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Everything posted by Mark Foote
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About that switch. A hot topic, in the 1920's and 30's in mathematics: In his second problem, [Hilbert] had asked for a mathematical proof of the consistency of the axioms of the arithmetic of real numbers. To show the significance of this problem, he added the following observation: "If contradictory attributes be assigned to a concept, I say that mathematically the concept does not exist" (Reid p. 71) Thus, Hilbert was saying: "If p and ~p are both shown to be true, then p does not exist", and was thereby invoking the law of excluded middle cast into the form of the law of contradiction. And finally constructivists … restricted mathematics to the study of concrete operations on finite or potentially (but not actually) infinite structures; completed infinite totalities … were rejected, as were indirect proof based on the Law of Excluded Middle. Most radical among the constructivists were the intuitionists, led by the erstwhile topologist L. E. J. Brouwer (Dawson p. 49) The rancorous debate continued through the early 1900s into the 1920s; in 1927 Brouwer complained about "polemicizing against it [intuitionism] in sneering tones" (Brouwer in van Heijenoort, p. 492). But the debate was fertile: it resulted in Principia Mathematica (1910–1913), and that work gave a precise definition to the law of excluded middle, and all this provided an intellectual setting and the tools necessary for the mathematicians of the early 20th century: Out of the rancor, and spawned in part by it, there arose several important logical developments; Zermelo's axiomatization of set theory (1908a), that was followed two years later by the first volume of Principia Mathematica, in which Russell and Whitehead showed how, via the theory of types: much of arithmetic could be developed by logicist means (Dawson p. 49) Brouwer reduced the debate to the use of proofs designed from "negative" or "non-existence" versus "constructive" proof: According to Brouwer, a statement that an object exists having a given property means that, and is only proved, when a method is known which in principle at least will enable such an object to be found or constructed … Hilbert naturally disagreed. "pure existence proofs have been the most important landmarks in the historical development of our science," he maintained. (Reid p. 155) Brouwer refused to accept the logical principle of the excluded middle, His argument was the following: "Suppose that A is the statement "There exists a member of the set S having the property P." If the set is finite, it is possible—in principle—to examine each member of S and determine whether there is a member of S with the property P or that every member of S lacks the property P." (this was missing a closing quote) For finite sets, therefore, Brouwer accepted the principle of the excluded middle as valid. He refused to accept it for infinite sets because if the set S is infinite, we cannot—even in principle—examine each member of the set. If, during the course of our examination, we find a member of the set with the property P, the first alternative is substantiated; but if we never find such a member, the second alternative is still not substantiated. Since mathematical theorems are often proved by establishing that the negation would involve us in a contradiction, this third possibility which Brouwer suggested would throw into question many of the mathematical statements currently accepted. "Taking the Principle of the Excluded Middle from the mathematician," Hilbert said, "is the same as … prohibiting the boxer the use of his fists." "The possible loss did not seem to bother Weyl … Brouwer's program was the coming thing, he insisted to his friends in Zürich." (Reid, p. 149) In his lecture in 1941 at Yale and the subsequent paper, Gödel proposed a solution: "that the negation of a universal proposition was to be understood as asserting the existence … of a counterexample" (Dawson, p. 157) (Wikipedia, "Law of Excluded Middle", emphasis added) Have yer counter-examples ready, when asserting the negation of universal propositions.
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Very unpopular opinion: the first four sermon-volumes of the Pali Canon have extraordinary discourses in them--maybe every twellfth sermon is unique in the religious literature of the world--and piecing together the "pleasant way of living" that Gautama the Shakyan recommended can be the undertaking of a lifetime. Ashoka was concerned more with the morality of Buddhism, and less with the potentially life-changing teachings. If you think Ashoka was extraordinary, try Gautama! I would say, "who cooks for you"... photo by Paulette Donnellon--burrowing owl in Anza-Borrega Desert State Park.
