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The first and only time i had a similar 'occurrence' was back in '96. I remember the year clearly because it was during a one-year retreat that it decided to show up. I was doing some rather intense visualizations then. It baffled me. I thought it was some kind of a breakthrough, and was feeling quite pleased with myself. All thru that evening, and during the early part of the next day, i was wearing a smug look on my face. Did not think it was that obvious until the Retreat Guide pulled me to one side and hinted that he knew something had appeared to me by saying, "Whatever you think it is, its not...". That got me curious, so i related the drama to him, and he then told me that its something that is frequently perceptible during those times when we make a conscious, concerted effort to move the consciousness/awareness around. Its a sign of adjustment, because the awareness is also like a muscle. Alas, my joy was short-lived... I do not practice Taoist energetic works, so i cannot ascertain if its an identical thing. It did sound similar though when i read your query. Wish you the very best in your practice.

You know what DP - what you said did not even cross my mind haha - good of you to mention it though. I did a quickie search and this is what i found - http://wiki.answers.com/Q/How_many_syllables_does_the_word_child_have We live and learn i suppose... ... ... ... Where ev'ryone wins? A game where no one loses How 'bout Solitaire?

"Another oil well gushin'"..... maybe? that makes 7... ... ... ... Nature gets the flush while we humans got 'Full House' thats poker for you...

I am curious as to how you came to form the view that 'others' were being ignorant by expressing their doubts and fears with regards to what they perceived in KAP to be lacking in authenticity? No personal attacks were made, as far as i can see. I do not believe that KAP has been established long enough to get into mainstream yet, and in the meantime, might be served well to take people's views and opinions on board, those that are relevant, of course, with the aim of honing the system further. This is not so bad is it? It does not appear that KAP is above and beyond comparison, and if someone chooses to make this very comparison, it is after all made with the desire to point out certain perceived flaws that has been noticed. If these flaws are minor/nonexistent in KAP's eyes, by all means brush them off, but if there could be areas to improve and fine-tune, heck, be thankful for the input! Looking at this from a more positive angle, one could well say that criticisms are great - it generates publicity, and keeps people on their toes lest there be some complacency hidden from view. In most cases, how criticisms are handled says much about the maturity of those at the receiving end. Just because someone feels that there is something not too right happening does not mean they are out to destroy anything, reputations for one. If the system is workable, then there ought not to be any need to defend any perceived abuse or attacks. These are bound to take place, and one should not be overly concerned when it happens. Have you taken KAP? If yes, then it would be interesting to hear of your personal experience of shaktipat/Kundalini through that. If not, how do you vouch for its authenticity? Certainly not by calling out others' abusiveness and ignorance, i hope.

A taoist sage who has retired up to mountains no longer has any need for the restrictions of free will... Go figure By retiring to the mountains, it is a symbol of returning to the source from whence the sage came. He or she comes out of the universe, and in leaving all cares behind, returns to the Mother/Womb of Creation. Its a symbolic journey undertaken by all 'warriors of the heart' who seek re-union with their true face. Funnily though, the masses often use the common phrase, "I came into existence, or, I came into this world..." - how about saying "I came out of existence?" After all, the universe is governed by blind energy, and it is from this blind energy that all things are formed, and will forever continue to be re-formed. In many ways, the human race has evolved not by order, but from chaos. Things just happened the way it happened - a very astounding fluke shot, very often seen in a game of snooker or pool, a similar principle in action. In this view, it is difficult to say with conviction that Man has absolute free will. He may want to believe He does, but that does not alter the very real limits of His choices. Alan Watts said, "Humans grow out of the universe in exactly the same fashion that apples grow out of apple trees". That is the degree of one's relatively restricted Free Will. It is free within constraints and boundaries, only as far as the limits of our human-ness would allow. In that we find the limitations of Free Will. It is when the boundary walls that hold us captive within this 'humanhood' collapses, that both Free Will and its horrible twin becomes totally meaningless, and we become like the sage who has gone up the mountain. What is astonishing and reassuring to know is that, even though some remove themselves physically to an inner sanctum, mentally they are still caught up in, as Ninpo puts it nicely, the mores of human-ness, while on the other hand, there are those who are shackled to the mores physically, yet mentally and spiritually their inner being moves unrestricted in those places that we can only dream or philosophize about (like i am doing now - shame on me!) It may serve us well to remember that Free Will and the lack thereof are both notions created as a kind of convenience, for in truth, they are both Chains that bind - one made of gold, the other of iron. Those that want to believe they possess Free Will (as though we can really possess anything by choice) are merely enmeshed by a shinier, glossier fetter. My 2 pence piece.

