Aaron

[Note- Although posted in the Taoist Discussions section of this forum, this thread is intended to be a chapter study of Chapter five of the Hua Hu Ching. With that in mind please restrict your responses to the chapter at hand. Any discussions regarding the validity, origins, or intent of the Hua Hu Ching should be directed to another thread and not this one. I welcome everyone to participate. Questions are welcome, as well as answers. Please follow the FAQ rules located in the Tao Te Ching subforum (changing Tao Te Ching to Hua Hu Ching where needed).] Hua Hu Ching Chapter Five Do you imagine the universe is agitated? Go into the desert at night and look out at the stars. This practice should answer the question. The superior person settles her mind as the universe settles the stars in the sky. By connecting her mind with the subtle origin, she calms it. Once calmed, it naturally expands, and ultimately her mind becomes as vast and immeasurable as the night sky. Translated by Brian Browne Walker brianbrownewalker.com/hua-hu-ching

I've been trying to change my avatar, but I receive the same error message each time. I'm not certain why there is an error, because the image I am uploading is within the kb size limit and also meets the pixel size requirements. Anyone have any idea what the issue might be? Aaron

You are the person breathing right now. You know you. Maybe you don't like the you you know and want to be someone different. In the end you will always be you, so embrace yourself and then you can see without ego who you are.

[Note- Although posted in the Taoist Discussions section of this forum, this thread is intended to be a chapter study of Chapter two of the Hua Hu Ching. With that in mind please restrict your responses to the chapter at hand. Any discussions regarding the validity, origins, or intent of the Hua Hu Ching should be directed to another thread and not this one. I welcome everyone to participate. Questions are welcome, as well as answers. Please follow the FAQ rules located in the Tao Te Ching subforum (changing Tao Te Ching to Hua Hu Ching where needed).] Hua Hu Ching Chapter 2 Men and women who wish to be aware of the whole truth should adopt the practices of the Integral Way. These time-honored disciplines calm the mind and bring one into harmony with all things. The first practice is the practice of undiscriminating virtue: take care of those who are deserving; also, and equally, take care of those who are not. When you extend your virtue in all directions without discriminating, your feet are firmly planted on the path that returns to the Tao. Translated by Brian Browne Walker http://brianbrownewa...m/hua-hu-ching/

[Note- Although posted in the Taoist Discussions section of this forum, this thread is intended to be a chapter study of Chapter one of the Hua Hu Ching. With that in mind please restrict your responses to the chapter at hand. Any discussions regarding the validity, origins, or intent of the Hua Hu Ching should be directed to another thread and not this one. I welcome everyone to participate. Questions are welcome, as well as answers. Please follow the FAQ rules located in the Tao Te Ching subforum (changing Tao Te Ching to Hua Hu Ching where needed).] Hua Hu Ching Chapter One I reach the Integral Way of uniting with the great and mysterious Tao. My teachings are simple; if you try to make a religion or science of them, they will elude you. Profound yet plain, they contain the entire truth of the universe. Those who wish to know the whole truth take joy in doing the work and service that comes to them. Having completed it, they take joy in cleansing and feeding themselves. Having cared for others and for themselves, they then turn to the master for instruction. This simple path leads to peace, virtue, and abundance. Translated by Brian Browne Walker http://brianbrownewa...m/hua-hu-ching/