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I sit down first thing in the morning and last thing at night, and I look to experience the activity of the body solely by virtue of the free location of consciousness. As a matter of daily life, just to touch on such experience as occasion demands—for me, that’s enough. ("Take the Backward Step")
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Abbreviated four truths: I, Ananda, do not behold one material shape wherein is delight, wherein is content, but that from its changing and becoming otherwise there will not arise grief, suffering, lamentation, and despair. But this abiding, Ananda, has been fully awakened to by the Tathagata [literally, “one who has gone beyond”], that is to say, by not attending to any signs, the entering on and abiding in an inward emptiness… Wherefore, Ananda, if [one] should desire: ‘Entering on an inward emptiness, may I dwell therein’, that [person], Ananda, should steady, calm, make one-pointed and concentrate [the] mind precisely on what is inward. And how, Ananda. does [one] steady, calm, make one-pointed and concentrate [the] mind precisely on what is inward? As to this, Ananda, [the person], aloof from pleasures of the senses, aloof from unskilled states of mind, entering on it abides in the first [initial] meditation… the second … the third… the fourth meditation. Even so, Ananda, does [one] steady, calm, make one pointed, and concentrate [the] mind precisely on what is inward. (MN III 111-112, Pali Text Society Vol III p 154-156) "Without cessation there is no pleasure?"--Daniel "What's the point of a revolution without general copulation?" (--Peter Weiss, "The Persecution and Assassination of Jean-Paul Marat as Performed by the Inmates of the Asylum of Charenton Under the Direction of the Marquis de Sade") With the cessation of habit and volition in inhalation and exhalation (the fourth meditation), the automatic activity of the body in inhalation and exhalation takes place solely by virtue of the free location of consciousness. Prior to "the cessation of inbreathing and outbreathing", activity in the body tends to coordinate by virtue of the sense of place associated with consciousness. To find that sense of place is simply "to hold consciousness by itself": Meditation means you have to hold consciousness by itself. The consciousness should give attention to itself. (quote attributed to Shri Nisargadatta Maharaj) When a presence of mind is retained as the placement of attention shifts, then the natural tendency toward the free placement of attention draws out thoughts initial and sustained, and brings on the stages of concentration. (Shunryu Suzuki on Shikantaza and the Theravadin Stages) WIthout cessation, there's no rhythm in mindfulness. "
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Because of lack of desire, …by means of lack of desire, get rid of and transcend that equanimity in face of uniformity. connected with uniformity. Thus is the getting rid of it, thus is its transcending. (MN III 220, Pali Text Society Vol III p 269) That's the description of how to move from the state of "neither-perceiving-nor-yet-not-perceiving" to "the cessation of ('determinate thought' in) perception and feeling". You're probably thinking of: And what… is the ceasing of action? That ceasing of action by body, speech, and mind, by which one contacts freedom,–that is called ‘the ceasing of action’. (SN IV 145, Pali Text Society Vol IV p 85) …I have seen that the ceasing of the activities is gradual. When one has attained the first trance, speech has ceased. When one has attained the second trance, thought initial and sustained has ceased. When one has attained the third trance, zest has ceased. When one has attained the fourth trance, inbreathing and outbreathing have ceased… Both perception and feeling have ceased when one has attained the cessation of perception and feeling. (SN IV 217, Pali Text Society vol IV p 146) Everybody wants to turn the corner and be enlightened. Fine. What about the ceasing that is gradual, to at least the cessation of ("determinate thought" in) inbreathing and outbreathing, maybe every sitting? And the invocation of that cessation, as called upon, in daily living?