Nothing to counter argue with really. There are many plausible, often seamless explanations that point to the validity of Rebirth, some of which you have come up with here, for example. Having said that, i do have a number of Buddhist friends (you might know a few yourself? ) who prefer to remain non-committal on this subject, citing, among others, these points that some might find to be reasonable considerations: The idea that there is an absence of a uniform doctrine of Rebirth in the tradition as a whole. At best, what is offered up is mostly fragmented information, with each tradition/school/sect having their own interpretation of the mechanics involved, thus lacking any solid foundation and coherence. If its a doctrinal fact, then why do Buddhists from different cultures allow in cultural influences to shape their thoughts on the matter? If its really that vital a doctrine, shouldn't it be above any man-made, glossy, superficial tints? Lastly, they ask why, even after more than 2500 years since the Buddha first spoke about attaining the insight that enabled Him to see all His past lives, nothing has really been built upon since then in regards to Rebirth. One would think that at the very least, there ought to exist now a stronger body of verifiable data and/or empirical evidence so that the ambiguity surrounding Rebirth and Reincarnation could be put to rest once and for all, or have lessened to a greater degree at least. In other words, they cannot understand why, for a philosophy that claims to be so profound, so full of truth, to this day, has yet to offer any concrete and practicable mechanical structure (about the processes of Rebirth) for followers to work with, so that fundamental doubts and pitfalls could be side-stepped, in the process saving a lot of speculative, energy-sapping homework and cushion time. What is available now seems only to serve in compounding the discrepancies already found floating around the subject. For those that deliberated on the points in question, they concluded that unless and until all the various schools can come to a clear, universal agreement as to what exactly constitutes Rebirth, how it happens in relation to Interdependent Origination, what is that which is reborn, all this, with sufficiently relevant, even basic evidence offered up in support, they would choose in the meantime to remain as they are: open, non-committed, and for some, with a degree of skepticism thrown in. Fair enough, i thought...

A favorite piece here - evokes images and moods of transcendental realms

events per second fleeting moments called lifetimes seldom fully lived...

Here is an alternative form of natural sugar that can be used if anyone is looking for alternatives to current sugar forms: (its a sugar supposedly permitted in Ayurveda, in limited amounts) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jaggery

You are correct Gold - its only an assumption. I could well be as far off the mark as 99.99% of the people who attempt to unravel this humongous enigma. It was not my intention to promote the idea that the personality is permanent. I could not see where in my post did that idea present itself. Must be quite blind, again. Of course i agree that there is always only evolvement - in life, as in at death, and beyond. But these very terms used in the post, ie personality, persona, and personhood, implicitly denotes evolutionary change of the 'self'. After all, these are all acquired formations of the self, dependent on multi-faceted stimulations of the 6 senses, and as such will carry on changing and evolving at the grosser physical levels until the very last exhalation. Perhaps a better rephrasing of "One dies with each breath" would be "One changes with each breath" - how is that? I agree that dying is an every-moment thing, but then, as we all know, so is living. I keep having to remind myself not to fixate on these matters too much. Its been years since i overcame the illusion of how defeating it can be to view life and death as a personal luxury afforded only to those who choose to overvalue the self. Inflation/recession can happen on a personal, micro scale too! In my mind, there are 2 ways to look at memories - one, they are to be cherished, and two, they are to be buried. The tendency is to focus on the cherishable ones and ignore those that are rather unpleasant. Being a bit Buddhish, i try to see through to the underlying causes of both, and reach some kind of middle ground where pleasant and unpleasant memories are herded. In this regard, the need to chase after one and fumble around with the other becomes less fundamental and weighty.

In my view, its not possible. If we reflect on the initial formation(at birth) and subsequent dissolution of the persona at the point of death, we can at least understand why it is not seen as a possibility. I am hedging that the personality dissolves at death, and since memories are inextricably linked with personhood, i cannot fathom how memories that obviously belong in one plane of existence can be carried over to another more mysterious and subtle plane. I have no wish to get into some sort of metaphysical tangle over this - suffice to say that in my opinion, memories are not stored in some external locale, hence it ends at the point of the physical dissolution of the body. What happens after death can at best be only speculations and conjectures. I am prone to believe that one enters death, like birth, with a sense of not knowing anything. As the new journey unfolds, we pick things up along the way, and with these new 'memories' the deathscapes are traversed - eventually these 'new' imprints then determine the sort of rebirth we take. However, i am almost certain that what is picked up during the death phase is wholly determined by what has been discarded and renounced in the previous phase (this life). While we cannot bring the gross memories with us, it is plausible that what gets to overflow into death are the energetic traces that are predominant while the person was alive. This is why learning and practicing the right methods and meditations are so crucial, and so is having a general wholesome outlook and compassionate attitude. Just as we sleep better after having a good day, doing all the wholesome things, likewise, we tend to die better after we have had a gentle, integrated, honest and noble life, having done all things wholesome. Concluding with this quote: "Searching all directions with one's awareness, one finds no one dearer than oneself. In the same way, others are fiercely dear to themselves. So one should not hurt others if one loves oneself." (Raja Sutta - translation by Thanissaro Bhikkhu)

haha you are always running away... Sorry about this - i believe Susan addressed some of these points as i was drafting the post which you quoted from. It happens. If i had the good sense to browse down before i hit the 'Add Reply' button, it would have earned you some extra cushion time i guess... Cheerio! Have a good sitting session!

