Daeluin

Depends on your perspective. Is it landing flat? Then one side is facing ☰, one side is facing ☷. The heads and tails analogy is similar to a front and back perspective. Is front yang or yin? Is back yang or yin? The back is considered more yang in terms of the governing vessel and the cutanious regions. But others have found plenty of conviction for the reverse interpretation. I've heard if you hang upside-down in a closet for a couple days, you will recalibrate what up and down mean, and your vision will flip. And then if you stop hanging upside-down you can walk around looking up at the ground and down at the sky until it recalibrates again. Is the head lifted up to the sky or buried in the sand? I dunno how to answer this question in its absolute terms, but if there's a specific reason you need to differentiate the yin and yang on a coin, a focused perspective might yield a more clear interpretation.

by getting to know where you are and how you change accept where you are and where you have been trace it all back to your origin and settle into resonance with your personal choice driven realationship within balance where lies balance? where does imbalance end? return, accept, surrender listen to the flow discern where the heart leads without judgment discern how the ego attempts to attach and direct what is the point of conflict, if not to transform what does not serve? what is the point of unease, if not to guide towards integrity? what is the point of flow, if not to nourish one's natural way? listen to the heart and purify the heart within the whole when clarity comes to what seemed obscure clouds part and hidden subtleties emerge follow clarity to deepest surrender clearest heart where subtlety becomes divine and taste the original source Explore. Experiment. Feel. Accept. Surrender. Trust. Return. We were born with what energy was needed to accomplish our destiny. But these days humanity is uncertain where balance lies. Eager to overcome the demands of our physical needs, We have come to dominate, control, assume, take advantage. Eager to rise above the rest, we place ourselves above, before, beyond other life. Eager to cultivate a little space of our own, We push other life forms far away, convinced of our superiority. 'Tis only natural. And so we come to reject the family to which we were born. An entire planet of harmony - clearly it is up for grabs. And so we take, and build, and craft anew models ego grand. Only to find we've drifted...... all is all, all is everyones', yet why do we exploit it so? Drifted, calculated, manipulated what was offered freely into what only humans own. But you know. Don't you? The primal truth of harmony? The true way of balance? It cannot be destroyed. It exists within us all. The return to resting upon trust. Falsehoods may crumble away leaving one naked and afraid. What greater truth than standing full and humble in the face of tao. One's center is shared by all and cannot be assailed by those who trust to their way. First get to know yourself, and explore your past. Discern patterns that like to repeat and learn to be cautious of feeling that you know anything. Come to understand that your perspective is one of many, and that by surrendering your perspective to settle among all perspectives, you may adapt and ease into harmony with any situation you find yourself, so long as you are not attached to your own agenda. Come to feel truth as truth. One's intuition may be honed and trusted until one knows how to feel their environment as what is right for them, and knows how to listen to the balance within their environment to discover the direction towards deeper balance and equanimity. And so one may come to skill in harmonious relation with the outside world, even as one comes to discern patterns reflected from the outside world as messages towards uncovering imbalance within one's inner world. One's inner world may be cultivated by methods and prescriptions, but the lesson remains one of balance. Should one follow ego to a teacher one may find exactly what the ego sought. Following the heart one learns to listen and accept calls for change, and ends up discovering a teacher who resonates from the subtle heart of hearts. Energy is merely friction within polarity, where parts of the whole come to rest upon one another, rubbing, tickling, pushing, pulling, integrating, harmonizing, dancing, exchanging, creating an inner world of gears, cogs, wheels, a whole system of moving parts manifested so one may unfold into animated life within one's specific environment. Energy flows and transforms between systems following nature's pattern. One may manipulate this flow by means of focusing of intention, and energy will follow where intent has been set. Thereby one's intent may lead energy towards one's own agenda, OR merely set the intend and focus inward so as to trust the energy to lead itself greater harmony. A master is one who cultivates their inner heart and offers it to the source of life. This can only be done on one's own, and yet one may need a guiding hand. One's teacher may guide and point at the way, but one must walk their own path to realize it. Follow the heart. Do the work with trust and compassion. Dissolve the ego. Learn to listen to the call of your own tao. Follow the flow of the tao through time as its path unravels the imbalance within your soul, and be free.

who I don't want to be my teacher the part that thinks it knows a thing the part that thinks it might find something sought but knowing needs no thinking finding needs no seeking only being true