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presence and being habit and volition cease contact of freedom
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I agree. My best attempt at an explanation of chi moving the body: The centrifugal force at the place of awareness can find an equal and opposite response from everything that surrounds the place of awareness. That response feels a lot like blocking a judo throw, and between the centrifugal force and the block, stretch is generated. What I feel reminds me of Gautama’s analogy for the first meditative state: … as a handy bathman or attendant might strew bath-powder in some copper basin and, gradually sprinkling water, knead it together so that the bath-ball gathered up the moisture, became enveloped in moisture and saturated both in and out, but did not ooze moisture; even so (one) steeps, drenches, fills and suffuses this body with zest and ease, born of solitude, so that there is not one particle of the body that is not pervaded by this lone-born zest and ease. (AN III 25-28, Pali Text Society Vol. III p 18-19) If I were kneading soap powder into a ball in a copper vessel, I would have one hand kneading soap and one hand on the vessel. The press of the hand kneading soap would find something of an opposite pressure from the hand holding the vessel, even if the bottom of the vessel were resting on the ground. That’s what I feel when the centrifugal force at the place of awareness finds a response from everything that surrounds the place of awareness. ... As I sit with Tohei’s emphasis on centrifugal force, I realize that for me the exercise becomes in part the distinction of the direction of turn that I’m feeling at the location of awareness, and that distinction allows the appropriate counter from everything that surrounds the place of awareness. As a baseball pitcher extends his target through the catcher’s mitt, or a karate practitioner extends his target through the board or brick that he or she is about to break, the balance of centrifugal force and counterforce can depend on the inclusion of what lies beyond the senses in the stretch. ... If the mind of friendliness, of compassion, of sympathetic joy, or of equanimity is extended throughout the four quarters of the world, above and below, then the centrifugal force at the location of awareness and the counterforce can involve things that lie beyond the boundaries of the senses, and change in the balance of force and counterforce can initiate change in the carriage of the body without conscious volition. (Tohei’s Four Points of Ki Aikido) Omori Sogen on centrifugal and centripetal forces at play: Thus, by means of the equilibrium of the centrifugal and the centripetal force, the whole body is brought to a state of zero and spiritual power will pervade the whole body intensely. (“An Introduction to Zen Training”, Omori Sogen, p 61)
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That's the beauty of the first four volumes of the Pali sermons, although "some assembly is required." States of concentration that are inherent in human nature are described, both as to characteristics and feelings. The final concentration is described, the experience that comes out of that concentration, and the significance of the experience with regard to suffering. The difficulty is in the relationship between two experiences that can be everyday experiences, experiences that Dogen summarized: In his “Genjo Koan”, Dogen wrote: When you find your place where you are, practice occurs, actualizing the fundamental point. (“Genjo Koan [Actualizing the Fundamental Point]”, tr. Tanahashi) Given a presence of mind that can “hold consciousness by itself” (Nisargadatta's description of meditation), activity in the body begins to coordinate by virtue of the sense of place associated with consciousness. A relationship between the free location of consciousness and activity in the body comes forward, and as that relationship comes forward, “practice occurs”. Through such practice, the placement of consciousness is manifested in the activity of the body. Dogen continued: When you find your way at this moment, practice occurs, actualizing the fundamental point… (ibid) “When you find your way at this moment”, activity takes place solely by virtue of the free location of consciousness. A relationship between the freedom of consciousness and the automatic activity of the body comes forward, and as that relationship comes forward, practice occurs. Through such practice, the placement of consciousness is manifested as the activity of the body. ("Take the Backward Step") In between "find your place where you are" and "find your way at this moment", the teachings can be especially helpful, even if "activity solely by virtue of the free location of consciousness" takes a jumping-off that words can't actually convey. On the other hand: When a presence of mind is retained as the placement of attention shifts, then the natural tendency toward the free placement of attention draws out thoughts initial and sustained, and brings on the stages of concentration: … there is no need to depend on teaching. But the most important thing is to practice and realize our true nature… [laughs]. This is, you know, Zen. (Shunryu Suzuki, Tassajara 68-07-24, transcript from shunryusuzuki.com) (Shunryu Suzuki on Shikantaza and the Theravadin Stages)
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NaturaNaturans posted this image on another thread, and he commented: The world tree with an eagle at the top and a serpent gnawing at its roots, and my favorite creature, the squirrel ratatoskr running up and down transmitting insults between them.