Thanks to Bob, Michael L, Kate and Scott for taking the time to say a few words. Very interesting inputs indeed! Within the limits of my logic, i am assuming that deity manifestations are usually related to the culture that each 'manifestee' [plural: applies both to the devotee and the deity that appears] belongs to (Ya Mu shares this opinion). This excludes the considerations of those who enter trances and/or perform willful astral projections into other dimensions to obtain empowerment or release. In such cases i would then theorise that a multitude of energetic forms may arise, depending on how many dimensions are unlocked and scaled. In Susan's account, she was completely lucid when K graced her the very first time. The fact that she remembers in such great detail makes me believe that she was anyway. Apologies in advance if this is overly presumptuous. She remarked that she was a Christian fundamentalist to the core prior to that moment, so THAT i found quite astounding. I mean, how, if she had never known these personages existed, that they chose to appear to her, as clear as daylight, in their original forms? Theoretically, Susan could easily have taken the whole experience as a deeply transformational, divine descent of the Holy Spirit upon her, an intense baptism of 'fire', so to speak, whereupon the possibility of coming out of the experience with a renewed sense of faith in her native religion would be greatly enhanced, and she would then find the profundity of that instance concreting her fundamentalist views even deeper - but that never happened! Instead, she knew almost instantly and instinctively what the unfolding of that event meant - that her spiritual path was forever altered from that time on. She was then prompted to put a 'frame' on the experience by making some references/research, which subsequently confirmed her initial instincts of what had transpired at that K awakening moment. Logically, as Kate had implied, we tend to lean towards the personages we fancy, and run from those that we have aberrated views of, or from those who are not within the field of our consciousness (as Ya Mu puts it nicely, "those who are not sitting at our Council Table ). Even if we do not run from fear, the normal reaction when we are 'hit' by something unfamiliar would be to initially be full of wariness of the occurrence. In Susan's case, this was very much countered. There was some fear, but i think due to her past good karmic connections, there was also a deep sense of familiarity, although not clear at that time. Maybe what happened in Susan's instance was rather exceptional. I don't know, and would love to find out more. Thanks!

Hi there Susan! Thanks for sharing your 'Kundalini' experiences. Interesting to note that you had mentioned in one of your earlier posts that Kundalini transcends cultures, yet it appears here that the personages that initially appeared to you are all very culturally Indian. I find this rather thought-provoking, and was wondering if you have some explanation to share in this regard? ... ... ... ... ... ... I have met and spoken to many individuals who have exposed themselves to the grace of Kundalini, and have so far yet to meet one that said, for example, that personages of the Christian Saints, Archangels and Angels appeared to them. I find this quite strange. One would assume that since its an experience that is supposedly universal, there would at least be some recounted instances where Images other than those symbolically associated within the iconography of Hindu gods/goddesses appeared. In addition, i have also met many Christians who have had transformational, life-altering pentecostal experiences, yet none of those i have spoken to have hinted that saints and angels from other traditions and faiths have appeared to them. Its always only the Holy Spirit. I am hazarding a guess that it would have been deemed totally sacrilegious if someone, during a pentecostal service, were to spontaneously scream Hail Krishna or Praise be to Shakti! Has anyone here come across any such instances? (i am imagining now what a scene it would be if such an occurrence were to take place... ) Cheers! ps - Loke brought up a good question. I too am interested to hear some feedback in that regard.

Someone shared this mesmerizing, sublime music video with me today, and thought it would be so nice to share it with you all:

play it for me, Sam this kaleidoscopic dream wonder of wonders...

Hey Seth - I believe the researcher you are referring to is Dr Ian Stevenson. Btw, the Bardos are not the monopoly of lamas, and its understanding is actually more relevant to living than dying. For those who wish to grasp the fundamental significance of the Bardo, simply pay attention to the breath... notice the intermediate point, that gap between the in-breath and the out-breath? That is a bardo. In plain language, 'Bardo' means 'transition', the cognizant yet empty phase when one moment ends and before the next moment arises. It is this, and only this phase where the potential for transformation is at its peak. Why else would cultivators and seekers from across all traditions and cultures place such astoundingly heavy emphasis on 'stillness'? What is this 'stillness'? In which bodily function can one begin to familiarise oneself with this 'stillness', if not the breath? When i first learnt about the bardos and how it relates to the breath, it dawned on me then that the intervals between inhalations(yang) and exhalations(yin) are nothing but 'little opportunities' to experience the Absolute. As time passed, these intervals have stretched a bit, so its quite nice like this...

is it real, or not? mysterious and deep, the plot leaves us all in knots...

