3bob

Perhaps you could re-read my posts - nowhere did I say or imply Hinduism (and its sects) as being trivial, but that is sure what it sounded like from you by your "personal" use of the word earlier... "be and go in peace" does not mean I'm telling you to go, stay or whatever, with it being meant more as a basic feeling and hopefully common ground. If you can hear yourself speaking it sounds like you are trying threaten and or dictate to Dwai and myself in certain ways while on the other hand putting yourself above communication with us? (since we are below you going by your judgement, - one might ask where that is coming from, then again one might just let it go) Om (contains all Sanskrit and all beings, humble or not)

there also some interesting ideas about harnessing anti-gravity that I came across years ago but I'm not up on that now...

Prasanna, When you imply or state that traditional forms or sects of Hinduism are "trivial" compared to what you happen to posit or see as superior then you may get feedback. Btw#1: A common saying and teaching in Hinduism from its many Saints, Rishis, Gurus, etc. is, "many paths, one goal or God". which is what I based the pretense without recognition of that remark on. Btw#2, it takes two to tango so it seems to me that you should have also gotten a mod notice if you haven't already? Also and surely no one is trying to dissuade you from your school...be and go in peace.

But "we" didn't need what sounded like a smart alec comment about it did we?

Is a fairly obvious observation being made and given equal to falsely based and biased acrimony? Me thinks not but of course seldom do all of us see things the same way. I will leave the protagonist with his words and karma: "There are fanatical Hindus who fight in the name of Gods like you two and there are spiritual Hindus who want to cross over those trivialities like fighting over name and form. You decide where you want to be." Prasanna p.s. bold and underline by me

Prasanna, Thanks for the additional examples that warn of where your dictator like ego is coming from ! Btw, to try and hide that behind Hindusim is deplorable.

We are not fighting or hung up on form or non-form - Btw #1, If you are an example of your groups teachings then thanks for the warning, or perhaps you turned sour on your own? Btw #2, Please drop the pretense of being a "spiritual" Hindu since one can't do so while also trashing or belittling very important and multiple aspects related to it ! )

I'd say Supreme Being (as Sat) gives rise - not non-being or a devolved chaos...

Prasanna, This is the Hindu sub-forum, as listed. (not the general forum where one might not want to get to heavy into religion like you mentioned, although that does happen there all the time) Thus no one should really be surprised or offended in a Hindu forum if any of its Gods or principles related to same are brought up, for there is no way to side step around the fact that Hinduism or Sanatana Dharma is directly linked to its Gods and so many other in depth aspects of Vedic based religion. (including per the Upanishads!) - I sure don't need to tell you that but I'm bringing it up as a reminder; btw. like Dwai's post which explained an important part of Hinduism and its culture Anyway, I don't have and imo no one else should have a problem with, "that thing" also known by some as, Shiva the "Lord of Yoga" being brought up in a Hindu forum.

if our karma encases us with around 50 tons of material it will take at least 50 tons of some type of effort or work to do something about it - strictly math wise - but thankfully we get help beyond just the math of it (so to speak) and if we didn't we could all kiss our buried in karma asses goodbye !

large cats also love rats (to fight and then eat)...but lets try not to get the context mixed up

Well said Dwai, (and not funny in a condescending way)

....umm, didn't you just make the same "funny" argument using a different name? Btw, how would you describe what any "normal Hindu" knows about the Saivite teachings? (being that there are hundreds of millions+ of Saivite faith)

apparently many have not seen the clever rat with beady eyes scurrying around in the shadows, for it can not stand the light...

Indeed, a burning to put away doubt once and for all !

I'd say Shakti is the universe - eternally connected to and non-dual with Shiva, thus not just a side effect or relative illusion.

ah but if Supreme Brahman has no will in effect then chaos, not order would be the rule, and the Sovereign of Brahmaloka would not exist.

The term "disinterested interest" might need further discussion being that imo it sounds rather neutral in an apathetic kind of way, then again I think I get your drift.... for instance one could say something like, "roaring silence" or quote the words, "unstruck sound" as pointing to certain meanings. We also have in one example of scripture the Chandogya Upanishad for consideration wherein it speaks of all that springs from Brahman or Atman with such not being just neutral or apathetic in any way! As for Shiva or Siva, it is also a term used by many to mean Brahman, thus not just a derived manifestation or aspect of Brahman although that too comes into play. Btw, if you are an Indian living in south India (or most anywhere in India) I'm somewhat surprised that you are not very familiar with Saivite teachings or its major schools, be that as it may it's besides the OP. (and myself also not knowing much about a lot of other schools)

what about another type of effort/will - namely the "effort" and or will needed for the creation/emanation of the universe/multiverse, to maintain/sustain and it, and then to dissolve/withdraw it for the next cycle to start all over again?

Bindi, A handle one might use is with an analogy of dimensions and the laws that apply to them... for instance laws for 2d can not be used to limit the laws for 3d, and so on extrapolated to a what could be called a "no-thing" or God dimension that is also eternally and simultaneously within and throughout all dimensions, and in that sense an eternal moment is not transient, nor can the laws of transient time or place be applied to it. Further, and atom or Atman of and at the God dimension never gains, loses or wins that which IT already IS. I'd say there is a point of no return (to various "states") for a matrix, and also a point of no longer coming or going but I'm not qualified on that.

ah but all karma and ego can be suspended and or detached for an eternal moment beyond time, space and form - for such is the power, grace, reach and speed of the Mystery beyond a particular matrix or mental process.

Brian, Well maybe but personality is not essence...

Prasanna, Ok, btw. in post 5 you used, "life" descriptions twice...did you mean to use another word besides life to make a comparison? Also being that is there no Shiva without Shakti how would you further describe a "disinterested interest" per the omnipresent, omnipotent and omniscient?

one would need to study up on Ayurveda for lots more details along these lines.

Prasanna, Lets not forget that all the Swamis, Monks, Yogis, Sages, Saints, Satgurus, and etc. were once like those that you apparently do not approve of. Btw. If there were not householders none of the above would have ever been born in the first place to purposely acquire ego, karma and ignorance - learn from those, then work them out, and finally have the veils lifted and return to Source or Self- realization.