Simple_Jack

FYI, "mindfulness" is termed sati. This is the fundamental technique or the way of approach to entering and abiding in jhana and when doing vipassana (which by the way can be done in both the meditative and post-meditative period.) What have you read so far on the subject of meditative absorption? Yes. I can post some links. I can also PM you some stuff if you want. There's a whole lot of free material on the web. Entire books that can be read for free. Here's some links to get you started: http://www.dharmaoverground.org/web/guest/discussion/-/message_boards/message/1191517 http://www.dharmaoverground.org/web/guest/discussion/-/message_boards/message/1286373 Read those two links first. Then you can do a bit more research here: http://measurelessmind.ca/

Interesting. What is it from the tradition, students, or material of Pa-Auk Sayadaw? They follow the Visuddhimagga style of appraoach, instead of the sutta style. Or was it from someone in Mahayana? It wasn't one of Bill Bodri's books was it? Considering that you use the term "emptiness" meditation, when the way of using that term doesn't exist in the Pali or Mahayana cannon: You must have got it from Bill Bodri's material. It's referred to as samatha , zhine (Tib..) or just calm abiding. The absorption states would be called either jhana (Pali,) or dhyana (Skt.,) in Buddhism (though the word samadhi is used also.) FYI, teaching samatha-vipassana separately is a modern approach. Traditionally (how it was taught in Buddha's time) it was taught to be used together. Though, I'm not dismissing any one approach here. There are different ways or styles of doing this.

How come? Is it because you're not sure of how to apply it? Is it because you question it's validity or the context of it's use in Buddhism?

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Both approaches have thier pros and cons. Going about it the way you mentioned, isnt without merit. Though, people today are still making progress on straight up samatha-vipassana; all you have to do is look over at the dharmaoverground forums. Plus, you could always do both approaches.

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Saw these on the site you linked, where he lists some of his favorite books: A Path with Heart, by Jack Kornfield: an masterwork. A must have. Vast, accessible, rich and deep. Buy this and read it twice, at least. A great place for both beginners and advanced meditators to start and finish. Only major problem is that is it so nicely written and gentle you might not realize how hard hitting it is. Assume it is very hard hitting and technical despite its friendly tone and you will get more out of it. After the Ecstasy, the Laundry, by Jack Kornfield: a wonderful, reality-based, down-to-earth discussion of spiritual awakening. I never paid attention to his books before. From the titles: I've always thought they were strictly for beginners.

Ah, ok. Well, sorry to break to you, but when doing shamatha (or calm abiding) practice: No matter whether you're doing anapana (concentration on the breath,) visualizing a tantric deity, or staring at poop as a meditation object: Shit's gonna start becoming more noticeable. FYI, shamatha practice/cultivating jhana, is only one aspect of Buddhist meditation. In conjunction, there is vipassana/vipasyana (clear seeing or insight meditation) which makes up the other half of Buddhist meditation. What is it you are trying to get out of this? What is it you eventually hope to acheive with this?

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This is an overarching question, one that can't be answered so simply. Though, generally it is common for individuals to start noticing their tendencies, neurotic behavior, etc., when starting to access deeper and deeper levels of concentration. In conjunction, this can be triggered on a subtle energetic level as your body's esoteric channels start to 'clear out' and open; all sorts of [karmic] habit energies will start to 'bubble up.' As for the 'stages,' of what to expect or what might happen...I would look into Daniel Ingram's "Mastering The Core Teachings Of The Buddha." Despite what the title says: The author has mapped out the stages of what people will generally go through based on his own experiences. Though it's focus is more on the psychological aspect than a focus on the energy channels (though it goes into it briefly.) EDIT: When you say "Qigong meditation,"do you mean (seated) neigong? Or just the standing movement form er, qigong?

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I'm mainly addressing an individual's experience of dukkha. What you're going on about has been addressed; going by the 5 skhanda model: That would fall under the volition skhanda. I wonder what Apech has to say about all this?

