ShaktiMama

That concept is unknown to me but top down awakenings are not rare. In fact, I would call it almost as common as bottom up. (in my experience.)Then people also awaken thru the heart. That is a nice way to do it....Opening the heart first. s

I try to stay away from debates about k these days. Just some clarification. I just want to say about amplification....you are assuming,yes?, that is the fault of the teacher if it not managed correctly. True, but a person has to have a teacher first. If it is spontaneous in a stay at home mom who lives the wheat fields of Kansas who attends a fundamentalist church in a conserative community...well...context is important. Sometimes just an acknowledgement or kind word and/or a touch on the shoulder or back is enough to handle problems like this. Just for the record I primarily worked and still work with those who are spontaneous awakenings with no frame of reference or support in their lives. I have worked with Muslim, Sufi, Mormons, agnostics, Baptists, Pagans, Catholics, secular Hindus, very wealthy, poor, middle class, soldiers, nuns, engineers, spiritual leaders and teachers (yes, we have problems too), etc. Heh, kundalini is not a token of how spiritual you are. Maybe in the inner cultivation community but not with those who aren't in it. Those who are out of it just want to know how do I manage it or get rid of it and get assurance they are not going crazy. I am one of the first to say Kundalini is not a guarantee of enlightenment or super powers. I will say it can make the processes more attainable. Some of the biggest freaks and a$$holes I have met are kundalites. This because they have not had the blessing of being with a good teacher. No one has all the answers about this process although many (including traditions) think they do. I treat the Kundalini process like Open Source Code. Use what works and let go what doesn't. I have no idea why people think MCO or sacral pumps are kundalini.You mentioning it is the first time I heard that. It does dry up the body from heat but not 100% everybody has that happen. I can feel my adrenals "squeak" when it dripped adrenaline when the energy surged in the early years. My skin turned dark brown for a week once when the k was active thru the second chakra. It was like a dark brown inverted triangle between below my naval and above my pubic line. It was way hotter than the surrounding skin. Some people have actually had burns/blisters go from their foot, stripe up their back along the spine and out the top of their head. Glenn Morris, lost hair at the base of his skull from being burned until he learned about keeping tongue up to the roof of the mouth. Just staying hydrated and keeping the tongue up will help avoid some of the heat/drying problems. Please realize that we might be talking about two different things. You might be talking about something that is undertaken in a controlled environment. If this happens in a controlled environment then this is something the teacher must explore and address. In an uncontrolled environment, no teacher, no support...these can be common experiences. Heat is a huge symptom for the unprepared. Blistering, blazing heat in people who are not in any kind of inner cultivation project to help having cleaned them out. I think I could set the room on fire in the beginning. I would make windows sweat in the warmth of the day. Teaching inner cultivation, like chi gong or yoga,is very important to newbies. People are re-engineering their inner landscape. High heat is manifested in those who have had no inner cultivation practice or have huge piles of emotional garbage and trauma. I had no teacher, no support other than from the k internet group for a very long time. Yes, Amrita. One can even taste it in the kiss of another kundalini person. blessings, s

Thanks for the long reply Susan! I appreciate the time you're taking with folks on this forum. You are welcome! "Glenn was adamant about not talking about these things in public for these very reasons. He was attacked also viciously for his ideas about kundalini and ridiculed for years." By who? The martial arts world. Esoteric martial arts for enlightenment is still a subject of ridicule as is he. Also was by some in the early modern kundalini community he told me when he attended some conferences in San Francisco. His insight were ignored by some. He and I wondered if people really had an experience of kundalini awakening when people would say we were wrong or nuts. "My heart breaks when I hear about people who do suffer. I want to bring the aura of normalcy, that this is a normal process of development but to even say that in public raises ill will." Think about why this might be. I mean either it's "evolution" or at least a "natural" human thing or it's not. Depends on the context of how it happens I would think in modern times. In ancient times, kundalini was often developed in soldiers and warriors to increase strength and intelligence. Glenn speaks about this in his books. "It also reinforces that people should hide themselves so they don't become a victim of a witch hunt. Glenn and I used to talk about the one day people who could be more freer about what is happening." Well, this is why I love TTB's :-) But to be honest, the "cloak and dagger" teachers are doing that ideal a disservice IMO. Have you ever been a subject of a witchhunt? We have crazy people who follow us around the internet posting weird and out of context stories about us. Some of them happen to be Bum members. Also, there are a lot of the unseen who don't like that we make this knowledge available. Self sacrifice and self preservation have to reach a balance. "You are not the little red ford fiesta.2 That's sweet of you Susan, but I'm hardly a Guzzi yet either ;-) I wish you could see what I see.