It's been about a month since my mother passed away. It was surreal. I almost got killed the day after by an angry semi truck driver that tried to drive me off the road as I drove up to get her belongings from the nursing home. I had grown distant from my mother over the last few years, but a couple months ago I found out she was dying from cancer and reached out to her to make my own amends. I was able to do all of that, which made it that much easier when she finally did pass. So this is the thing, I don't believe in heaven or an "after life", nor do I believe we can without a doubt prove that reincarnation exists. I'm agnostic at best, maybe I lean a bit more towards the atheist side, however, I don't grieve for her. The reason being that I know, regardless, she's not suffering and she was suffering. People can argue the "sanctity of human life" but until you see someone suffering immensely you don't realize how much of a blessing death can be. My greatest and only regret, was not being there at the end. I didn't want her to be alone in that moment, not because I wanted to spend those last minutes with her, but because I didn't want her to die suffering and alone, I wanted her to know she had people that loved her at that time. Again that's my only regret, and If I could've been there I would've, however I had surgery the week before she passed and was still suffering from complications. The night I found out she had passed there was an odd peace. It's hard to explain, a bit of sadness, but more of an emotional silence. I loved my mother, but my time as a Taoist/Buddhist/hindi/etc. has taught me that even though I think she's gone, she's not really gone. She may very well never have been here in the first place, so putting the time and energy into grieving for her does nothing to bring her back and does nothing to ease my own suffering, nor does it somehow quantify how much I cared for her, so if I am truly being compassionate towards her and myself, then learning to let her go and let myself move on should be my goal. So, how was this different from my father's passing? Well he passed when I was much younger (twenty-one) and I had only just begun to read about Taoism. Attachment was the norm and compassion, especially towards myself, wasn't something I really understood. I was devastated when he passed. I had been living with him at that time and had actually argued with him the night before. My greatest regret at that time was that I thought he had died thinking I was angry or hated him. In retrospect I realize that he knew better. However the memory of those emotions, of that feeling of loss, comes back even now, which is strange, because he was also dying from cancer, he just never told anyone, and you would think I would feel relieved for his passing. So the difference, I guess, is that knowing my place in this world and my relationship to other people has allowed me to accept this as not a loss, but a blessing for my mother. Whereas my still undeveloped mind was unable to accept the death of my father, due to my inability to understand the nature of death at that time. Both deaths were blessings, and if anyone suffered from those deaths, it was not my parents, but their loved ones, and of course, me. Oh that's the other thing, both my parents passed away from lung cancer. You can guess what habit I gave up. I just thought I'd share, because this is one of those universal experiences and I thought maybe these observations might help someone else.

A Taoist, by definition, is someone who identifies as a follower of Taoism, or follows the teaching of Taoism. It's nothing more than a title in the end and should not be deemed to certify someone as "in the know". There are a lot of Taoists who merely identify and have no understanding of the deeper meaning. Remember, "he who knows says little." edit- I should add, that's fine too. If that's what they need, then let them be.

If you want to learn about the person Japhy Ryder was based on, it was Gary Snyder, one of the early Western Zen Monks, who also is an amazing poet who helped bring Buddhism to main stream America. Ray Smith's character is based on Jack Kerouac himself, or maybe Neil Cassidy, I can't remember.

Thank you for sharing, it was appreciated. I wish you well.

Your greatest gift is your ability to hear and then decide for yourself whether you agree or disagree with what you hear. My suggestion is listen to what people are saying, be as objective as you can, but don't blindly believe what people are saying, simply because they're "experts" or "been doing this a long time". When you have been doing this a long time you will have your own ideas of what is right and wrong, what is "taoist" and what isn't, however, at the risk of letting the cat out of the bag, there really is no such thing as a Taoist, unless you want to call yourself a Taoist, then there is such a thing. So to be a bit more pointed and empathetic, if you look at some of my earliest posts on this forum, I to was "seeking a pure Taoism" one that "was free from the taint of Buddhism" only to come to realize many years later that they are both amazing philosophies and the reason several billion people adhere to both is because they are symbiotic in many ways. One of the problems we have in the west is that we see things in black and white, good or bad, Buddhist or Taoist. This isn't really an Eastern way of thinking, they tend to see the gray, then the color. I think when you see the gray first, it actually helps you identify the color more clearly. P.S. Zen actually helped me understand the Tao more than Taoist philosophy did.

I was thinking posting the next chapter two days after the previous one, might be a good way to go. It will allow the discussion of the previous chapter to continue, but also allow us to explore the next chapter with the previous still in context. We don't have to do it that way, but I thought it might be nice. I am not going to remove myself from the forum, but I would much rather read the various inputs of other people regarding these chapters. I will refrain from giving commentary on my own views of the chapter's meaning, unless I feel the necessity. Chapter Two (Translated by John C. H. Wu) When all the world recognises beauty as beauty, this in itself is ugliness. When all the world recognises good as good, this in itself is evil. Indeed, the hidden and the manifest give birth to each other. Difficult and easy complement each other. Long and short exhibit each other. High and low set measure to each other. Voice and sound harmonize each other. Back and front follow each other. Therefore, the Sage manages his affairs without ado, And spreads his teaching without talking. He denies nothing to the teeming things. He rears them, but lays no claim to them. He does his work, but sets no store by it. He accomplishes his task, but does not dwell upon it. And yet it is just because he does not dwell on it That nobody can ever take it away from him. ------------- Chapter Two (Translated by Gia-fu Feng and Jane English) Under heaven all can see beauty as beauty only because there is ugliness. All can know good as good only because there is evil. Therefore having and not having arise together. Difficult and easy complement each other. Long and short contrast each other: High and low rest upon each other; Voice and sound harmonize each other; Front and back follow one another. Therefore the sage goes about doing nothing, teaching no-talking. The ten thousand things rise and fall without cease, Creating, yet not. Working, yet not taking credit. Work is done, then forgotten. Therefore it lasts forever. ---------------- I look forward to hearing people's input. Aaron