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The classic literature of Tai Chi appears to identify the ligaments of the body as a source of activity. The literature describes three levels in the development of “ch’i”, a word that literally translates as “breath” but in practice is taken to refer to a fundamental energy of the body, and each of the three levels has three stages. The stages of the first level are: “… relaxing the ligaments from the shoulder to the wrist”; “from the hip joint to the heel”; “from the sacrum to the headtop”. (“Three Levels” from “Cheng Tzu’s Thirteen Treatises on Ta’i Chi Chuan”, Cheng Man Ch’ing, trans. Benjamin Pang Jeng Lo and Martin Inn, p 77-78) Unlike the contraction and relaxation of muscles, the stretch and resile of ligaments can’t be voluntarily controlled. The muscles across the joints can, however, be relaxed in such a way as to allow the natural stretch and resile of ligaments–that would seem to be the meaning of the advice to “relax the ligaments”. The stages of the second level are: “sinking ch’i to the tan t’ien” (a point below and behind the navel); “the ch’i reaches the arms and legs”; “the ch’i moves through the sacrum (wei lu) to the top of the head (ni wan)”. (ibid) Tai Ch’i master Cheng Man Ch’ing advised that the ch’i will collect at the tan-t’ien until it overflows into the tailbone and transits to the top of the head, but he warned against any attempt to force the flow. I would posit that the patterns in the development of ch’i reflect involuntary activity of the body generated in the stretch of ligaments. There is, in addition, a possible mechanism of support for the spine from the displacement of the fascia behind the spine, a displacement that can be effected by pressure generated in the abdominal cavity and that may quite possibly depend on a push on the fascia behind the sacrum by the bulk of the extensor muscles, as they contract. . The final level in the development of ch’i concerns “chin”. According to the classics, “chin comes from the ligaments” (ibid). The three stages of the final level are: “t’ing chin, listening to or feeling strength”; “comprehension of chin”; “omnipotence”. (ibid) Another translator rendered the last stage above as “perfect clarity” (17). In my estimation, “perfect clarity” is the activity of the body solely by virtue of the free location of consciousness. (A Way of Living)
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Nisargadatta, a famous teacher who lived in India in the last century, said: You are not your body, but you are the consciousness in the body, because of which you have the awareness of “I am”. It is without words, just pure beingness. Meditation means you have to hold consciousness by itself. The consciousness should give attention to itself. (Gaitonde, Mohan [2017]. Self – Love: The Original Dream [Shri Nisargadatta Maharaj’s Direct Pointers to Reality]. Mumbai: Zen Publications. ISBN 978-9385902833) “The consciousness should give attention to itself”—in thirteenth-century Japan, Eihei Dogen wrote: Therefore, …take the backward step of turning the light and shining it back. (“Fukan zazengi” Tenpuku version; tr. Carl Bielefeldt, “Dogen’s Manuals of Zen Meditation”, p 176) That’s a poetic way to say “the consciousness should give attention to itself”. I used to talk about the location of consciousness, but a friend of mine would always respond that for him, consciousness has no specific location. As a result, I switched to writing about the placement of attention: There can… come a moment when the movement of breath necessitates the placement of attention at a certain location in the body, or at a series of locations, with the ability to remain awake as the location of attention shifts retained through the exercise of presence. (A Way of Living) In his “Genjo Koan”, Dogen wrote: When you find your place where you are, practice occurs, actualizing the fundamental point. (“Genjo Koan [Actualizing the Fundamental Point]”, tr. Tanahashi) Given a presence of mind that can “hold consciousness by itself”, activity in the body begins to coordinate by virtue of the sense of place associated with consciousness. A relationship between the free location of consciousness and activity in the body comes forward, and as that relationship comes forward, “practice occurs”. Through such practice, the placement of consciousness is manifested in the activity of the body. Dogen continued: When you find your way at this moment, practice occurs, actualizing the fundamental point… (ibid) “When you find your way at this moment”, activity takes place solely by virtue of the free location of consciousness. A relationship between the freedom of consciousness and the automatic activity of the body comes forward, and as that relationship comes forward, practice occurs. Through such practice, the placement of consciousness is manifested as the activity of the body. I sit down first thing in the morning and last thing at night, and I look to experience the activity of the body solely by virtue of the free location of consciousness. As a matter of daily life, just to touch on such experience as occasion demands—for me, that’s enough. ("Take the Backward Step") My approach, to living as unconditioned as I can manage.
