Maddie

I do several practices, 8 brocades, MCO/cold draw, inner smile/healing sounds, ect... I guess in my case what I noticed is that where as I used to want to be around people as a distraction from my own emotional issues, now that such issues are improving and I feel a lot more stable emotionally I no longer have the reasons to seek out company that I used to. I guess I've become more content with myself and since a lot of other people have issues that they do not deal with or even acknowlege they are not so pleseant to be around.

Again I don't think that energy and psychology are really two separate things, just different perspectives of looking at the same thing, or different manifestations of the same thing. Energy affects psychology and vice versa. The way we think affects our energy, and the state of our energy affects our thinking.

If that works let me know lol ... seriously. IMO if you don't feel ok with masturbating then don't, perhaps that is what your body is telling you, as everyone's individual needs are different. One thing that I just recently came to realize is that as I was adding my cold draw jing to my sacral charka and the blockages there were opening up, I realized how large a part guilt and shame about seuxal issues had been playing in my life and I didn't even realize it. Guilt is considered to be a sacral chakra issue and so I guess it should have come as no supprise that as I worked on that chakra that I became aware of how this issue had been effecting me. Anyways I'd say if you don't feel ok with masturbating then don't, there is nothing that says you have to do it lol. Rather use the cold draw which does not use self stimulation.

As with all the other issues I have dealt with while on TTB I have been doing a fair amount of research into this issue, and so far the most likely explination I have come up with for these money issues I have is that its a Root chakra issue, as the root chakra has to do with issues concerning physical survivial (money and rent). Since I have begun to do the cold draw I have sort of been in a hurry to resolve sexual issues and sort of wisked all that jing past my root chakra point straight to my sacral chakra area. On that note I suppose that the thing to do is to focus now on my root chakra and see what results I get from that. The fact that I have gotten very good results from focusing on my sacral chakra encourages me to try this with my root chakra now.

Fire Dragon First thing that immediately came to mind when you said that when you practice retention you get more/strange dreams is that, the Jing you are saving is rising to your upper dan tien and clearing out blockages there. Specifically the Jade Pillow which is at the back of your head where the spine enters the skull, for this is the back door of the upper dan tien, and the point on your MCO responsible for dreams and abstraction. Another thing I have also noticed about the big draw vs cold draw is the same observation as you made. When I as doing the big draw I seemed to attract girls like honey does bees. Now that I do the cold draw I feel like I have turned into the invisible man lol. So the outward effect that it has is very stark, yet so is the inward effect too. When I was doing the big draw I was in a perpetual state of horniness, and now that I do the cold draw I am almost never horny. So I guess when I decide to end my celebate phase of my life I know which practice to switch to lol . As far as the debate about weather celibacy is with or with out masturbation, again I don't think it has to be either or. For now that I am doing the cold draw there is no masturbation at all, as I don't have the desire to do so, and also it is not part of the cold draw practice. Of course when one does the big draw masturbation is pretty much required to stir up the jing. In both cases there is celibacy (assuming one does the big draw solo) because there is no contact with a woman, its just the two practices of celibacy have different goals and different methods.

I think that just like we has humans have more than one dimension so does sexuality. I think that it has a physical side (obviously) emotional, spiritual, ect... To say its either/or is missing the point. I do believe that there is a very strong physical aspect to sex as any dr. will tell you in regards to the hormones n such. I don't believe that the only indication of physical withdraw is death, but there can be other sypmtoms of withdraw. I believe I have/had been experiencing these symptoms over the past few months as I stopped "cold turkey" and began to experience extreme fatigue to a degree I have rarely encountered. The next thing I experienced after I did not have the contiunal distraction of lust to numb me I then began to realize how much of sexuality was also emotional. Keep in mind that at this point the physcial drive was no longer much of a factor, yet this seemed to make the emotional aspect all the more LOUD. So I have experienced lately both aspects of this multifaceted subject.

I guess a drawback would be that the longer I practice the less and less I feel that I have in common with most people.

