GreytoWhite

I wish they'd have some sort of spirit blender or something whose style is based off of Hunyuan Yiqizhang

Re: Jack Dempsey's Internal Power Many people think his book Championship Fighting Explosive Punching and Aggressive Defense is better than most xingyi quanpu. http://stickgrappler.tripod.com/box/dempseycfbook.html Like Eugen Sandow, Jack Dempsey used a lot of light dumbbell exercises. http://www.sandowplus.co.uk/Macfadden/MuscleBuilder/Feb25/mb-Feb25-01.htm The man was incredibly fit and trained like a madman. Also, like most kung fu masters of early last century he had a base of hard labor to his body before he truly began training.

Thanks.

Thanks!

While I have not personally practiced it, my friend who taught me fully approves of their methods and higher level teachers. http://www.plumpub.c...ll_WDboxing.htm http://www.plumpub.c...coll_wudang.htm http://www.plumpub.c...wudangtaiyi.htm I have read that much of the Wudang taiji is heavily influenced by Zhaobao (a village near Chen jia gou) but they have also formulated from Chen, Yang, Wu, and Bagua.

There are a lot of wing chun concepts already within baguazhang, it just depends on the lineage. Southern styles like wing chun focus more on dynamic tension of the muscles than structure and flowing movement. However, this dynamic muscular training SHOULD be present within the daoyin of baguazhang. Here is the first part of a GREAT lecture series from Andrew Nugent-Head who is the only person to receive the entirety of Xei Peiqi's YIn style martial, medical, and internal cultivation arts. https://vimeo.com/13499485 Someone you may want to speak with is Eric_H on Rum Soaked Fist. He has studied both Yin Bagua and Hung Fa Yi Wing Chun. He is now fully devoted to studying HFY and even moved from Arizona to the Bay Area to continue studies with his master. http://www.rumsoakedfist.org/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=344

Any form can be practiced with martial qualities intact and with intent. Aiping Cheng's performance was quite good, she overtly displayed chansijin and kai he throughout the form and I definitely wouldn't want to be on the other end of one of her fajing strikes. I'm not particularly fond of forms to begin with as many of them seem to be a bunch of finishing moves linked together. I was taught the Chen Xiaowang 19 form and the laojia but I never practice either in their entirety. I will take certain postures and practice the intent behind them but that's about it. The qualities behind the movement are what I care about. Once I'm gainfully employed here in Sacramento I'll be studying with the local Han shi Yiquan guys. I'm also a big fan of Ark Minoru's Aunkai as well as Ziranmen. I would like to get a large spear (10+ feet) sometime in the near future to really practice some of the power and intent extension.

I'm certified because I'm honest when people ask me questions about my beliefs and experiences. I'm OK with it.

chi 2012, anything that is burned can cause cancer and the heat introduction to lungs is a major contributor as well. In the processing of tobacco a lot of ammonia, nicotine, and other chemicals leech out of the tobacco. Cigarette companies collect these chemicals as well as add their own proprietary blend and reapply it to processed leaf. There are also tobacco by-products (usually rolled stems and cuttings too that are too small for the machine) that are added to a normal cigarette. These tobacco by-products burn very quickly due to lack of density and other processing. Natural American Spirit is owned by big tobacco just like the others but it is higher quality material. They burn longer because there is no filler added and the processing is more traditional. Still, there is MORE tobacco resin in the Natural American Spirit cigarettes. There are no additives but they are still something to avoid, tobacco is not meant to be inhaled.

I had never really seen the 56 before, form competition doesn't really interest me. After looking it up it seems to be a synthesis liaojia yilu and erlu. Considering that the 108 is a couple of generations previous to Chen Changxing we are seeing a form that the current forms took material from. Very interesting to see how an art progresses. I'm really curious about the origins of the Zhang Sanfeng Originality School taiji taught to Wan Lei Sheng. I bought the DVD a while back but it didn't look like anything other than a "fat man's" taiji.