Spiritual emergency and chi psychosis are both in the DSMV-IV. http://www.spiritualcompetency.com/jhpseart.html It is probably most often misdiagnosed like other things that are not in public awareness or not very common. It is difficult to avoid being mis-categorized. It is unfortunate what happened to you and it seems to affect you deeply still your original experience. I wish that was less common but it is not. This is why I formed the Kundalini Support Network back in 2002 or so for people who are or were like you. My own experience was awesome in a terrifying way but also awesomely beautiful. I am in the minority who had positive experiences over all without having any support system in place. One explanation has been I have racked up enough good karma points over many lifetimes to have this unfold in that way but I know there are those who do suffer. But, as we already said, those who have the positive experience we dont hear much about in the West. Weird as hell is an understatement and when you get in the company of about 20-50 people who all have similar stories to share it doesn't seem so weird anymore. But when you talk about these experiences it makes non k people as uncomfortable as hell. The responses can be they ignore you because they think you are an uneducated idiot or insane and will often attack you. I speak out anyway so people know they aren't alone. Glenn was adamant about not talking about these things in public for these very reasons. He was attacked also viciously for his ideas about kundalini and ridiculed for years. My heart breaks when I hear about people who do suffer. I want to bring the aura of normalcy, that this is a normal process of development but to even say that in public raises ill will. It also reinforces that people should hide themselves so they don't become a victim of a witch hunt. Glenn and I used to talk about the one day people who could be more freer about what is happening. Re: If you were an a$$hole before kundalini, after kundalini you become wide and gaping. I heard that verbatim from him more than once.. Looking deeper into that comment meant that kundalini amplifies character traits and not just the negative ones. The upgrade just refers to the quality of the energy not the person. It's like exchanging a fire stick for a laser. You are not the little red ford fiesta. The fact that you have these kind of observations and questions are evidence of kundalini working through you. This all takes time. One student asked me about something he read on a board today. My comments are italicized. * Hi Susan, If you have time for a quick question, if not just ignore. I read somewhere (AYP) that a kundalini awaenking is really the half way point on the journey. Is this right as you know it? Thanks, * :) it is just the beginning... LOL * So it really marks the start of the journey? Just the clarify... * oh yes...the adventure now really begins...mine has been awake since the early 90s. Like being born...it 's a life long learning and discovering. What helps is to know that kundalini development follows similiarly to a normal, human development. Like a human...kundalites go thru a gestation stage, being born, being an infant, a toddler, young child to puberty, young adult to elderly when kundalini develops. From my perspective I see different developmental stages unfolding in students. Questions about what is happening and self identity are similar if not the same in human non kundalini development. The development for k people is more of a transcendental arc. Everyone is different. Everybody matures at different rates. What I can say to you now is that you are loved and treasured. K process may feel uncomfortable but that is a part of growing. I am still growing and learning in my relationship with this energy and in this adventure. I have really bad days too but they pass a lot quicker than they used to. s