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Bear with me, Ervin. Elsewhere on Dao Bums, someone wrote: Even if you have no identity, you still exist. As what? The spirituality that I follow would say “as existence”, or “as pure consciousness”. I was reminded of Nisargadatta, a famous teacher who lived in India in the last century: You are not your body, but you are the consciousness in the body, because of which you have the awareness of “I am”. It is without words, just pure beingness. Meditation means you have to hold consciousness by itself. The consciousness should give attention to itself. (Gaitonde, Mohan [2017]. Self – Love: The Original Dream [Shri Nisargadatta Maharaj’s Direct Pointers to Reality]. Mumbai: Zen Publications. ISBN 978-9385902833) “The consciousness should give attention to itself”—in thirteenth-century Japan, Eihei Dogen wrote: Therefore, …take the backward step of turning the light and shining it back. (“Fukan zazengi” Tenpuku version; tr. Carl Bielefeldt, “Dogen’s Manuals of Zen Meditation”, p 176) That’s a poetic way to say “the consciousness should give attention to itself”. I used to talk about the location of consciousness, but a friend of mine would always respond that for him, consciousness has no specific location. As a result, I switched to writing about the placement of attention: There can… come a moment when the movement of breath necessitates the placement of attention at a certain location in the body, or at a series of locations, with the ability to remain awake as the location of attention shifts retained through the exercise of presence. (A Way of Living) In his “Genjo Koan”, Dogen wrote: When you find your place where you are, practice occurs, actualizing the fundamental point. (“Genjo Koan [Actualizing the Fundamental Point]”, tr. Tanahashi) Given a presence of mind that can “hold consciousness by itself”, activity in the body begins to coordinate by virtue of the sense of place associated with consciousness. A relationship between the free location of consciousness and activity in the body comes forward, and as that relationship comes forward, “practice occurs”. Through such practice, the placement of consciousness is manifested in the activity of the body. Dogen continued: When you find your way at this moment, practice occurs, actualizing the fundamental point… (ibid) “When you find your way at this moment”, activity takes place solely by virtue of the free location of consciousness. A relationship between the freedom of consciousness and the automatic activity of the body comes forward, and as that relationship comes forward, practice occurs. Through such practice, the placement of consciousness is manifested as the activity of the body. I sit down first thing in the morning and last thing at night, and I look to experience the activity of the body solely by virtue of the free location of consciousness. As a matter of daily life, just to touch on such experience as occasion demands—for me, that’s enough. ("Take the Backward Step") And now I can address "to accomplish everything without doing anything": Dogen also wrote: Although actualized immediately, the inconceivable may not be apparent. (ibid) I once heard Kobun Chino Otogawa close a lecture at the San Francisco Zen Center by saying: You know, sometimes zazen gets up and walks around. Activity of the body solely by virtue of the free location of consciousness can sometimes get up and walk around, without any thought to do so. Action like that resembles action that takes place through hypnotic suggestion, but unlike action by hypnotic suggestion, action by virtue of the free location of consciousness can turn out to be timely after the fact. When action turns out to accord with future events in an uncanny way, the source of that action may well be described as “the inconceivable”. I have found that zazen is more likely to “get up and walk around” when the free location of consciousness is accompanied by an extension of compassion, an extension out beyond the boundaries of the senses. Gautama spoke of such an extension. He described “the excellence of the heart’s release” through the extension of compassion and sympathetic joy through the four quarters of the world, as well as above and below--an extension without limit. That “excellence of the heart’s release”, he said, was a state of concentration called “the infinity of consciousness”. Perhaps that’s why my friend feels that consciousness has no location—he’s tuned in, somehow, to the experience of “the infinity of consciousness”. Nevertheless, when Gautama addressed the wanderer Udayin, he said: Udayin, as an emerald jewel, of all good qualities, might be strung on a thread, blue-green or yellow or red or white or orange coloured; and a [person] with vision, having put it in [their] hand, might reflect; ‘this emerald jewel… is strung on a thread, blue-green… or orange-coloured’–even so, Udayin, a course has been pointed out by me for disciples, practising which disciples of mine know thus: This body of mine… is of a nature to be constantly rubbed away… and scattered, but this consciousness is fastened there, bound there…. (work in progress, for my website) The actualization of the inconceivable is the doing without a doer: (For one) knowing thus, seeing thus, there are no latent conceits that ‘I am the doer, mine is the doer’ in regard to this consciousness-informed body. (MN III 18-19, Pali Text Society III pg 68)
