Aaron

In the spirit of compassion, I give all my points to you. Aaron

We're both right... that's the joy of forum life. Aaron

Hello Rene, Check out 1, 3, and 9... if you can't see it leaning in that direction by then, then there's nothing else for me to say and I probably wont say anything else, because it's how I feel and what I saw, if you don't see it, so be it. I'm merely expressing my view which differs from yours, eh and oh. Aaron edit- Also did Derek explain that was what he was doing or did you somehow see a pattern that led to that? Honestly I don't see that happening over there, that's why I was wondering.

Hello Steve, I'm sorry you've gone through what you have. I've made posts like this, vented a bit, trying to clean out the wreckage of the past, hoping there was someone else who understood, who knew how horrible and confusing it all was. I know. I know and I'm sorry. If it makes you feel any better, I don't see your father in you, I see a compassionate and caring man who's trying very hard to make do with what he's been given, and in my opinion is doing an excellent job. Aaron

Hello Stigweard, As a more focused response to this question, preferences are natural (in my opinion) because thinking is natural and in order to actually make a decision it requires us to prefer one thing over another. Now if thinking isn't natural, then of course preferences aren't natural either, because preference infers some kind of attachment, either on an emotional or logical level. My real question is what you wanted to learn from posing this question? I mean that sincerely, oftentimes understanding the intention broadens one's vision in regards to the topic. Aaron

I agree... and keep in mind that the full lotus is by no means a requirement. If you can't sit in that position there are alternatives. Reaching enlightenment does not require one to be a masochist. Aaron

Well I hope that you never get in that kind of situation. I remember being in line at the store one day. A mother bought her child a candy bar with a food stamps card, the woman behind her whispered to me, "I don't pay taxes so she can buy her child a candy bar." I wonder what she would've said if her child was the one asking for a candy bar? As far as how I practice compassion, I do it to the best of my ability and I don't think there's any need to explain it in detail. I will also say that I don't advocate anything I don't actually practice on a day to day basis. As far as someone who has gotten themselves into the situation they're in, repeatedly bailing them out is oftentimes worse than letting them experience a bit of pain. Pain is the touchstone of change, so there's nothing that says you shouldn't let someone get burnt so they learn that fire is hot. A lot of it has to do with the intention behind what you're doing. Aaron

Hello Rene, If you can't see it in what Sean stated or what Stigweard has said, then I don't know how to make it any clearer. I think sometimes we choose to see what we want to see. If you would like me to point out the specific comments, I can, but I think if you look closer you'll be able to see it too. Also I would suggest not disparaging other forums, much of what you say about them, they say about you. It's best just to let each community exist on its own the way that they feel they should. Aaron

Well I'm neither a Taoist, a Buddhist, or a realist, so I can understand what you're saying. However reality states that you could very well be the person that requires compassion one day, so what say you about the person who decides you don't deserve it? Aaron

That's like describing the color of red to a blind person. If they've never experienced sight, how can they truly understand what red is? The closest thing I could do (if I have ever really experienced it) is describe it in a fashion that will never really give it its due. In the same way, one does not need to see red for red to be a part of their world, and to take it one step further, if everything that is natural is made of this color, then it seems to me that it would behoove people to attempt to come to an understanding of it, rather than just describe what they think it is. Aaron

Hello Marblehead, That is my point, in that regard, you are the ultimate authority. The fact is, once we determine who deserves compassion and who doesn't, then that act is no longer compassion, but as you stated, charity. In order to practice compassion at an innate level, one cannot force it, but rather it naturally arises in response to ones understanding of the nature of the world. As Steve pointed out, that is one reason why you are having trouble understanding my point, because you don't perceive your connection to the world in the same way that I do. Should criminals be punished for their behavior? Should a child be punished for slapping another child? The idea is not that there should be no consequences for actions, but rather that one feels (the operative word is feels) compassion for others and uses compassion as a basis for how they treat others. I can't feed everyone in the world, nor is it my responsibility to do so, but at the same time, if I understand that you are me and I am you, then if I see you suffer, there is no way that I cannot feel that suffering as well. Aaron

I think one of the issues I have with the traditional steps is the idea of a "moral inventory". They try to soften it in places, but overall it is still a "moral inventory", not a list of character defects. In my mind as soon as you throw the word "moral" in their, you are saying that alcoholism arises from immorality. I've never believed that. I think alcoholism arises, not of immorality, not out of fear, but out of suffering. One practices and addiction because they suffer, even if they are not aware of their suffering. The practice of the addiction is a distraction, it allows one to escape the suffering for a period of time. I don't think that immorality plays a part in this suffering, rather our actions play a part in it. Anyways that's just one area where I disagree with the general consensus. If we wanted to really discuss this, perhaps we should start with the alternate step one? We came to understand that we had a problem that we could not control and that our lives were out of control. So how does this differ from the current thinking about the step? Aaron

Hello Marblehead, I don't think that was your intention either, but I hear it's underlying current and I sense on a deeper level that the intent here (in the thread, not so much your comments) seems to be an attempt to present human preference as being natural and thus allowing a rationalization that any behavior that one decides is okay is okay. As I stated elsewhere, "when humanity arises, Tao is diminished." Of course Tao is never diminished, rather it is our direct awareness that is diminished. I think in order to truly understand the nature of this question and discuss it without hypotheticals, one would need to first be aware of the true nature of Tao. Aaron

Fine, so who decides who deserves compassion? When humanity arises, Tao is diminished. They are suggestions, only in the sense that there is no requirement that one practice them, however if one truly wishes to become aware of the nature of Tao, well then I would recommend dropping the idea that it's a suggestion. Aaron