Anything that is burned creates carcinogens. The mouth has extremely sensitive membranes and excess smoking can cause cancer. Typically pipe and cigar smokers do not have to worry about mouth cancer unless the cigar smoker is one to chew the head of the cigar. Mouth cancer is typically associated with people who chew tobacco due to direct contact and length of exposure. A puff of smoke held in the mouth is not something to worry about so long as one does not take tobacco use to excess. Drinking green tea or yerba mate and then holding it in your mouth for a little while should help counter carcinogenic activity. Although I will warn you that holding caffeinated beverages in one's mouth will cause the caffeine to absorb through the membranes which may be too much for someone who is sensitive to caffeine.

Clarification on post #12 it was not the xiaojia that was lost but rather a Hongdong Chang quan variant that was recovered by Chen Li-qing. Chen Xiaowang has openly criticized this form and believes it should stay lost. From what I am told a lot of the body method in this form is glossed over in this video. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ja5xE_dwjGA

As a good friend of the lineage holder for the Yucatec Mayan people's cigar knowledge I hope I can shed some light on tobacco, its traditional uses, and how it relates to meditation. I've sat and listened to what he is willing to share about the traditional methods of cigars for 8 years now and I also worked in the commercial cigar industry for almost 3 years. I’m not going to write much about cigarettes, hookah, or other forms of tobacco consumption as cigars are the traditional method and the others really aren’t healthy or conducive to meditation in my opinion. Tobacco is a plant that originated in South America and was traded north and it eventually traveled intercontinental to the rest of the world after European conquest. In South America it was used in a similar manner to the Banisteriopsis caapi plant because of its MAOI action. At the time the trade began there was only one species of tobacco and that was Nicotiana rustica. This variety is a far more potent plant as far as chemicals go, it was used in shamanic ceremony because of its MAO inhibitory action. Now this species of plant is mainly used for pesticide production and it is also secretly blended into lower quality cigarette and pipe tobaccos for consumption here in the States and not so secretly outside of the USA. Tobacco was not refined for true spiritual use until the Mayans got hold of it and they still have not truly passed on their knowledge of cigars to anyone outside of the family, much to my disappointment. Like many rare styles of gong fu, the true cigar knowledge is in danger of passing from this world. My friend is in his 50s and of his 13 children, only one has shown any interest in learning. Hopefully my friend will follow the trend of his family: another 50 good years ahead of him and sire children into his 100s. While he has uncles and cousins who still use the same traditional cigar making methods, his grandfather taught him blending especially because the old man recognized talent and passion. Blending is the true art of cigar making. Anyone with manual skill can roll a cigar with little training; it takes a master to blend. Once the Mayans traded with the South Americans to get tobacco they set out to turn it into a quality product that was to be used without damaging the body. Nicotiana tabacum is the cultivar that came about from their selective breeding. They traded the seeds of the lower quality plants that they did not plan to keep to tribes further north and around the Caribbean, which is how the Native Americans here in the States got tobacco. Tobacco meant strictly for fine cigars did not move away from Mexico until the Mexican Revolution. While Cuba’s western portion of the island is perfect for growing excellent quality tobacco the tradition is lost in that country and was only there since the 1800s. Since it has been traded to the Old World tobacco has been made into cigarettes and cannabis smoking tools such as hookahs have made the smoke easier to inhale. The Native Americans here in the United States typically used long wooden pipes to cool the smoke. None of these methods are how the Mayan uses tobacco and none of the other peoples use the same quality of tobacco. Mayans DO NOT INHALE the smoke from their cigars. Tobacco burns at approximately 700F which is more than sufficient heat to cause immediate lung damage without a long pipe or water filtration to cool the smoke. The smoke is meant to be held in the mouth and absorbed through the membranes. Action similar to the “whiskey chew” should be made with the mouth after puffing so all parts of the palate are engaged and then the smoke should be blown out once you are satisfied with the flavor. There should be no intentional passing of smoke through the nose as the sinus membranes are extremely sensitive. A single commercial quality robusto (5” x 50/64”) or larger cigar is approximately equal to 70 cigarettes’ worth of nicotine and ammonia. Most of the other chemicals in cigarettes will most likely not be present in a commercial cigar unless the cigar is meant to be stored outside of a humidor and then the manufacturer will typically treat the tobacco with propylene glycol so it stays “fresh.” The next item to consider is that traditional shamanic use of tobacco required quite a