Sorry, I forgot to add this since I was intending to direct this question to Apech. Apech, I'm just curious as to what your experiences with the teachings since you said this: For instance, how have you investigated or analyzed the four noble truths in order to come to an understanding of or to even accept such an idea? I'm asking because this is isn't always readily understood or discernible to most individuals. I mean we know that things are constantly changing and whatnot, but due to the overriding factor of ignorance (haha which drives the whole chain of causation) we seem to ignore or choose to be oblivious to the constant and undeniable fact of impermanence. We seem to compensate this by seeking: Going so far as to look for something elsewhere, or to find something "other" than these changing moments. Are you aware of how it is explained that this is driven by craving? A very primal force, so powerful that it drives this whole process of (what is called) becoming. This craving for existence, which propels us to seek what is pleasureable and avoid that which unpleasureable; going hither and fro in a mad frenzy....somewhat like a chicken running with it's head cut off. How have you been able to discern for yourself, that this is something you can accept? I mean, this is very deep stuff.....Have you ever analyzed this when going about? Have you noted how this process expressses itself in the way we react to stimuli or sensations; how we respond emotionally when in contact with environmental sense stimuli? Have you noticed how most of this is being driven towards either either desire for or aversion against these sense stimuli? Have you been able to notice how afflictive modes have been able to influence the cognitive process, when interacting with sense phenomena? How they arise, based on either craving or aversion? Have you seriously analyzed how this process gets started? Or how (as Buddhism puts it) this fundamental desire for becoming creates these conditions? I actually am curious, if you've given this some thought.

I LOL'ed at this. Dukkha is one of the most misunderstood aspects of Buddhism. It's described as having three different categories: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dukkha Dukkha of ordinary suffering Pali: dukkha-dukkha Also referred to as the suffering of suffering. Includes the sufferings of birth, aging, sickness, death, and coming across what is not desirable. This outer level of dukkha includes all of the obvious physical suffering or pain associated with giving birth, growing old, physical illness and the process of dying. Dukkha produced by change Pali: viparinama-dukkha Also referred to as: suffering of change or suffering of impermanence. Includes two categories: trying to hold onto what is desirable, and not getting what you want. Buddhist author Chogyam Trungpa includes the category "not knowing what you want." Pema Chödrön described this type of suffering as the suffering of trying to hold onto things that are always changing. This inner level of dukkha includes the anxiety or stress of trying to hold onto things that are constantly changing. Dukkha of conditioned states Pali sankhara-dukkha Also referred to as all-pervasive suffering This category is also identified as one of the "eight types of suffering". Pema Chodron describes this as the suffering of ego-clinging; the suffering of struggling with life as it is, as it presents itself to you; struggling against outer situations and yourself, your own emotions and thoughts, rather than just opening and allowing. This is a subtle form of suffering arising as a reaction to qualities of conditioned things, including the skandhas, the factors constituting the human mind. This is the deepest, most subtle level of dukkha; it includes "a basic unsatisfactoriness pervading all existence, all forms of life, due to the fact that all forms of life are changing, impermanent and without any inner core or substance."[web 9] On this level, the term indicates a lack of satisfaction, a sense that things never measure up to our expectations or standards. "All-pervasive suffering is the suffering inherent in the fact of being born with contaminated aggregates, which by their very nature are like a magnet attracting sickness, old age and death." -Wangchuk Dorje

