3bob

Dwai, Well ok, you answered one question... but I would never call Osho (aka Bhagwan Shree Rajneesh) and his cult of groupies in Oregon in the 80's as having anything to do with a "highly accomplished master" or as being in any way truly related to dharmic teachings. (although aspects of same were stolen and twisted to further his aims of power, greed, etc.) "...In 1981, Osho relocated to the United States and his followers established an intentional community, later known as Rajneeshpuram, in the state of Oregon. Within a year the leadership of the commune became embroiled in a conflict with local residents, primarily over land use, which was marked by hostility on both sides. Osho's large collection of Rolls-Royce automobiles was also notorious. The Oregon commune collapsed in 1985 when Osho revealed that the commune leadership had committed a number of serious crimes, including a bioterror attack (food contamination) on the citizens of The Dalles. Osho was arrested shortly afterwards and charged with immigration violations. He was deported from the United States in accordance with a plea bargain.[8][9][10] Twenty-one countries denied him entry, causing Osho to travel the world before returning to Pune, where he died in 1990. His ashram is today known as the Osho International Meditation Resort" Any "guru" worth two cents is responsible for his chosen group of leadership on site; but of course such a corrupted and fallen one was incapable of any such integrity, or for that matter able to follow or teach of any of the truths of Sanatana Dharma.

Generalizations are ok, which includes the obvious fact that Beings do have storage of various types of energy for various amounts of time as designed. (on a simple level our bodies do store at least some amount of fat as an energy reserve, which btw. bears are better at than many of us humans. )

"When the many are reduced to the one, to what shall the one be reduced" (or something close to that) and or when many Beings are reduced to one Being to what is that one Being then reduced to? and or when many immortals are reduced to one immortal, to what is that one immortal then reduced to? Om

Does this group have something to do with "Osho" since there is a quote of his on the first page? (after which my reading ended). Are you aware of his past "cult" activites in places like Oregon? Although I'm sure you meant well. Om

It depends on their/our spiritual evolution. Thus in that sense they are not "one in the same" and neither are we but exist as particular Beings within creation. Btw, to me an aspect of beleif is kind of like hope, it's ok but not really enough by itself, thus only direct experience on such a subject can really give you answers beyond speculations about what someone else may say. Another point, imo most of us human beings or at least myslef don't have "the need to know" a great deal about such orders of souls unless their is a specific purpose or reason. We may have some experiences and help given to us by them but then again we have our own dharmic place and work to fulfill and they have theirs. (which may cross at times) Om

True, and a good point Blasto.

sadness is turned to gladness by unalterable and undefeated compassion of the enlightened ones. Om

Hey early bird, I gotta go to work at 5:30 in the am, but not you right? (and my wife also woke me up several hours early for snoring so it's going to be a long, upcoming 12 hr shift on just 3 hrs sleep) Anyway have you read Ecclesciastes or Proverbs in a while, from your posts it seems like you might like some of the sayings there? Om p.s. Thankfully coffee was manifested somewhere along the line, although some Taoist herbalist people may not agree with it's use?

Without more context related to all of the book Ecclesiastes (and of course King Solomon) I could see how some might take it that way on the surface.

Eccles 1:18, For in much wisdom is much grief: and he that increaseth knowledge increaseth sorrow.

Your previous submissions sound like a different person compared to the apparently new you? Granted, I may have had some of that coming in some way or another, which btw. I have more or less mentioned once or twice in passing, I just forgot for awhile that, "hell hath no fury that matches a woman's scorn". (or something like that) Blasto and I (and perhaps a couple of others) have had some differences but nothing (edit) beyond what I believe we might somehow or in some way come to some kind of terms; or agree to disagree. Frankly, and if you ever want to - I don't mind trying to talk, or say nothing to me which is obviously your choice. For what it's worth I have been to where the sun don't shine, or the stars, or the moon, and the horror where souls scream and weep without voices, and I have also been in the other direction where things are more workable and amendable. Namaskar

Mel has said she is seeking and involved in various physic stuff, thus (and granted) my imperfect attempts and also imo the better attempts by others in giving her alternate/warning type of information. In a way you could be giving me alternate/warning type of information to. Btw, I always liked tether-ball better than English back in grade school but I'm interested in and willing to improve myself in that area, even if I am a rather old dog. What can I know of an author personally from reading his public work? (not everything by a long shot) Om

Ah my little furry fun guy with an assumed superior intellectual insight/oversight; your opinions on the subject at hand have been out voted, so to speak... as for your opinions about me who really cares (?) I don't, besides I'm not the subject at hand just one more opinion backed by my experiences which you know nothing about. Namaskar Om

Do you see what you are doing gal...? There is no "kinder than thou" need to dismiss people you are now seeing as "negative" by posting certain parts of the message above, a message (or parts of) which you could have sent via a pm to Junbao or anyone else that you prefer or hope to console with. Thus recognize your own form of negative and deal with it. Btw, if you feel or think it gets "negative" in here then imo and for what it's worth you are grossly unprepared to deal with the possible problems of the physic stuff (like obe/projection, levitation, 3rd eye openings, spirits, etc...) that you say you are seeking and or involved with. Good luck Mel, Namaskar Om