bit different processing than is done commercially for today’s cigars. I will outline the process below. Harvest – The plant is divided into three sections divided by sun exposure from bottom to top these leaves are called volado, seco, and ligero. Harvest is still done by hand. Once the plant has been harvested it will be separated according to grade and appearance. Curing – This is the first step of aging cigar tobacco. The tobacco is air dried in a barn until the chlorophyll breaks down and the leaf turns brown. The curing process also removes the majority of the ammonia from the leaf as well. Many of the big tobacco companies will cure for anywhere from 2-6 months and most are trying to cut that time down. Some companies are inventing processes that speed this. For other types of consumption such as cigarettes and hookah tobacco this is the only aging the tobacco goes through. Also, many pipe and hookah tobaccos are smoke or sun cured which creates a different flavor profile. The nicotine in the curing process is collected for use as an additive in cigarettes later. Traditionally the curing process should take approximately 18 months. Fermentation – The second and arguably most important part of the aging process. In fermentation the tobacco is kept in a large warehouse or barn that is hot and humid. Some will lightly spray the tobacco with water or “solution.” More traditional operations will typically have a large wooden building with no windows and very little air flow. There are companies using newer methods such as heating the building, humidifiers, and thermal blankets to ferment their tobacco. Some companies are now using “maduro makers” to cook the tobacco so the leaf is much darker, unfortunately this does not usually impart the same quality of flavor as a true maduro. Fermentation is now typically about 6 months which is perhaps 1 rotation of the pilon (tobacco bunch). The bunch is only rotated once the tobacco in the center reaches a certain temperature. Traditionally each bunch of tobacco should be rotated a minimum of 3 times and typically that takes about 18 months. Aging – This is the number that can be elusive. Aging is typically marked from the time the tobacco was harvested in the commercial market. A typical “high quality” cigar on the market will be aged for approximately 3-5 years, even in Cuba. Before the 1970s the minimum amount of age a cigar could have before being sold would be 8 years. Once the tobacco is 8 years old it is almost guaranteed to be smooth and flavorful without damaging the mouth badly. The cigar masters will not typically smoke any cigar unless it is at least 30 years old. I have had the privilege to smoke cigars that are more than 50 years old and even got a few puffs off a stick that was made over 100 years ago by my friend’s grandfather. Any tobacco over 20 years old has a qualitatively different mouth feel and flavor. Wrapper leaves are the outside leaf visible on the body of the cigar and they are where cigar companies lose the most money. The companies changed their blending paradigms so they could market this leaf as the main driver of flavor. The wrapper is typically older than the rest of the construction so the companies can market a 3 year old filled cigar as a 15 year old wrapped cigar. The wrapper leaf was not used until the Spanish came. Perhaps the venous and irregular appearance of the cigar was too penile for an already phallic shape. A traditionally made cigar is not pretty and the traditional blending paradigm focuses on the filler leaves as the driver of flavor. Below is a review of an “ugly stick” made by my friend, contrast the pictures to what is normally seen in a cigar store. The cigar did have a wrapper leaf but it was not chosen for appearance. http://www.puff.com/forums/vb/non-habanos-reviews/120035-habanos-torres-40-year-aged-ugly-stick.html Tobacco is freely available to almost anyone now. The price is not prohibitive to most. In Mayan culture only nobility or someone with special status could smoke. The number of years in the production alone made this something available only for the elite. The cigars were blended to each person individually dependent on their temperament and purpose. I have experienced the medicinal side of these cigars myself. The most striking example I have ever seen of this is another friend of mine who is a Vietnam veteran with PTSD. His blend is very strong and is designed for his needs so he can be sociable. One should only smoke socially with his closest friends, smoking a cigar with an enemy or in an uncomfortable environment does not give it the respect it deserves. A Mayan shaman will typically smoke alone to relax and evaluate himself. Mayans are very much about thought before action and the ritual of smoking alone provides one with much peace and reflective time. A traditionally made cigar is typically 8-9” long and an inch or slightly larger in diameter. Dependent on the wind, the strength of the cigar, and one’s smoking rate a cigar of this size can last almost 3 hours. Many times the shaman would be smoking while being carried in a litter. Typically the elders weren’t carried unless they were mid-vision and could not walk. It’s late at night here so if you all have any further questions I hope I can answer them and that my post is understandable.

I'm getting it on Chrome 21.etc...

WWROA makes a good point as well. If you need a natural decongestant I highly recommend oregano oil.