Yea I requested one of those before too, but I guess getting one has been about as sucessful as the rest of what I do lol. p.s. btw I found your article interesting

ok now my "WTF" sing above my head is huge and blinking. Since I got to San Antonio I have been told by two places that they would hire me. The first place still says that they are waiting for "paperwork" and this is after a month practically. I was supposedly hired for another job the day before last and was supposed to start today and then they called me last night and said they are reevaluating the possition. Before I came to Texas the only thing I could find was delivering pizza, and before I came to Washington, I was working for Starbucks in Alaska. Before returning to Alaska I had tried to move to Texas before and spent 7 months looking for a job, and finding nothing. I could go on, but I think just that little sample is enough to get the gist of my career life. It's not because I don't want a job, or money, or anything like that, cause I do, in fact I have no idea how I am going to pay my rent, so wanting money is the first thing on my mind right now. I see other boobs with less education, intelligence, and work ethic than me get these pretty good jobs, and so I'm left standing there with the big neon "WTF" sign over my head. In a past life was I a big fat capitalist pig who paid his workers low wages like Scrouge? I'm so utter fed up with this, as it has been going on for a long time and I'm sick of it. What the hell do I need to do to change this?

For the goals that I had/have it is working extremely effectively.

In his ebook he does say that the problem with porn is that it makes people into objects, and he did not say its wrong to masturbate.

I am not practicing celibacy now NOT because I think sex is bad, I am doing it in order to use all of that energy for healing purposes, and I don't plan on doing it forever either. There is no sinful/bad aspect in this.

I agree with your divorce comments 100%, and thanks. As far as when I knew the energy was clearing out emotional blocks, it was pretty fast for me as well. I started doing the cold draw and almost immediately all the old baggage came up for me as well, which is how I figured out what was going on. One day no cold draw, the next day you do it and poof up comes the old baggaeg and you deal with your issues. And no I was not expecting it cause I didn't remember reading about that aspect of it in Chia's book. Why? have you begun doing the cold draw with the same effect as well?

Nor do I, but I do think that it plays an important role, as I have found after eliminating the physical aspect (which definately was an aspect) *edit: thought this BF article was appropriate to this thread http://www.taichimaster.com/taoist-sexual-practices/sex-for-seniors/

Just read that e-book, it was very interesting :-)

This I have found to be more true than I could have ever imagined. I began doing the cold draw a few months ago with the goal of eliminating my sex drive, and for the physical aspect of this it was very effective. So I thought "ok problem solved" .... wrong. I then began to experience how much of our sexuality is not physical (even though that is a component) but psychological. I had no physical desire yet my mind kept right on trucking. I then had to begin a new process of dealing with the pyscho/emotional aspects of sexuality even though I had no real physical desire so to speak of.

Manitou You know its been a very interesting time since you write your first responce yesterday. It was like as soon as I read the sentence where you mentioned a childhood memeory it was like *poof out of no where came back that McDonald's memory out of no where. Then later that evening I was at the gym working out a bit. In comes this very pretty girl (and the fact that I am in celibate monk mode at the moment is besides the point). I finally caught myself hearing this automatic voice in my head that said "you don't deserve her". Now I am no longer even thinking about the girl, but about that automatic voice in my head, which I realized had been speaking to me for a very long time, but I did not realize it. So then I realized that this voice inside me had been telling me for a long time not only that I did not deserve a nice girl, but that I did not deserve pretty much anything nice at all. I think I was almost more shocked that I actually realized what had been going on than anything. So this morning I woke up and its time for my morning Qigong practice. I was still thinking about this incident last night so I decided I would try to figue out where this "voice" was coming from and work on that. I decided to start with my spleen since that is the organ that is all about worry. I theorized that perhaps that I worry about rejection when it comes to pretty girls. So after a few minuets of doing the spleen inner smile and healing sound I just did not feel like I was hitting "pay dirt". So I stopped and decided that a voice saying "you are not good enough, you don't deserve that" is not a voice of worry, but a voice of anger and meaness. So I began to do the same thing but this time with my liver, and bigo I instantly hit pay dirt. As I began the inner smile and healing sounds in my liver all these repressed memories that I had totally forgottn of my father always telling me "you don't deserve this or that" just came bubbeling up and rushing out. Then all these feelings from varoius points in my life of not being good enough for good things came out as well. Then I got extemely tired which sort of goes along with another issue I have been facing and trying to figure out lately as well, and this is my fatigue I have been experiencing. I'm starting to really believe that any kind of detox process either physical or energetic uses a large amount of energy, because everytime I do something where I feel like I make progess in removing a blockage (which I have been doing a lot of lately) I feel totally exhausted aferwards. In this case today it happened to be my liver, but pretty much every day lately I am finding something somewhere and removing it and then feeling totally drained afterwards. I guess all the things that I mentioned and have been talking about lately are somehow realted.