"And how does one evaluate their understanding?" Well, if the conversation involves something along the lines of moonbeams and fairy dust, one should probably keep looking. The difference between k and other energies is you're doing an upgrade. As my friend says, " you are getting out of the mini van and stepping into the ferrari." If a person has little knowledge or experiential understanding of the POWER of this energy stay away. Power is neutral in and of itself. It's how you use it or it uses you is important. The ironic thing is kundalini recognizes itself in another being so for us it can be easier to tell one another apart but not so for those who really want to know. A person doesn't have to be a kundalite to treat you...just have an understanding of what it is about. Honestly, it will be difficult to find someone who does understand. That's why I keep a list of healers that I know I can refer people to who do understand. I would say, listen to your heart. If you feel uncomfortable for some reason discuss it with the person. People do have these accidental or spontaneous awakenings and feel all alone. They don't know there are resources out there to help them. I don't think yet we are to the place where the Ad Council will run free spots on kundalini like they do for smoking. I meet a lot of people who have these spontaneous awakening. In fact, that is the most type of kundalites that I meet. They find me because they go looking for help. It doesn't mean though that people are popping up with k symptoms everywhere. I would say it is very small. It is just the company we keep that we hear more about it. It's like buying a red ford fiesta. You never knew there were so many red ford fiestas on the road. It seems like everyone bought one the same time you did. Actually we have become more sensitive to seeing them because it has been brought into our awareness. I think there are a lot of ungrounded people walking around period. I did want to point out that extreme emotion of any kind can awaken kundalini such as joy and happiness as well as the painful emotions and experiences. It doesn't happen as often one might feel or think it does otherwise we would be hearing a lot more about it. Googling Kundalini brings up 5.6 million results. When I put it into HotBot in 1997 I got back 10 of which three or four pointed to the same please. Certainly there is more awareness about it. Certainly, many people think they are qualified to give an opinion on it. Yeah, warning people off is like waving catnip under my nose. But it is the adventuresome, highly intelligent and imaginative personality, who loves fantasy and whimsy who usually fare much better with the whole process. The capacity to be surprised and amused at one's self is also important.

Kundalini does open spontaneously at times during other events. Sometimes during Reiki, cranio sacral therapy, chiropractic, massage, inner cultivation practices, and also traumatic things like PTSD and emotional trauma, physical damage to the spine like an accident, or extreme grief, birth, drug use...etc. Anything that heightens the Flight or Fight response (huge adrenaline release) or puts you into deep relaxation and alignment has the potential to do so. Kundalini awakening practices should involve earthing your body, grounding practices to help keep the process smooth. If you don't see them in a system I would advise not doing that system. Some healers can help you, some cannot.You have to ask around. Make sure they understand about what kundalini really is. (A lot say they do and they really don't.)Make sure the healer is grounded themselves. There is a lot of bad press and publicity about kundalini awakening because people love talking about and pointing to a good train wreck. There are far more that happen successfully that the public doesn't hear about because people are satisfied generally with the process. I have seen some fantastic, transformational, transcedent awakenings that without an experienced teacher nearby would probably be misconstrued as something horrible. If you have a problematic kundalini awakening just let me know privately and I will do what I can to help you. Blessings, Susan PS. Be at peace and focus on the positive. What we focus on tends to appear because our focus puts our energy into the manifestation of what we think about. May every beat of your heart be a peaceful one.

remember to add Santi too. Same website. thank you, s

this is the site to use http://www.kundaliniawakening.com/ thx s

we can. We are always looking for people locally to help others when they are having kundalini problems. Everybody always feels so lonely. s

A dear friend and senior student is blogging about his meditation experience. He is a meditation teacher himself and has a real skill at explaining about what he is discovering and learning in this journey of self awareness. Right now he is exploring bliss. If you live in Pennsylvania and would like to learn yoga or meditation he would be a good start. http://justplainmeditation.com/blog/ Disclaimer: I am only one of several of his teachers. I encourage people to keep learning from different people, schools and compare and synthesize what serves them best. s