I got this article from Rense.com. I will put it here and allow you to decide for yourself. Dr. Lawrence Britt has examined the fascist regimes of Hitler (Germany), Mussolini (Italy), Franco (Spain), Suharto (Indonesia) and several Latin American regimes. Britt found 14 defining characteristics common to each: 1. Powerful and Continuing Nationalism - Fascist regimes tend to make constant use of patriotic mottos, slogans, symbols, songs, and other paraphernalia. Flags are seen everywhere, as are flag symbols on clothing and in public displays. 2. Disdain for the Recognition of Human Rights - Because of fear of enemies and the need for security, the people in fascist regimes are persuaded that human rights can be ignored in certain cases because of "need." The people tend to look the other way or even approve of torture, summary executions, assassinations, long incarcerations of prisoners, etc. 3. Identification of Enemies/Scapegoats as a Unifying Cause - The people are rallied into a unifying patriotic frenzy over the need to eliminate a perceived common threat or foe: racial , ethnic or religious minorities; liberals; communists; socialists, terrorists, etc. 4. Supremacy of the Military - Even when there are widespread domestic problems, the military is given a disproportionate amount of government funding, and the domestic agenda is neglected. Soldiers and military service are glamorized. 5. Rampant Sexism - The governments of fascist nations tend to be almost exclusively male-dominated. Under fascist regimes, traditional gender roles are made more rigid. Divorce, abortion and homosexuality are suppressed and the state is represented as the ultimate guardian of the family institution. 6. Controlled Mass Media - Sometimes to media is directly controlled by the government, but in other cases, the media is indirectly controlled by government regulation, or sympathetic media spokespeople and executives. Censorship, especially in war time, is very common. 7. Obsession with National Security - Fear is used as a motivational tool by the government over the masses. 8. Religion and Government are Intertwined - Governments in fascist nations tend to use the most common religion in the nation as a tool to manipulate public opinion. Religious rhetoric and terminology is common from government leaders, even when the major tenets of the religion are diametrically opposed to the government's policies or actions. 9. Corporate Power is Protected - The industrial and business aristocracy of a fascist nation often are the ones who put the government leaders into power, creating a mutually beneficial business/government relationship and power elite. 10. Labor Power is Suppressed - Because the organizing power of labor is the only real threat to a fascist government, labor unions are either eliminated entirely, or are severely suppressed. 11. Disdain for Intellectuals and the Arts - Fascist nations tend to promote and tolerate open hostility to higher education, and academia. It is not uncommon for professors and other academics to be censored or even arrested. Free expression in the arts and letters is openly attacked. 12. Obsession with Crime and Punishment - Under fascist regimes, the police are given almost limitless power to enforce laws. The people are often willing to overlook police abuses and even forego civil liberties in the name of patriotism. There is often a national police force with virtually unlimited power in fascist nations. 13. Rampant Cronyism and Corruption - Fascist regimes almost always are governed by groups of friends and associates who appoint each other to government positions and use governmental power and authority to protect their friends from accountability. It is not uncommon in fascist regimes for national resources and even treasures to be appropriated or even outright stolen by government leaders. 14. Fraudulent Elections - Sometimes elections in fascist nations are a complete sham. Other times elections are manipulated by smear campaigns against or even assassination of opposition candidates, use of legislation to control voting numbers or political district boundaries, and manipulation of the media. Fascist nations also typically use their judiciaries to manipulate or control elections.