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Some very helpful articles from dharoverground.org. Who's the guy who wrote them? Just some average Joe who applied the Buddhas teachings at age 48 and who really started to make progress. http://www.dharmaoverground.org/web/guest/discussion/-/message_boards/message/1191517 How I Came to Practice Jhana I didn't begin to look into absorption practice as it is explained in Buddhist literature until I was twenty years into my meditative practice. At the time, being ignorant of it, I couldn't have told you what the difference was between samadhi and jhana. All I knew was that from the descriptions I had read about them, they both sounded very similar. What I eventually learned through the experience of a mature practice is that there is a subtle difference which characterizes each of these two seemingly mysterious and foreign words. Though I came to the practice of meditative absorption not totally certain about what it was or whether I could ever achieve it, I did have a kind of explorer's curiosity and a "throw caution to the wind" attitude which helped to overcome any negative thoughts or doubts I might have somehow secretly harbored in the back of my mind. With nothing to lose but time, diving headlong into the practice seemed the only reasonable and practical thing to do if I wanted to learn anything about the practice of absorption. This is simply to say that if I can do it, then anyone can do it. I'm not all that much smarter than anyone else. The only skill anyone needs is to be able to recognize, differentiate, and identify subtle mental movement. To know it when you see it, and not to deny it or downplay it. It is that mental movement, sometimes subtle and sometimes gross, that needs to be seen and brought to our awareness. http://www.dharmaoverground.org/web/guest/discussion/-/message_boards/message/1286373 The Practical Aspects of Establishing Mindfulness — Part One What Is Mindfulness? "Of all the instruction passed on to us by Siddhattha Gotama recorded in the Pali suttas that is aimed at diminishing our sense of suffering and dissatisfaction with life, if there were one piece of advice he could give and emphasize as being the fundamental key in this process, there is no doubt in my mind that it would entail the advice to develop sati. As is recorded in the Samyutta Nikaya (SN 46.53; v 115) he said, "But sati (mindfulness), bhikkhus, I say, is always useful." And from the Anguttara Nikaya (AN 8.83): "All things can be mastered by mindfulness." All of which begs the question: what does it mean to be mindful? In what way, Gotama, do you mean: "Be mindful!" Having a clear understanding of the definition of this term is essential if one is to correctly apprehend the enormous gravity of what Gotama was pointing at. Where the history of sati's translation in the English language is concerned, it has been suggested by Thanissaro Bhikkhu, among others, that the British scholar who coined the term "mindfulness" to translate the word sati "was probably influenced by the Anglican prayer to be ever mindful of the needs of others — in other words, to always keep their needs in mind. But even though the word 'mindful' was probably drawn from a Christian context, the Buddha himself defined sati as the ability to remember, illustrating its function in meditation practice with the four satipatthanas, or establishings of mindfulness." In terms of "being mindful of the breath" during anapanasati meditation, sati can be defined using the very simple concept of "keeping the breath in mind" as one is meditating. Which simply means being aware of the present moment actuality of the breath on in-breathing and on out-breathing. Yet when we look at the etymological derivation of the Pali word "sati" we find, as Ven. Thanissaro has suggested, that sati is related to the verb sarati which means "to remember" or "to recall or recollect." And while sati does have this connotation with regard to memory, there is evidence in the suttas to suggest that it also has to do with "that which facilitates and enables memory." As Ven. Analayo has written, "What this definition of sati points to is that, if sati is present, memory will be able to function well. Understanding sati in this way facilitates relating it to the context of satipatthana, where it is not concerned with recalling past events, but functions as awareness of the present moment. In the context of satipatthana meditation, it is due to the presence of sati that one is able to remember what is otherwise only too easily forgotten: the present moment. "Sati as present moment awareness is similarly reflected in the presentation of the Patisambhidamagga and the Visuddhimagga, according to which the characteristic quality of sati is 'presence' (upatthana), whether as a faculty (indriya), as an awakening factor (bojjhanga), as a factor of the noble eightfold path, or at the moment of realization." Therefore if mindfulness is present (upatthitasati) it can be understood to imply presence of mind, in as far as the direct opposite of this is absent mindedness (mutthasati). Having a presence of mind implies that, endowed with sati, one is wide awake in regard to the present moment. Such presence of mind with regard to whatever one does or says will be clearly comprehended by the mind, and thereby more easily remembered later on. From this brief examination of the way in which the word sati is used in the discourses, it becomes apparent that the breadth of its application carries a gravity of meaning that is vital to our comprehension if we are to correctly interpret the use of this word translated as "mindfulness." From this presentation, then, it seems reasonable to assume that sati combines both "present moment awareness" as well as "recollection," as in, for example, recollecting what the Buddha has taught. Although based on this nuance of what is recollected this could refer to almost anything that is relevant to the present moment circumstance which adds to one's knowledge in being able to act in a skillful manner." The Practical Aspects of Establishing Mindfulness — Part Two Mindfulness and The Path of Calmness and Insight "In the early days of the spreading practice of the Buddhadhamma (i.e. during the period of time in which the Buddha lived and taught), often referred to as "early Buddhism," Siddhattha Gotama taught a two-pronged approach to the practice of meditation which, in its essence, can be summarized as: "Calm the mind and develop clear seeing." These two aspects of meditation contemplation are known as samatha (meaning "calm" or "tranquility") and vipassana (literally "clear seeing," but more often translated as "insight"). This system of teaching samatha and vipassana — the "and" here indicating that they were to be taught together as one simultaneous method of meditation training — worked very well throughout the Buddha's lifetime, producing countless ariyas (noble ones or followers of the Buddha's Dhamma) and arahats ("awakened ones" or "one who has awakened"), as Gotama wandered back and forth across the plains of northern India stopping here and there to deliver his discourses on the Dhamma." Another fellow, who I think has a very helpful blog called Methods of Awakening; which deals with shamatha-vipasyana. http://methodsofawakening.blogspot.co.uk/ "Attentiveness is a commonly used word and is something that forms the bare bones of our practice, regardless of which model we use. I intend to break the word down and provide a practical description of what attentiveness “is”, and how to improve practice through really understanding what it means to be attentive. This is just my take on it based on what works, and is working, for me; this may change as new information becomes available. ....The word “mindful” is an adjective meaning “attentive, aware, or careful (usually followed by of)” [4] or “conscious or aware of something “[5][6]. We’ve already looked at “attentive” and found that it’s synonymous with words like “mindful”, “heedful”, “aware” and “alert”, all of which represent the same process: To be attentive of something; to be paying attention; to be aware. It does not require any further analysis to demonstrate that mindfulness and attentiveness are simply labels for the same, naturally occurring ability to pay attention.... ...Attentiveness is just a matter of noticing what’s happening right now, you’re not looking for anything or trying to do anything, you’re just noticing what’s already happening at this moment. It’s an active engagement in your immediate experience, an alertness, a preparedness to openly accept whatever arises without judgement. This attentiveness includes what’s going on” internally” - by which I mean: the general feelings observed, emotional states, thoughts that present themselves, particular narratives the mind reels off; mental phenomena in general - as well as what’s going on “externally” - by which I mean: physical sensations via the five sense doors: touch, sight, sound, taste, and smell. Attentiveness only ever happens right now, not in the future and not in the past, now. Not then. Only now. To be attentive or mindful is to be actively present; to be cognizant of what is happening at this moment in time...." I hope these links are helpful for you.