Hi Astral, my responses in blue: 3bob, you bring up very valid examples. Now that I believe myself to better understand where you're coming from I DO have a couple example myself In examples of sharing truth/concerns (like the teenage daughter) I would hardly consider that being "negative" as you're not trying to put anyone down to feel good about yourself, you're trying to protect someone and help them to be informed to make the best decisions. However in these situations one must be willing to accept the choices of a person once they understand the consequences(unless of course you feel their life is in danger). Forcing one to conform to your will isn't love. Agreed, and well said. In terms of martial arts masters "kicking butt" and choking a dog to stop it from hurting the mailman, this falls under the category of "protection". I never said physical force itself was negative . I'm not as familiar with the two examples of Christ as I should be, but I don't look to the commercialized Bible for an account of Christ as I believe much of it has been altered. I would suggest the KJV of "The Gospel According to St. John" for comparitive reference and information, instead of what sounds like just pigeon-holing all Bible texts as being nothing more than commercialized accounts. Btw, even an exactly perfect account would take an exactly perfect reader to understand such text fully, whether it be the Bible or any other spiritual teaching, east, west or whatever. Now that I believe I understand you better I think we're in agreement, but were just misunderstood. When I say negativity, I mean it in the sense of putting down others to make yourself feel better or superior. When being honest and protecting others, whether it be by force or not, I would consider each of those quite positive. Basically agreed, although the force part can make for a very fine and difficult line. Did you submit a couple of specific examples or mainly comment along the lines of mine which is fine but... While there is much more that can be discussed on this topic I prefer to simply say "this is how I try to conduct myself based on my beliefs, what you believe and how you plan to act based on those beliefs is your freedom to decide" I was merely sharing my view based on your comment to my opinions on energetic parasitism. If you'd like to discuss morality and other "personal" things perhaps it would be more appropriate to do so in a "Debate" thread or via pm (although I wont debate with you, I would prefer to discuss and share). Astral Ok, but I'm not sure where the debate threads are since at any time any where exchanges can have aspects of debate. Anyway back to this "connection to the source", for me it not all lovey-dovey and kindness, (whether you meant that or not) but also like a mighty billion volts and amps that can shock, rip and shred all of ones pre-conceptions, in other words blow one's head right off. (so to speak) Namaskar Om

"the more we assert the self the more we lose connection with it", could you clear that up a bit Paul? self as ego Self as Spirit Om

Well that's a lot of things you've brought up ... as for some examples although not always or exactly negative per-se: Jesus whipping the money changers in the temple, Jesus saying to Peter, "get behind me satan", martial arts masters kicking butt or expelling students for certain screw-ups, parents telling their teenage daughters that it is stupid to get drunk, and worse so among strangers because you could end up raped and or dead, choking your dog who is trying desperately to sink their teeth into the postman, scolding the hell out of your little kid for running across the street in traffic. That's only a few, do you have a couple? Om

Some have a razor sharp way about them and do not their mince words, and may even over-do such sometimes, does that make them negative (?) far from it if taken in the full context of a matter that requires such methods. The more important point being not to, "throw the baby out with the bathwater". Also, a quote below that to me is an advanced view: "Meditation in Affliction Assailed by afflictions, we discover Dharma And find the way to liberation. Thank you, evil forces! When sorrows invade the mind, we discover Dharma And find lasting happiness. Thank you, sorrows! Through harm caused by spirits we discover Dharma And find fearlessness. Thank you, ghosts and demons! Through people's hate we discover Dharma And find benefits and happiness. Thank you, those who hate us! Through cruel adversity, we discover Dharma And find the unchanging way. Thank you, adversity! Through being impelled to by others, we discover Dharma And find the essential meaning. Thank you, all who drive us on! We dedicate our merit to you all, to repay your kindness" From Gyalwa Longchenpa and Longchen Nyingtik lineage. (as copied)

Words borrowed and recopied below from Mr. CowTao, quote: "When one person, or a group, takes something mainstream and conjure up a whole new set of teachings, and then telling its followers to forsake mainstream in favor of a more evolved, complete and genuine article (to include, of course, the glorification and veneration of the founder him/herself), when its obviously not that evolved, nor is it complete and certainly not genuine, then such a movement's motivation and underlying principles will definitely be scrutinized and its whole set-up be labelled dubious." ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- I agree with these meanings. Om

Holy Cow!! Lots of neat stuff.

it gave them birth Om

Well 3 is a favorite number and bob is my nick-name. Om

well said VJ. Om

I'd like to refute that but my little brain hurts, in the meantime everybody lets do the limbo, can't get much lower than that..hehe

What is more strange to me Mel is that you miss the import of a key Falun Gong doctrine you quoted namely, "They should turn a blind eye and a deaf ear to them..." while at the same time preaching to members here that we should all agree to disagree...? Btw, I did understand where the words were coming from - just making the suggestion for future posts to help prevent possible misunderstandings. No need to be coy with me; you were asking basic questions about things that could be called not so basic, but there is a difference in that imo, although that point is not a big biggy. Namaskar