Just some musings myself... I was looking at the originally meaning of "enthusiast" just a little while ago. It is a greek term that meant "possessed by the divine, or a god." I was also thinking of this in terms of Diety Yoga which is the process of becoming an enthusiast. I came across this quote today: Seek not to follow in the footsteps of men of old; seek what they sought. - Matsuo Basho I met Kali first many years ago. I did not know who she was...I had to be "told" what her name was in the meditation. This is in the very beginning, in the early years. My kundalini had just began to rise and I met her on my meditation about personal anger. My realization was not only was I the creator of my own life but I was also the destoyer. when my kundalini took on the quality of a freight train of volcaninc energy rushing up my back, I met Shiva. Later I would meet Shakti and Ganesha. regardless of what we determine or call the kundalini experience; false personality, illusion, karmic detritus, the work of the divine....the effect is life altering. It leaves a mark. Regardless of what a tradition or dogma calls that experience...I treasure them. And I keep on, keeping on. s

glad you picked up on that insight...I know Shiva as very playful, non judgmental so I have some ideas. Probably out dancing. pm me if you want to talk more. s

I had given my deposit for that retreat too. Now I can't go. Too many co-workers are having surgery that month and I have to cover. s

Deal and done. Blessing back at you, my brother. s

nicely said.... s

No, I am not taking this personally. No reason to do so but are you taking this personally. I am not challenging you personally. What is the name of the One traditional yogic tradition, please? We will butt heads on this because I don't limit myself to the traditional context of understanding kundalini as a sanskrit term. I will not speak further on this because then the yogic fundamentalists come and want to beat me over the head for wanting to expand the traditional understanding of Shakti and Kundalini. Let us be at peace. Western cultural prejudice is patriarchal. We have yet to make much progress there. I have sat in enough diversity trainings to see how much farther we must go as a society to be free from the prison of male privilege. No, I know nothing about what you teach. I have not investigated it. Are you thinking I am projecting on you my prejudices when I was talking about the paragraph you quoted? I don't even know you. I was curious about why you chose that paragraph because cultural context is important. I think we miss deeper understandings if we use examples without examining other variables. For example, in the bible there is a passage that talks about heaping coals of fire on top of person's head. How that has been interpreted by modern christianity as there are legitimate reasons to do some kind of injury to someone. In the cultural context, back then coals were carried on top of people's heads in containers to go from one home's hearth to another home's hearth, to carry fire as hospitality offering and for survival purposes when the home fires went out. Using morality as a teaching tool in a spiritual practice is a sticky proposition. IMO it is best to be avoided. Masculine concept of spirituality tends to be vertical, exclusive, solitary. Feminine spirituality tends to be horizontal, inclusive, community based. There is a place for both to become one. I think we do a disservice to the heritage of India to say there is only One yogic traditional path. There are many, many, many to choose from. It seems the same as saying there is only one traditional qigong path in China. There are thousands. I can't say definitely what the one true purpose of kundalini awakening is. I can say what I say but there are different responses, different agreements depending on different schools. The goal of Tantra Yoga is enlightenment, yes? What is enlightenment? s My favorite yantra. Can you feel it shifting the energies inside you?

Ah, the Madonna (Goddess) -whore complex... Men resenting the sexual freedom (autonomy, power) of the female....I could go on. Can you speak of this with a positive spin, without the patriarchal culture prejudice? Shakti goes where She wills..... If you took away the whore aspect then what would this journey represent? If this was a masculine energy how would it be perceived? Let's get away from using/ blaming the Feminine for our failing to advance on the Spiritual Path. Another learning is in this.... I would posit that Religion is a Masculine creation. s

I don't know what that is And I have decided to stay away from reading that thread without even reading the first post. I wasn't challenging you. It is just what is. I can't explain anything about That anymore. It is beyond my level of understanding so I just wait watch and help people make their own discoveries. That just is...and may I be so bold as to say it is non theistic? But again, I start with where people are at in their conceptual comfort zone. s

Words just aren't adequate after a certain point. Definitions are limitations. I stay with what makes people comfortable and then we move on. s

Video #3 is up. We have all the videos up on one page now. enjoy, s

You are welcome. Tao is extremely skilled and knowledgeable. s

totally diggin' it....groovy....

Nice. Bless you, s

It happens. Blessings, s

I respectly remove myself from any discussion on the difference. *giggling* s