Interesting post Markern. Looking at what you said with Eastern eyes, i would say the East will never (want to) catch up with the West. Let me try to offer this view for your consideration: True spiritual paths, from the Eastern perspective, is about distillation, to always get the cream of the crop, so to speak. Just this as an example: A master oversees a monastery of 300 monks and lay practitioners. Out of these 300, some will drop out gradually, due to various reasons. Maybe some of these drop-outs were only there in transition, or were homeless, or out of plain hunger and destitution. It happens. Then the numbers shrink. Out of those that remain, maybe a dozen or so are really genuinely sincere about their desire to cultivate and/or serve the community as a monk. The rest are simply going thru the motions, occupying space. And out of this dozen or so, the master might eventually select only one or two to impart the 'higher' and 'deeper' teachings. Or he might see none among the group capable of absorbing and assimilating the deeper levels of the teachings. Then he picks none, and waits for the next batch of novices. He is never in a hurry to transmit. For him, numbers are insignificant, and for this, the lineage is carefully safeguarded and preserved. Its not about selfish intentions - more than likely, this is done out of compassion for the potential receivers of the secret teachings, for if they were not ready to receive, somewhere down the line, detrimental effects could result. These detrimental outcomes are now quite evident in the West. I'm guessing one of the chief reasons is that there is such a lack of emphasis on distillation, and also the vitalness of having enough patience to get proper grounding in the preliminaries. This is the way its always been done in the East. Maybe its counter-progressive in the eyes of Western spiritual aspirants, who, as we all know, do underperform in the 'patience' department, and who, generally speaking, want things to happen fairly fast, or they either lose interest, or abandon ship to seek some other 'quicker' paths or more impressive masters. Such an approach has never been advocated in the East, nor do i believe it ever will. It has never been the trend there for seekers of true paths to find masters who have the WOW factor - in fact, such 'masters' are often brushed aside as childish performers out to ply their wares to the gullible Western seekers. Its ironical isn't it? I don't think this is a failure or a kind of regression. Spirituality is not technology. It is a painstaking process that involves years of devotional fortitude to a particular master and lineage. Its about sifting through layer upon layer of habitual tendencies and ingrained views that demand to be overturned, shaken out and new insights reintegrated into the mindstream. In the East, there are no Drive-thru, instant satisfaction kind of spirituality to cater for those who are truly serious. There are of course those 'gurus' coming from the East who would promote otherwise, but in the eyes of their more mature, honest Eastern contemporaries, these guys are nothing but side-show operators out to make a fast buck or two. Oh well, it does take two to tango, i guess...

This could be true for other things, but in terms of spiritual cultivation, there are more 'steps' involved, imo. First come knowledge (studying of texts). Then reflection. Then practice, followed by experience/reflection. Then matching experience against higher knowledge. Then contemplation, leading to realization. Then beyond knowledge and experience. Finally, transformation/transcendence/ascendence.

Well said. ...."call it something else" - but these so-called transmitters won't, will they? Just imagine the implications if they did. It would simply create avoidable situations whereby they will be subject to spending all their energies just trying to pacify and quell all the doubting Thomases and Theresas. Its way easier to be jumping on to a platform with traditional hallmarks (has to have exotic Asian/Indian flavors of course) which starts them making money the quick and easy way! "What do you do?" I give Shaktipat/or send Qi Balls by Skype!! ($129.99 per dozen?). "Oh cool! I heard about that before - when can you fit me in? Thursday @ noon? Excellent!" as opposed to, say, "What do you do?" I offer you my system, called Bob's Energy Transference In A Zip aka the BETiaZ system! "Oh? What in heaven's name is THAT?" (umm...uh oh, another quacky who feels like playing God... thinks to self quietly). The situation is completely beyond salvation, Yuanqi. But as you know, it is the age of Kali yuga, so these are all signs towards the fulfillment of the prophecies of the sages of old.... Don't beat yourself up too hard over it. Like everything else, the cycle has to complete itself. No back-tracking once the wheel has begun turning.

will join us for tea perhaps a game of mahjong? let the fun begin!

A commentary by Tripitaka Master Hsuan Hua on the 10 Types of Immortality that is cultivatable, excerpted from the Shurangama Sutra. Interesting... http://www.cttbusa.org/shurangama7/shurangama7_21.asp

snowcapped with sugar drizzled with a bit of nectar makes for sweet journey...