I have what's called a Haller cell in my right sinus so it's damned near impossible for me to breathe normally. It takes a few long and slow breaths for it to clear up, usually anywhere between 2-5 minutes,

Kumar is a rather controversial figure in some circles. He is constantly being attacked as not having the "real internal" because his injuries prevent him from overtly displaying certain kinds of martial movement. That said, those I have spoken with who have actually trained with him say that while he may not always be the most personable instructor he definitely has a lot to teach.

Here are some translations of Chinese quanpu. http://brennantranslation.wordpress.com/

You have to turn off the game sometime.

He Jinghan's site doesn't really work for me often so I included his YouTube channel for Gong Bao Tian lineage Yin style Bagua quan as well. http://www.baguaquanlessons.com/ http://www.youtube.com/user/hejinghan A fellow that posts on Rum Soaked Fist that is rather knowledgeable. http://polariswushu.net/ A Baguazhang school out of Exeter UK's channel. http://www.youtube.com/user/8palmsofpower I really liked this fellow's Taijiquan Foundations series. http://www.youtube.com/user/charles888 This fellow mainly focuses on various Crane styles of kung fu but also other Southern styles as well. http://www.youtube.com/user/eric88ling A lot of stuff from Sifu Garry Hearfield's system. http://www.youtube.com/user/fiercesttiger This fellow has some great apps and posts regularly at Rum Soaked Fist. http://www.youtube.com/user/internalartsTV This channel is mainly devoted to Baji and Pigua. http://www.youtube.com/user/jingang A very successful "sword" competitor and his excellent videos. http://www.youtube.com/user/LonelysDen I think this one is mainly geared around Systema. http://www.youtube.com/user/perten A great collection of Chinese martial arts videos. http://www.youtube.com/user/SifuWu Another great collection of Chinese martial arts videos. http://www.youtube.com/user/TheaSinensisSerpenti

Thanks. The way I am being taught is that taiji is a martial art and the meditative aspect of it is only to facilitate analysis of movement and proper bodily alignment. My teacher practiced Yang style for 15 years and then met Chen Xiaowang and his martial skills went throught the roof. After meeting master Chen and training with one of his disciples, my teacher attained floating root in a year. It's crazy to see a 4'10" man jump 8' in the air as if it were nothing and snap off a double kick that I'm sure could kill me. He lost interest in a lot of the martial aspect after this as he was never much of a fighter to begin with, just wanted to be able to defend himself because he is a small person. My teacher insists that I learn the spiritual separate from the martial as that is how the Chen family insisted he learn. The family recommended healing and spiritual teachers for him. He says there is a lot of energetic potential in the movements but that cultivation should not be a focus in taiji. I have not learned forms at all but rather my teacher insists I practice chansigong and zhan zhuang. When he wants me to work on something he will show me a posture and have me transition into another so that I understand the focus of the movement. Then he will tell me which of the chansigong exercises contain the movement. Almost a Yiquan-esque approach to taiji. From what I have been taught it is better to open up the body with something like Temple qigong or baduanjin, move into chansigong, transition to zhan zhuang exercises once the body's pathways have been opened, and then to perform tan tui-like routines to send the qi out the legs and back to the lower dantian so as not to "short circuit" oneself. After the "tan tui" I usually practice slow and intricate footwork patterns and exercises similar to some of the Pencak Silat drills. Interestingly the "tan tui" I was taught was a little different than the standard 10 or 12 road to be more compatible with taiji principles and to preserve my knees. My teacher also encourages spontaneity in application and "form" so I am not stuck with routine movement patterns if I do need to fight. I had a friendly sparring match with a fellow a few months back and he was taken aback by how little time I have been practicing and how mobile I was for a taiji player. My teacher is very interested in baguazhang and plans to focus on it in the next few years when he has more money to train. Currently his focus is on his spiritual development. He asked me to obtain some Taoist texts for him so he could read and compare with the Yucatec Mayan teachings he learned from his grandfather. His opinion is that his grandfather gave him the poetry but that the Chinese are better engineers. I am more of the poet and he is definitely an engineer at heart. There is definitely a "sohbet" quality to most of our conversations and I always feel recharged afterward.