"Allow him sixteen hours of sleep daily and provide him with lots of pickled cucumbers and Wu-Ming will always be happy. Expect nothing of him and you will be happy."

I believe dreams were the key to the rise of non-duality, an understanding that perception doesn't necessarily equate to reality and that reality may be something greater than what our physical senses can perceive. To say that dreams are not perception is like saying there is no sound because you are deaf and can not hear it. If you're deaf that may be true for you, but the majority will tell you otherwise, just as the dreamer will tell you that while they were dreaming it was quite real, even if it was all but a dream. In the end perception is the key, when we can escape perception and live in the moment, then the necessity of perception as a means to understand what is, is left behind and we can finally become free. Eternity exists within each moment.

One man's beauty is another man's ugliness, literally. Worrying about subjective qualities isn't necessarily a good thing. For a long time I've lived by the rule, does it harm me? Does it harm someone else? Then what's the harm in it? Live and let live. Don't covet thy neighbor's wife and all that. In the end we will find that purity is an illusion and beauty never lasts, so stay with the baggage wagon and don't worry so much about the party happening somewhere else.

When I was young(er) I was quick to tell everyone what I was. As I got older I realized that most people wouldn't understand anyway or they would judge me based on their misconceptions, so I've learned to be what I am and leave my personal beliefs and practices to myself. As far as the (relative) safety of this forum goes, I would say I'm an open minded person who practices Taoism, Vedanta, and Buddhism to varying degrees. I pick and choose, because I can and no one can stop me.

This is it in a nutshell, we are all the universe, but only in the sense that the bacteria in our stomach that we use to help digest food is also us. We are tiny, minuscule, but arguably a necessary part of the universe, because without one of us, the universe (everything) would not not exist anymore. To say that we do not have free will is something we can't answer, because if it was true, how would we ever know?

Genetically we find that the Indians in Northern India are genetically descended from Middle Easterners, whereas the Indians in Southern India (and Sri Lanka) are a distinct people. So there could be an argument for an invasion, but it would also have to define what constitutes an invasion of India since the southern half of India apparently escaped it. However keep in mind a united India was only a recent idea and historically it was separated into many different kingdoms.

To answer your question, no. And you will die trying.

His "The Book:On the Taboo of Knowing Who You Are" is one of my favorite books period. I highly recommend it to anyone interested in learning more about Vedanta.

Enlightenment doesn't free one from the obligations of daily living. A schizophrenic who achieves enlightenment is still a schizophrenic. I've met many schizophrenics who are wonderful loving, wise, and knowledgeable individuals. I had a lengthy conversation about Vedanta with a schizophrenic friend and their reply, as if it was a matter of fact, was, "Well that makes sense, doesn't it?" No argument, no questions about self or the id and ego. We stigmatize people without knowing them and in the end it causes us to forget that each of us is each of us, and one is all and all is one.

Chapter 19 DROP wisdom, abandon cleverness, And the people will be benefited a hundredfold. Drop humanity, abandon justice, And the people will return to their natural affections. Drop shrewdness, abandon sharpness, And robbers and thieves will cease to be. These three are the criss-cross of Tao, And are not sufficient in themselves. Therefore, they should be subordinated To a Higher principle: See the Simple and embrace the Primal, Diminish the self and curb the desires! Tao Te Ching- Tr. John C. H. Wu

Anger is the most insidious of emotions. It causes us the most grief and causes others the most pain. It is only when we understand the nature of anger, to protect us, that we can use it appropriately. One should never act in anger, rather they should use it as a sign that they have become emotionally invested in what's happening and need to take time to reflect, so that they do not act rashly. If you can do this, then revenge is never needed.

Recovering from trauma isn't like building a chair, what I mean, is that people recover in different ways, or fail to recover in different ways. The important thing is to seek help if the trauma is causing you distress. Talking about it can help a lot, but having a professional who can guide you through the healing process can go a long way towards recovering from it.

First, Taoism is not a warrior tradition, it's a tradition warriors have followed. Taoism is a philosophy that, like many religions is oftentimes used to justify people's actions. Nowhere in the Tao Te Ching does it encourage revenge, in fact it does the opposite. It says, essentially, that one should strive to live a life that is in harmony with others and that, if you're succeeding at this, then there should never be the need for revenge, murder, or defending one's self.