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Gautama was not always nice. “[Gautama] spoke thus to the monk Sati, a fisherman’s son, as he was sitting down at a respectful distance: ‘Is it true, as is said, that a pernicious view like this has accrued to you, Sati: “In so far as I understand [the truth] taught by [Gautama], it is that this consciousness itself runs on, fares on, not another”?’ ‘Even so do I… understand [the teaching] ….’ ‘What is this consciousness, Sati?’ ‘It is this… that speaks, that feels, that experiences now here, now there, the fruition of deeds that are lovely and that are depraved.’ [Gautama rebukes Sati for his misrepresentation of Gautama’s teaching, and continues:] It is because… an appropriate condition arises that consciousness is known by this or that name: if consciousness arises because of eye and material shapes, it is known as visual consciousness; if consciousness arises because of ear and sounds, it is known as auditory consciousness; [so for the nose/smells/olfactory consciousness, tongue/tastes/gustatory consciousness, body/touches/tactile consciousness, mind/mental objects/mental consciousness]. …As a fire burns because of this or that appropriate condition, by that it is known: if a fire burns because of sticks, it is known as a stick-fire; and if a fire burns because of chips, it is known as a chip-fire; … and so with regard to grass, cow-dung, chaff, and rubbish.” (Pali Text Soceity MN I 258-259, Vol I p 313-315) "... a pernicious view like this has accrued to you, Sati"--not nice, Mr. G! Meanwhile, Sati is thinking: It's good to be enlightened, if just for a while To be there in velvet, yeah, to give 'em a smile It's good to get high and never come down It's good to be the enlightened one in your own little town Yeah, the world would brighten, oh, if I were enlightened Can I help it if I still dream time to time (Tom Petty, "It's Good to be King", slightly modified)
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Wowza! Enlightened! "live out this present moment" so, each to their own
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Everybody just loves the Pali sermons, in my opinion (@Nungali). What, that's unpopular?
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Or that grasping after self in any of the five aggregates is identically suffering.
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The means: …And again, Ananda, [an individual], not attending to the perception of the plane of no-thing, not attending to the perception of the plane of neither-perception-nor-non-perception, attends to the solitude of mind that is signless. [Their] mind is satisfied with, pleased with, set on and freed in the concentration of mind that is signless. [They] comprehends thus, ‘This concentration of mind that is signless is effected and thought out. But whatever is effected and thought out, that is impermanent, it is liable to stopping.’ When [the individual] knows this thus, sees this thus, [their] mind is freed from the canker of sense-pleasures and [their] mind is freed from the canker of becoming and [their] mind is freed from the canker of ignorance. In freedom is the knowledge that [one] is freed and [one] comprehends: “Destroyed is birth, brought to a close the (holy)-faring, done is what was to be done, there is no more of being such or so’. [They] comprehend thus: “The disturbances there might be resulting from the canker of sense-pleasures do not exist here; the disturbances there might be resulting from the canker of becoming do not exist here; the disturbances there might be resulting from the canker of ignorance do not exist here. And there is only this degree of disturbance, that is to say the six sensory fields that, conditioned by life, are grounded on this body itself. [One] regards that which is not there as empty of it. But in regard to what remains [one] comprehends: 'That being, this is.' Thus, Ananda, this comes to be for [such a one] s true, not mistaken, utterly purified and incomparably highest realisation of emptiness. ("Lesser Discourse on Emptiness", Culasunnatasutta, Pali Text Society MN III 121 vol III p 151-2) The truth: When [one] has seen a material shape through the eye, [one] does not feel attraction for agreeable material shapes, [one] does not feel repugnance for disagreeable material shapes; and (one] dwells with mindfulness aroused as to the body… [One] who has thus got rid of compliance and antipathy, whatever feeling [that person] feels-pleasant or painful or neither painful nor pleasant [one] does not delight in that feeling, does not welcome it or persist in cleaving to it. From not delighting in that feeling … , from not welcoming it, from not persisting in cleaving to it, whatever was delight in those feelings is stopped. From the stopping of [one’s] delight is the stopping of grasping; from the stopping of grasping is the stopping of becoming; from the stopping of becoming is the stopping of birth; from the stopping of birth, old age and dying, grief, sorrow, suffering, lamentation and despair are stopped. Such is the stopping of this entire mass of anguish [similarly for sound/the ear, scent/the nose, savor/the tongue, touch/the body, mental object/the mind]. (Pali Text Society MN Vol I p 323-324) Here the stopping of one condition is the stopping of all subsequent conditions, including the condition of anguish. The first condition in the