I will only talk about Chen style in detail here as that is what I have studied. Chen is the "original" style but this is debated heavily. There are influences from tongbei, Taizu chang quan, Shaolin quan, and also a heavy influence from Qi Jiguang's 32 postures. The perception that it is like a wave crashing against boulders and causing eddies is an apt description for what is often demonstrated. It depends on the practitioner as to how the art is expressed. The first form is often played very smoothly with different parts emphasizing fa jin. Some like to fa jin in different parts of the form, some don't fa jin at all, whereas some more advanced practitioners will try to fa jin in every movement. This is the first frame or liaojia yilu. The focus is that the hands follow the body to develop the different shen fa or body skills that power taiji. The intent should be even and calm, somewhat happy and relaxed to avoid excess adrenal stress. The Yang style public forms are based off of this frame, there is much debate as to what was taught to Yang indoor students and also what was practiced by the family itself. The Wu style is also based off of Yang. The second frame or liaojia erlu is more martially oriented. This is very similar to many Taizu Chang quan or other pao chui frames. In this set the idea is the the body follows the hands and then powers the strikes after the hands reach the opponent. This focus allows the practitioner to develop gradation of striking and throwing power and develop the "hard" aspect of the art. Going from extreme softness to extreme hardness is the focus of the first frame whereas this frame's focus is to transition from the extreme hardness back to the softness developed from the previous frame. The intent or yi should be fierce and every strike should be performed with the will to be a finishing or killing move. There is another group of Chen artists who also practice the xiaojia frame which is usually done with a higher stance but greater focus on chansijin and the other body methods. The movements are typically compact and not overtly martial. This frame was mainly practiced by the elderly members or those injured. It seems the form was lost at one point but was recovered by a female in modern times to Chen village. Wu/Hao style taiji is based on the xiaojia frame. Also Zhaobao and Huleijia taiji were both heavily influenced by the xiaojia frame. Sun style taiji is based on Sun Lutang's learning of Hao style, xingyi, and bagua. There is still more to the Chen piece of the puzzle because of the last hundred years' development of the art. Chen Fake created the Xinjia frames to help develop gong fu skill and in my opinion the focus for martial application of the new frames is mainly geared toward qinna. There is a much greater focus on integration of chansijin and chansigong exercises were created as well to accelerate the learning process. The xinjia frames have caused something of a political rift in Chen village as many of the villagers were not taught these frames and exercises while Chen Fake was away. There is also some speculation as to the formulation of these frames, Chen Fake had a lot of interaction with other high level martial artists and seemed to have been a friend of a bajiquan master, that style also focuses greatly on chansijin. Two students of Chen Fake have also created their own styles of taiji. Hong's Practical Method of taijiquan is best represented in my opinion by Chen Zhonghua to Westerners and is mainly pre-xinjia with a Wu style influence from Hong Junsheng's first teacher Liu MuSan. There is still a great focus on chansijin. The next offshoot from Chen Fake is Feng Zhiqiang's Chen shi Xinyi Hunyuan Taiji. Most of the frame is post-xinjia and there are influences from Feng's xingyi, tongbei, and qigong learning from Hu Yaozhen. It wasn't until Feng was teaching in Chen village that zhan zhuang practice was introduced to the village. Previously the focus had been more on ding shi or transition between movements in the frame as opposed to pole standing. Forms training is then informed by push hands or tui shou. Push hands was originally designed as a less dangerous training method than free fighting. Push hands allows one to develop skills such as "listening" and also force redirection and revectoring. There are different patterns and levels of intensity and much of what is practiced now at higher intensity is very similar to shuai jiao practice. Somehow modern versions of this have become competitive, which is confusing considering that the idea was to gradually ramp up to free fighting or san shou. Striking practice seems to have been de-emphasized in many of the Chen village lineages however Feng Zhiqiang's students seem to have a healthy development of that skill as do some lineages from the Wu style. The modern focus of the art is now on empty hand but it is important to understand that the "martial" aspect of this art was intended for use on the battlefield or in mercenary engagements. The weapons forms are where one really refines one's skill and also these weapons were what the art was designed to power. Keeping the shen fa when wielding a large spear or sword can be extremely difficult but also very effective. While it is difficult to practice safely with a live blade or weapon this is the ultimate goal and will produce much precision in one's practice as well as increased strength and ability to project intent through an opponent.