I've found that the Tao in some ways resembles the Christian concept of god in someways, but not perfectly. Also the more gnostic epistles and gosples of the new testament seem to be more similar to the tao than the old testament/ torah version of Jehova who was always angery and jealous. What I mean is that all things come from the Tao, so you have that parallel with the creator god. But on the other hand the Tao is less of a personality and less personal than the god of the bible. So in some ways the tao seems to fit some of the characteristics of god, and in other ways it does not. But perhaps that is because the tao that can be named is not the tao, so if you try to slap a lable on it like "god" then you just lost it lol.

I think this is a good question because it strips away everything else and gets to the basics of who we really are. As buddah said the problem is attachment and that would include people as well I suppose. I have been asking myself this question now that I have separated from my wife. I know a lot of people go straight to their rebound relationships, but to me that says that they as an individual are not complete, and lacking something within themselves, and thus need another person to fill the void in them. So rather than seek a rebound relationship(s) I have been looking inward and when I do feel this urge I try to find out what is lacking within. If the primary urge is one for the desire for physical pleasure, or companionship, or love, or what ever, I try to find the part of me that is lacking on the inside and fill this with my own energy. So far it seems to be working quite well, even though it is not instinct. If we could get to the point that we would not need or have to be around anyone would this not indicate that we have completed ourselves and have no lack within?

Ok finally I've get a response that is of the type I was looking for lol. Do you do this shaministic viewing yourself? One thing you said that rang a bell is that I distinctly remember when I was in 4th grade being at McDonalds eating one of their crappy burgers and I started crying cause I was thinking of all the starving kids in India, and also mad cause it seemed like none of the fat kids stuffing their faces could have cared less, and I felt kind of ashamed about it all. Plus my father was/is an oil company exectutive and a huge arse as well and I really don't want to be like him at all. Perhaps I came to associate making large amounts of money with being greedy, selfish, arrogant in my subconscience? *edit: oh and admittidly I tend towards the idealistic side of things, and I don't think these kinds of people tend to make lots of money

Yes

was wondering what it is that ginseng does for you or gives to you, cause it seems to be the only thing that helps me wiht fatigue?

how do you know which steps I have made or not made? I just earned a Bachelors degree, I have a medical assistant diploma, I opened a cafe for a while, I have done all the things that they say you should do, and that others have done sucessfully and still..... so this is why at this point in my life I'm holding the big "WTF" sign over my head and wondering what the hell is up??!!

Um so far I have not really seen much of a taoist explination. If I had wanted the typical western point of view on this I would not have asked on this forum. I'm looking for a "bigger picture" explination.

I've been enjoying readin about everyone's schedules, here is mine .... wake up in the morning, take a warm to hot shower to wake up and get the funk off. do 8 brocades for roughly 20 min some form of sitting meditation, either inner smile / healing sounds, and/or cold draw/ MCO, and/or reverse adbominal breathing. have tea or coffee usually by lunch time or the afternoon a speicif issues has arisen which needs my focused attention, for example if I find myself worrying too much I'll focus on doing the spleen inner smile and healing sound. in the evening if I feel its necessary I'll do the cold draw and/or abdominal breathing again