chain above is delight in a feeling. Elsewhere in the Sutta, “feeling” appears as the sixth condition of a larger chain; the enlarged set is referred to as “conditioned genesis” (Pali Text Society MN III 63-64, Vol III p 107), or “the causal law” (Pali Text Society SN II 2, Vol II p 2): Conditioned by ignorance activities come to pass; conditioned by activities consciousness, conditioned by consciousness name-and-shape, conditioned by name-and-shape sense, conditioned by sense contact, conditioned by contact feeling, conditioned by feeling craving, conditioned by craving grasping, conditioned by grasping becoming, conditioned by becoming birth, conditioned by birth old-age-and-death, grief, lamenting, suffering, sorrow, despair come to pass. Such is the uprising of this entire mass of ill. (Pali Text Society SN II 2, Vol II p 2) (Making Sense of the Pali Canon: the Wheel of the Sayings) "The activities" are the habitual or volitive actions of speech, deed, or thought. "birth, old-age-and-death, grief, lamenting, suffering, sorrow, and despair" Gautama referred to as "in short, the five groups of grasping."
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Gautama said that the mindfulness he recommended was his way of living, when he was “as yet the bodhisattva” (before his enlightenment). He identified the same mindfulness as “the Tathagatha’s way of living” (his way of living after enlightenment). Such a mindfulness was, he said, something “peaceful and choice, something perfect in itself, and a pleasant way of living too” (Pali Text Society SN V p 285). Many people in the Buddhist community take enlightenment to be the goal of Buddhist practice. I would say that when a person consciously experiences automatic movement in the activity of the body in inhalation and exhalation, finding a way of life that allows for such experience in the natural course of things becomes the more pressing concern. Gautama taught such a way of living, although I don’t believe that such a way of living is unique to Buddhism. (A Way of Living)
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end goal is Daoism ( and comparison to Buddhism's end goal )
Mark Foote replied to snowymountains's topic in Daoist Discussion
I can't claim experience of the signless concentration (or what follows), either! -
If you come across something in the sutta or vinaya, I'd love to hear it. I have only one confirmation of my understanding that metta meditation was fairly recent, but that was from a Buddhist who had lived some time in Southeast Asia.
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Love the anime avatar. How about: In one of his lectures, Shunryu Suzuki spoke about the difference between “preparatory practice” and “shikantaza”, or “just sitting”: But usually in counting breathing or following breathing, you feel as if you are doing something, you know– you are following breathing, and you are counting breathing. This is, you know, why counting breathing or following breathing practice is, you know, for us it is some preparation– preparatory practice for shikantaza because for most people it is rather difficult to sit, you know, just to sit. (“The Background of Shikantaza”, Shunryu Suzuki; San Francisco, February 22, 1970) Suzuki said that directing attention to the movement of breath (“following breathing… counting breathing”) has the feeling of “doing something”, and that “doing something” makes such practice only preparatory. Although attention can be directed to the movement of breath, necessity in the movement of breath can also direct attention, as I wrote previously: There can… come a moment when the movement of breath necessitates the placement of attention at a certain location in the body, or at a series of locations, with the ability to remain awake as the location of attention shifts retained through the exercise of presence. There’s a frailty in the structure of the lower spine, and the movement of breath can place the point of awareness in such a fashion as to engage a mechanism of support for the spine, often in stages. (Shunryu Suzuki on Shikantaza and the Theravadin Stages) You are not your body, but you are the consciousness in the body, because of which you have the awareness of “I am”. It is without words, just pure beingness. Meditation means you have to hold consciousness by itself. The consciousness should give attention to itself. (Gaitonde, Mohan [2017]. Self – Love: The Original Dream [Shri Nisargadatta Maharaj’s Direct Pointers to Reality]. Mumbai: Zen Publications. ISBN 978-9385902833) Given a presence of mind that can “hold consciousness by itself”, activity in the body begins to coordinate by virtue of the sense of place associated with consciousness. A relationship between the free location of consciousness and activity in the body comes forward, and as that relationship comes forward, “practice occurs”. Through such practice, the placement of consciousness is manifested in the activity of the body. ... activity can take place solely by virtue of the free location of consciousness. A relationship between the freedom of consciousness and the automatic activity of the body comes forward, and as that relationship comes forward, practice occurs. Through such practice, the placement of consciousness is manifested as the activity of the body. ("Take the Backward Step") Easiest time to discover necessity placing awareness is just before falling asleep.