Seeing as how you're using parlance attributed to Buddhism, I'm assuming you want to know where the role of sati (or "mindfulness") plays when cultivating jhana and insight (vipassana)...Unless you're just using the term in the general way that the "Mcmindfulness" crowd uses it: Then disregard this post. First, you have to determine what it is you're trying to accomplish in any one particular sitting period (as there are several ways to go about this.) To go about this, you to have to understand the role of concentration when doing insight practice and vice versa. Now to understand it in the context of Buddhism, what does this mean? What is it you are trying to be mindful of? How is one to engage in being mindful??? This is determined by what you're focusing on in each session or what your needs are in that session. Specifically regarding vipassana, the real purpose is to directly cognize the 3 characteristics (anatta, anicca, dukkha...You should look this up,) by being mindful of each passing phenomenal moment. For instance, In the post-meditative period, it will be this present moment of sights, sounds, tastes, smells, touch/sensations, and thoughts. Anyways, I think it will be immensely more benificial for you to take a look at or even ask questions on a forum called www.dharmaoverground.org. That site is filled with both noobs and OG's alike (with everything in between.) You will find plenty of threads by both the (very) experienced and novice alike that will assist in all your inquiries. Also look into "Mastering the Core Teachings of the Buddha: An Unusually Hardcore Dharma Book" by Daniel Ingram. This is a good manual to get started with (it's available online for free.) Another helpful site to look into is called "measurelessmind" http://measurelessmind.ca/. It's a great resource for understanding the Buddhas teachings all nicely formatted in an easy to navigate website (no having to dig around on accesstoinsight.org for specific suttas.)

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What it actually means is that our conditioned responses to the objective world; volition/impulses predicated upon our samskaras, stemming from self-grasping, which gives rise to the three root poisons of craving, aggression, delusion: Can be changed and new seeds planted that lead to the extinction of afflictive modes, stemming from these three root affictive patterns. The notion of 'free will ' only applies from a theistic outlook. From the POV of dependent origination: It's a moot point, since phenomena arise and dissolve according to causes and conditions.

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To expand on what was said: Emptiness of the 5 skandhas does not negate the 5 skandhas. There is no seperate 'actor' from the action and none of these experiences can be grasped as I, me or mine. This implies that there isn't a seperate self/Self within or apart from the 5 skandhas. These being mistaken imputations on the experiences of the 5 skandhas. A gatha from Ch'an master Tung-shan after seeing his reflection when crossing a stream: Do not seek from others They are far removed from me Today I go on alone Everywhere I meet him Today he is me Today I am not him We must understand this way Only then do we accord with Thusness (Pg. 256 "Working Toward Enlightenment by Nan Huai Chin)

I suggest you google the Vijnana Bhairava Tantra. It's a text from Kashmir Shaivism that lists 112 different types of meditations for practioners of varying proclivities.