Internal Alchemy takes many terms and principles from External Alchemy - Chemistry. What can we learn from combining western scientific principles of the interactions of atoms and molecules with taoist principles of wuji, yin, yang, taojitu, the four forces, five phases, bagua, etc? Are there correlations between the number of protons and neutrons to a particular element's polarity of yin or yang? Can we have heavy yang and light yin? How do the orbital rings factor in? What role to neutrons play? Is there correlation between the mysterious pre-heaven and post-heaven arrangements of the bagua with the way elements alchemize with each other? Finally, do answers to questions like these leak secrets of the heavenly mechanism? Would an accomplished taoist chemist be dangerous, and does this information need to be protected? Or do such fears originate from a government's desire to maintain stability by avoiding powerful unpredictable elements? (This is really deserving of its own topic, but maybe short comments on the subject would be fitting here until we open that door further.)

When CD says "kung fu" here, I receive it as "hard martial arts," i.e. the traditional western perception of "kung fu," and not the "great skill accomplished through hard work" that is the root of the term and which may be applied to anything one develops great skill in, including gardening or cloud watching. But the western concept of "kung fu" serves what CD is speaking to, I believe. Hard martial arts are just that, hard. If they are not focused internally, there is a lack of balance. If they are focused internally, there must be balance between cultivation and issuing. I've been taught it takes years of cultivating softness before true inner power emerges, and then things change. So if one is attempting to issue and expend more than one cultivates, where is one really going? It might be important to understand this balance when evaluating martial arts schools... depending on one's goals. CD - I sense the heart of what you are communicating (or hope I do, somewhat at least), and think it is just not coming through as clearly as you intend. Please keep trying, and keep working on refining. I like your contributions and have a lot of respect for the inner work you do. I'd recommend to not suppress, but to transform any emotions into fire to contribute to your inner work.

All right, I think I'd need to become a chemist to answer my own question. Easy to speculate, but difficult to propose any theories without understanding the root of nuclear physics. Part of me was wondering if there is a correlation between Carbon, atomic number 6, and Oxygen, atomic number 8, with the taoist notions of the 6 directions of energy and the 8 trigrams of the bagua. I imagine it is much deeper than this, but too, Carbon and Oxygen are some pretty important elements in how they nurture life as we know it.

Perhaps at first one might want to rely on thought to develop a deeper connection to their center. But the point is that by following their center, no thinking is necessary. And to tie this back into the topic, the more one is connected to their center, the less they will need to rely on judgements of the mind to discern where they belong or who the right teacher might be. The more one develops trust for their own natural and beautiful way, the more the way will become synchronized with their surroundings, naturally drawn to timely resonances.

When things make no sense at all it is a great opportunity to let the mind rest in what it does not know. If we think we know something, we've already polarized from what we do not know, making a choice to hold this and discard that, even though both are part of us. Sometimes quickest way to the freedom of wholeness is to let go of all attachments. But then if one does not attach to their central gravity, one might be blown off track. Sincerely following one's inner heart, one is not pulled off track.

I created a new topic for this question over here: http://thetaobums.com/topic/37339-taoist-principles-and-chemistry/ Thanks to everyone for their answers!

What about chemistry? How do we know what elements are yin or yang?

Liu Yiming, Awakening to the Tao, (Cleary):

Much recorded in the texts was recorded by those who had been there. I've marked where my own conclusions begin. Decide for yourself where I am. I'm not pretending to be anywhere. Not to say we aren't there right now as well. All is tao. Exactly! Balance is between polarity. The point of balance is between what is being balanced. If we harmonize yang and yin, we are left with the source of that yang and yin. How can Yang exist without Yin? There is no first, they are simultaneous. If one came first, then at first it isn't a duality. How would that make sense? Science likes its theories, but remember, knowledge is infinite, but our lives have limits. There are many who discover spiritual truths which science might say are impossible. But science also thought the world was flat not so far back. Those who take responsibility for uncovering their own truths will discover much that is not taught.

