me though, or I'm reading too much into something

Yes, he was already developing the energy, so he had a lot of it and: 'I was feeling like a twenty year old, semi-erect all the time', so he just kind of put the porn on, it wasn't any part of the practice. edit: Ps. Hello susan/shaktimama and welcome. I'll leave the Glenn stuff to you. Nice to see you here, I'm sure you will make a great addition to the site

pg. 31/path notes of an american ninja master Tien tao kung fu/kundalini watching porn and doing the obvious : 'suddenly a tremendous burst of energy ripped up my back and hit the base of my skull. The pain was so intense i fell to my knees. i wanted to vomit. ( further on ) ' from that day for the next six months sex was not a pleasure.' further down page 31 he says the problem was not keeping the tongue up when meditating as well as reversing the orbits occasionally. The actual kundalini awakening is on pg 33 when he was on his back porch. It's a seperate incident, not at the same time. But if you read the book he went through a lot of pain before that awakening because of the damage already done.

Ya, I don't know if that's a Buddhist saying but it was certainly what popped into my mind, if it's not a Buddhist sentence then they would do well to pinch it from you and change the last word 'cos it's a good'n Your seriously hurting my head now, I'm starting to wonder if your deliberately sending me on a Buddhist path or showing me similarities :'Do you think it's easy to do anything when you have a mind?'/'spirit is empty '/'the mind stops with recognition'/'the way gathers in emptiness alone'. I'm pretty sure your'e not Buddhist Marblehead, if I take all the posts of yours that I've read as your Daoist philosophy, but that one........ who's catching who off guard????! This is like a warped game of bizarre un-expectation where both players didn't expect what they quoted or said to be read the way it has been, and certainly didn't expect the other to write it!!!! Ps. Why is Confucius commenting on Daoist practice??? Ok, now I get this, although I interpret it differently. I see this as a certain unawareness, as in the fear(yes, it's seems to go back that way, you did it with the reference to awareness or the environment and education and the snake example you gave, I've been paying attention)that through society is taught and has a place within the individual, but I see it more through a stripping away of that fear, by whatever means, means that the actual situation represented by death or other negative emotion cannot find a place to reside within the individual because they do not even conceive of it anymore, so, they have overcome it. Kind of an energy thing, like hate cannot find a place to reside or effect a person if there is no hate within them. Your getting onto some energy stuff with that one in my view, the higher levels of swordsmanship in ancient China and Japan is based on that quote you've given above. I hate to say it Marblehead but it's a certain kind of emptiness that makes the swordsman undefeatable, an emptiness of the fear of defeat or death, this true nature is everyones true nature, which in my view Daoism seeks to return the individual to. Thanks for fishing out those quotes, they are most interesting...... but I'm still struggling a bit

You know......... ...for a brief couple of seconds I actually thought you were serious, then I almost fell off my chair laughing! I would also like to add that a quality all true masters possess is 'integrity', and you know at the beginning of his career he said said he had worked for the C.I.A on a few crack missions, luckily though he was true to his official secrets act oath and never ever mentioned it, well, apart from that time. Would that all the martial arts masters sent on secret C.I.A missions took a leaf out of his book. The world would be a better place. Bruce Lee used to work for MI6(it's in the film Enter the Dragon)but he never mentioned it at all. Try as you might to find to reference to it online you can't, now that's a true master with integrity. Jean Caude Van Damme also springs to mind, he was always being sent on secret missions, as far as anyone knows; people think his career took a dive, but you can be as sure as the sky is blue that he's on a top secret missions in disguise, best place for him really. I'm glad our martial arts stars are still able to teach us all the meaning of the word integrity, I for one wouldn't know what to do if they didn't.

I am. You big tease. 'Meditation is the prelude to attaining awareness' ...... Marblehead.... that sounds an awful lot like a Buddhist 'Meditation is the prelude to attaining enlightenment' kind of sentence but with different words. How is it different? Is it different, I don't mean to go all renegade Buddhist or anything but I really have no idea what the difference may be. 'Awareness' is quite the broad term....I mean I'm aware of my foot right now but that's not saying much. I think that quote is gonna come in useful

Actually it's kind of supposed to have the opposite effect. Putting green tea leaves in your smelly shoes gets rid of the smell. Not sure you wanna do that, it may be expensive where you are. It's got some mad caffeine levels though, seems to depend on the person. Keeps me up all night. Don't think I ever met a stinky breath green tea drinker in answer to the question. edit/ps: When I came online this is what I saw 'Bad breath from tea..... especially leonBasin'.

Ya, religion is kind of looked down upon as being superstitious in the mainland due to them being taught that in obligatory 'political philosophy' classes, the political philosophy taught is actually just 'Marxism' and the ideology of Chairman Mao, no others. Somewhat biased for a philosophy class, but there you go. The main point is that religion has been used to control the people, so get rid of it(replaced with another form of control). Their changing their position now due to a lack of morals within the society causing various problems. All Christian churches also must have a communist party official overseer attached to them to make sure the teachings aren't getting a bit too..... revolutionary, I would imagine(although I don't know)that Buddhist and Daoist temples would be the same, muslim also. They still keep a tight reign on religion in the mainland. As for Falun gong the mistake they made was having more members than the communist party, no one cohesive group political/religious is allowed to have more members than the communist party, or it could get political and create problems for them. The falun gong thing is a bit confusing really, the government says that the falun gong people ritually set themselves on fire in Tian en men square in protest, and that that they are told to do this by what they describe as cult leaders, whereas the falun gong people say that the people who set themselves on fire were in fact former government people paid to do so and given benefits in one way or another. Neither view is beyond the bounds of belief.

I think it was Tao99 that posted a rather good quote from a text 500 odd years old, about the practice 'quietude', as the only actual known Daoist meditation practice(written about in Daoist texts that is, from a long time ago). It was nice and simple, which is nice for me as anything more complex only seems to confuse me, being simple minded myself, a simpleton, simplistic..... in other words stupid. As for 'mindfulness' I haven't got a clue as to what that is supposed to be or how to proceed with that. Is mindfulness something like when someone says "Oh, by the way, mind the step on the way out", usually after you've already fallen flat on your face, or what? So I suppose something like "oh, watch out for the Tao, it's flowing!" would be the equivalent. What is mindfulness, is it simply holding Daoist precepts at the forefront of your mind or have I missed something somewhere(quite likely I would postulate). By the way, I have created my own signature based on your sign off signature, I will probably only use it once or I'll get in a lot of trouble, here it is: Love a Piece!