Hmm... that sounds like a bit of a cop out to me. It's like saying, "I can do whatever I feel like doing, so long as it suits me (or the Tao, Buddha, God, ad infinitum)." I'm sure you didn't intend it to be, but when I hear this argument arise (preference and natural) most of time it inevitably descends into a debate about "right and wrong" and "morality vs. innate", essentially an argument that people should be able to do whatever they want to. I think simply making the point, you reap what you sow, answers that question. Aaron

I find it sad that people consider compassion to be "idealism". I suppose humility and frugality are idealistic as well. Aaron

The only point I wish to add to this discussion is that I think you're misinterpreting "not sentimental" for "impartial". They aren't the same thing. One can not be sentimental and still be partial, so can the Tao. The idea is that there are no emotional attachments to the action, rather it happens because it's supposed to happen. That doesn't mean the Tao doesn't "prefer" natural over unnatural, or that we should not prefer food over poison. Aaron

Hello Marblehead, I think you're missing my point, true compassion, compassion that springs from the source, is not idealistic, because it doesn't come from an ideal, moral, or ethic, but rather the need to do what is natural. When you reach an understanding of your place in this world, really understand the true nature of the world, then I believe that there is little that one can do but feel compassion. You are me and I am you. It really is that simple. Aaron

Thanks for your comments 3l3vat3, it's nice to know I'm not the only one who feels a need for something like this. Aaron

My question is how do you clarify the water by adding blood to it? Aaron

Hello Kate, The world for me was so much better when I gave up drinking (even if it took awhile to realize it). There's this saying in recovery that many people have a hard time understanding at first, "I will neither regret the past, nor wish to shut the door on it." For me this rings true, I am completely happy without alcohol. I have no desire to drink, even in the midst of a party. I honestly have no regrets about what's happened in my life, because what's happened has gotten me to the place I am today. I will not shut the door on my past, because I try to live a life of rigorous honesty and compassion, one that requires that I face the things that I've done, accept them and try to correct those things that I can. What the program is about, at it's core, is teaching people to live life on life's terms. In order to do that, they need to learn to live again, rather than wake up and do the same thing they've been doing that got them to the place they are. As far as why are they doing what they are doing? Well that question isn't so easy to come to for most people, but if people are painstaking and thorough, they do come to that awareness. Before they can come to that awareness, they need to first recognize that something is wrong, without that, very few people are motivated to make the kinds of changes that are necessary to recover from an addiction. I've seen amazing things happen in recovery, not only in my own life, but in the lives of others who have recovered. As someone stated, the twelve steps as they are, work for many people, my goal isn't to reach the people that it works for, but rather to present the steps in a way that can work for those people that the twelve steps can't reach. Most people in AA don't feel comfortable talking about these sorts of things, because there's a sort of code of silence, one that assumes the only people that can truly understand what the steps are about are those who are suffering from an addiction. I don't believe that. I think the steps can work for anyone and that they can be incorporated into any spiritual path to help someone understand themselves on a deeper level. Anyways, I've probably said enough. If you have any more questions, please feel free to ask. Aaron

It's not so much the appearance of reality but your awareness of reality. An apple is still an apple, a bird is still a bird, but the way you view yourself in connection with that bird is completely different. You are as much a part of that bird as it is you. You understand that just because you're not touching something, doesn't mean you're not touching it. You see the person in front of you, not as a stranger, but as yourself. You treat people, not as strangers anymore, because no one is a stranger. We all spring from Tao, everything in creation, so we all come from one source and that source is within everything and connects everything. I am the man that lived 200,000 years ago, just as I am the man I am today. Death is not the end, but the beginning. My existence is not tied to the small lot of time that I am existing right now, but the entirety of existence. You are Tao and I am Tao. I am It and you are It. We are no longer I, but It. Knowing that and becoming aware of it are two different things. I know this is the way things are, but have I truly become aware of it, have I learned that the simplest of actions, just opening my eyes and seeing what is before me in the mirror, is not everything, but is everything? Anyways, more wackiness. Aaron

I believe reality is an illusion. When we become aware, it falls away like a house of mirrors, revealing it's true appearance. How's that for a bit of wackiness? Aaron

Researchers are finding more and more evidence that premature ejaculation is mostly psychological and that it's caused by stress and intimacy issues. If you are really worried about this, then perhaps you should try to reduce the stress in your life and examine whether or not you have issues with intimacy. Personally all I can say is that nearly every man in their life will experience premature ejaculation. It's not the end of the world and it does pass. I told you not to worry before and I'll tell you again, don't worry. Also if you're only prematurely ejaculating during masturbation, that doesn't count, because the way they identify whether you are actually prematurely ejaculating is whether or not you are ejaculating before your partner. The exercises that they prescribe in most cases have to do with stopping prior to ejaculation in an attempt to lengthen the period before orgasm. This has mixed results and doesn't always work. I am not a doctor so don't take this as medical advice, I'm only stating what I know, not recommending anything. If I did recommend something to you, it would be to chill out and relax, let it go and don't worry. Life is too short to worry about something like this. Enjoy life. Have fun. If you have a partner, explain to them that you're prematurely ejaculating and I'm sure they'll understand. Just keep in mind there are other ways to ensure your partner experiences an orgasm prior to your ejaculation, so really premature ejaculation for me is just impatience. Aaron

There are no steps to the Tao, so you are right, but there is a program of recovery that is based on steps, that's where the steps come from. Aaron