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My understanding is that Metta meditation was an invention of the 18th century, in Burma or Thailand. If you can quote from the Pali sutta or vinaya, that would clarify things.
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end goal is Daoism ( and comparison to Buddhism's end goal )
Mark Foote replied to snowymountains's topic in Daoist Discussion
Stirling would probably agree with you. Can I point out that Gautama's insight came about with his attainment of "the cessation of feeling and perceiving", which Gautama identified as a concentration? Had this debate with stirling the other day--is it insight into emptiness, or is it the experience of cause and effect empty of anything else? …And again, Ananda, [an individual], not attending to the perception of the plane of no-thing, not attending to the perception of the plane of neither-perception-nor-non-perception, attends to the solitude of mind that is signless. [Their] mind is satisfied with, pleased with, set on and freed in the concentration of mind that is signless. [They] comprehends thus, ‘This concentration of mind that is signless is effected and thought out. But whatever is effected and thought out, that is impermanent, it is liable to stopping.’ When [the individual] knows this thus, sees this thus, [their] mind is freed from the canker of sense-pleasures and [their] mind is freed from the canker of becoming and [their] mind is freed from the canker of ignorance. In freedom is the knowledge that [one] is freed and [one] comprehends: “Destroyed is birth, brought to a close the (holy)-faring, done is what was to be done, there is no more of being such or so’. [They] comprehend thus: “The disturbances there might be resulting from the canker of sense-pleasures do not exist here; the disturbances there might be resulting from the canker of becoming do not exist here; the disturbances there might be resulting from the canker of ignorance do not exist here. And there is only this degree of disturbance, that is to say the six sensory fields that, conditioned by life, are grounded on this body itself. [One] regards that which is not there as empty of it. But in regard to what remains [one] comprehends: 'That being, this is.' Thus, Ananda, this comes to be for [such a one] s true, not mistaken, utterly purified and incomparably highest realisation of emptiness. ("Lesser Discourse on Emptiness", Culasunnatasutta, Pali Text Society MN III 121 vol III p 151-2) As to the eight-fold path, there's this: (Anyone)…knowing and seeing eye as it really is, knowing and seeing material shapes… visual consciousness… impact on the eye as it really is, and knowing, seeing as it really is the experience, whether pleasant, painful, or neither painful nor pleasant, that arises conditioned by impact on the eye, is not attached to the eye nor to material shapes nor to visual consciousness nor to impact on the eye; and that experience, whether pleasant, painful, or neither painful nor pleasant, that arises conditioned by impact on the eye—neither to that is (such a one) attached. …(Such a one’s) physical anxieties decrease, and mental anxieties decrease, and bodily torments… and mental torments… and bodily fevers decrease, and mental fevers decrease. (Such a one) experiences happiness of body and happiness of mind. (repeated for ear, nose, tongue, body, and mind). Whatever is the view of what really is, that for (such a one) is right view; whatever is aspiration for what really is, that for (such a one) is right aspiration; whatever is endeavour for what really is, that is for (such a one) right endeavour; whatever is mindfulness of what really is, that is for (such a one) right mindfulness; whatever is concentration on what really is, that is for (such a one) right concentration. And (such a one’s) past acts of body, acts of speech, and mode of livelihood have been well purified. (Pali Text Society MN III p 337-338) I gather that he's talking about knowing the eye and the rest as 'That being, this is.' -
Keith Gronendyke: Clear Lake, California