3bob

Interesting but, many of the great and historic masters and also unknown (to the general public) masters have been capable of various "miracles" for many thousands of years. (already)

From Taoism: "Yuan-shih T'ien-tsun -- The First Principal He has no beginning and no end. He existed "before the void and the silence, before primordial chaos." He is self-existing, changeless, limitless, invisible, contains all virtues, is present in all places and is the source of all truth." Thus not bound and or under the forces of time and space in which evolution takes place. (regardless of the scales of, or variances in times and spaces) Om

"...then I got humble..."

The mote who knows himself is no less than the mountain.

Ah hell nevermind, (which doesn't mean the post above or this sring)

Thanks Manitou, Yes, some are cut out to be that "third" man/woman who help us in dealing with the world, although imo not everyone since they to may have helped at other times or in other ways that are not commonly known and then taken their leave. Om

"Three men were walking through the desert. They were lost and about to die from thirst and hunger. They come to a very high wall and the first one climbs up, shouts for joy and jumps over the wall never to return. The next man climbs up the wall and he too, exclaims in ecstasy, jumps off the wall and never comes back. Now the third man climbs up the wall. He gets to the top and sees a sort of Garden of Eden place with water and lots of fruit trees. He smiles, turns, goes back down the wall, returning to the desert to help others find their way to this paradise. He chooses to go back into the desert of the world and help others find their way." For the third man knew in his gut that there was something more. Om

VJ, We've heard this a thousand+ times from you, and frankly imo you are beating the hell out of it to reverse effect. Take a clue from Xabir, he mentions it but he does not beat the hell out of it, nor abuse other ways to glorify such. Om

a secret in plain sight

3. Thirdly, and of course you don't know 1 & 2 for sure. Om

warning on the 3rd eye falling to evil... Matthew, chapter 6, 22. The light of the body is the eye: if therefore thine eye be single, thy whole body shall be full of light. 23. But if thine eye be evil, thy whole body shall be full of darkness. If therefore the light that is in thee be darkness, how great is that darkness! Om

There is lots of talk about the importance of records, history, etc., which are often used to imply that without same a true understanding related to certain spiritual teachings or truths are not possible... (or that such are false without hard facts to back them up, so to speak) Well, imo such factual matters have a place - but no matter how good the records, history or hard facts are, there is also the key importance of having the eye to see and the ear to hear that which can not really be caught in words or measureable with 3d facts since even the best of words, thoughts and things have limits. (and if one is happy with such parameters then no one should try to force something otherwise upon them, nor they like-wise) Om

Logic has a place but when it comes to matters spoken of in this string it in no way will leap beyond duality and its doubt. Btw, the logic of the four-fold negation (a fine mental insight) ends where one really begins. There is a way Suninmyeyes but it does not rely on nor is it proven with deductive logic, speculations, the study-memory and quoting of written doctrines, noting the 32 or whatever number of signs, using a hundred well developed mental powers, etc., although when such tools are used properly they can help. Nor does it rely on vicariously putting one's self in a masters shoes and then pointing at a borrowed moon. (for their realization is their realization and not someone else's) Niether I nor anyone else here can prove or force anything upon you and apparently you already know that - I suggest sticking to that for we already have what no one else can give us, it's just a matter of uncovering it, even for a moment and what else is there really besides the moment? Om

The truth of the life-force is key, beyond thoughts about the life-force.

Thanks for the balanced feedback MH, we can count on you in that important way I had a radom association with this string a moment ago... namely about how an old buddy of mine was always talking about finding just-the-right-girl someday... and I well remember (with some envy at that time) the large number of fine women he dated and or at times got more serious with but as far as I know he never found that just- the-right-girl because he also never found just-the-right-guy in himself. Om

Obviously we tend to put our personal twists on what others say... I meant beyond beliefs, etc., thus putting your whole being into a belief (which it can not really fit into anyway) will alone still not get one beyond such a belief/thought... as for "outside observers" no one has exactly the same observations or exactly the same verifications anyway, although such may be close for comparitive purposes. Om

"Surely this can provide us with some cerebral jerky?" To what end? More of same?

Good point Suninmyeyes! Our mostly well intentioned Buddhist gurus simply don't know about what you've asked, but they make countless projections about same based upon lots of far-out and far-in stuff, much of which imo is good stuff.. None-the-less such projections, speculations and the comparitive delving upon what levels others are at is ultimately a foolish exercise. (and even that was a form of foolishness on my part, thus time to let it go ) Om

Strawdog, What I'll say is that which is labeled as unverfiable can be fully verified beyond only beliefs, hopes, ideas or concepts related to some future time or state, and by any person that really puts their whole being into such a moment. Om

MH, That's a good way to put it... Absolute power is in the 'now' moment and so is "enlightenment" for we will never be enlightened in some future time after eons of working on karma, etc., for ultimately we can only be enlightened or truly free in synchronization with the now moment. And even this now moment must get big enough to include all of the so-called past and future since they to only exist 'now' although they are seemingly or relatively circumscribed one way or another by limits of mind and memory identification traces. (thus and obviously a 3d time and space pov is not big enough for such!) Om

Absolute is not two... "Tao" as "absoulte" is not two... Thus if Tao of absoulte power is corruptable and corrupting then all is in utter vanity, and kiss your ass goodbye. (this one has seen otherwise ) Om

That was a nice quote and well wishes CowTao Om

True religion is a manifestation of True Spirit. True Spirit is ultimate power and not corruptible nor corrupting and ultimately un-nameable. Also the truly righteous have no need for self-proclamation just as the sun has no need to say that it shines. That which can be named (and manipulated by ego) can be corrupted in relative view and twisted permutations, although such is not automatic nor to be made into an all inclusive generalization such as that often heard echoed about. Thus True Peace Is, Om

"judge the tree by its fruit..." Btw, how insane is it for certain Chinese parents (and certain other Asian parents) who live in the lands where "Taoism" arose to murder their female daughters because having sons is better?? So please don't narrow mans inhumanity to man (by concentrating on certain so called Christians) when in fact such is a universal problem that happens under various names and at various times and places, which has included just about all of mankind at sometime or another in our history. Om