I apologize but this question isn't making sense to me. We can find many truths in the world. We happen to speaking about some pretty deep stuff. It aint gonna fall in your lap, and it isn't black and white. Most are content to call it BS and move on. What I've found is that most modern people do like the OP has - take what suits them and wrap it into a system. It isn't difficult to come up with something that works well enough to be useful. But the classics... studying the classics is a way to go deep. No, they won't explain things for you. That's what the world is for. If you want to become a wizard or immortal, study the classics. See Zhuangzi chapter 2. I recommend worrying about what is right for you, not what is right or wrong for everybody. Thing about polarity is, it is defined by its duality. How can I be really really really happy without having ever been really really sad? There's no way to quantify it without it's counterpart. A person who is born rich can be completely unhappy with all that money can buy, but then they find emptiness and become fulfilled. A person who has nothing may be completely happy an fulfilled until suddenly they inherit a business and become wealthy but stressed out and ill. Peace is yin - still, empty, accepting. Violence is yang - strong, aggressive. You're still posting in a Taoist Discussion thread about how the taoist classics are incorrect, under the title of TaoMaster. You said your way would make me happier, but I feel saddened by your lack of respect. I was invited to answer a question about something you haven't studied, by you specifically, and so I did, only to be dismissed yet again. You're welcome! So much for: "The happiness I offer you will add to your happiness." In the I Ching, hexagam 15 is known as humility, or egolessness. It represents a mountain - something strong and firm, very yang - that is buried under the earth, so no one knows it is there. In China (and elsewhere) humility is a most noble characteristic. One who is humble cannot be humiliated - but one who is proud can be humiliated, and often will encounter all manner of obstacles to maintain their pride. Sad that one might chose their pride instead of a friend. Hexagram 28 is known as "excess of the great," as often those who are too yang spend their energy wastefully, not understanding how to be humble and so preserve it.

1 Yang + 1 Yin = Tao Tao is the root where Yang and Yin originated, and some chose to follow the way back to this root. We are already operating from within a body, so this is the foundation of our return. We could imagine the big bang as infinite Yang unfolding in the center of a field of infinite Yin. So if the body is turned to Yang, one might use the space outside as Yin and thus make the return. So there might be focus on Yang, but it is not because Yang is better than Yin, but because this is one recipe to return Yin and Yang to Tao. Further, even should one nurture one's Yang, first one must harmonize many polarities of Yin and yang within the body. Often this requires "choosing yin" in order to preserve yang. If one chooses Yang, one often chooses action, which spends and depletes Yang. Even though Yang might appear to be emphasized in one sense, balance is the goal. I think you're doing great with the diagrams!

In my opinion, when the body dies, the heavy and the light separate, and one is called into a new body when circumstances align with the old patterns that were left behind. So in this sense, when one's body dies, one's ego is preserved. But without the human mind and it's memory of choices made, patterns formed. The ego attaches to itself because it thinks it is the whole. But it has been separated from its whole. Perhaps reminding the ego it is incomplete will lead to its voluntary dissolution and (hopefully) re-unification with what is missing. But ego is actually nothing but a web of attachments and expectations, a means to an end that works little different from an artificial intelligence. The laws of cause and effect it attaches to as one judges which ways are best, are, in the beginning, novel and refreshing, but in the end are inescapable ruts. Perhaps the ego seeks to destroy itself when its attachments no longer result in benefit, but all lead to pain. But in this case it probably wants to destroy not just its self, but its host too (since it believes it IS the host). But really killing the host will just yield more of the same next time around. To improve things the ego needs to let go, loosen up and start thinking in terms of how it may be of service to others instead of its "self."

Thanks Peter , perhaps Daeluin can chime in here . Shes pretty well versed in that subject . Hopefully in her own words rather than a cut and paste . ? Sure, I'll do what I can. As TaoMaster says, Yang and Yin come before a lot of other stuff: And therefore studying Yang and Yin should be as simple as it gets, right? And yet... we live in a world that expresses Yang and Yin in infinite ways, thermodynamics are extremely complicated and then the study of light, mass, atoms, molecules, and the way they all interact together... all of these things contain Yang and Yin, but have built upon yang and yin over myriad transformations. Every time Yang and Yin form a new paradigm, like energy and space, then those Yangs and Yins divide into their own Yangs and Yins and form a paradigm within a paradigm - a new layer of reality/illusion. TaoMaster asked me: And I answered not only with a reference book, The Book of Changes and the Unchanging Truth, but with explanation in my own words. But TaoMaster quickly decided this was too complex.... I never replied to this, as I was told I said enough, but I keep being invited to say more. See... the thing is, TaoMaster is asking questions about the root of reality, but insists that it is simple. Certainly Yang and Yin are simple. They are also subtle and paradoxical. Each contain the other, and each relates to the other differently depending on the surrounding layers and paradigms that provide a home and context for this Yang and Yin. These layers upon layers are like twists and turns in a maze, serving to hide the Original Yang and Yin from us. Our minds cannot fathom it, as they only operate within one of these layers and become quite confused when attempting to ply their logic to the paradoxical. Hence the reason for studying the foundational material our ancestors left for us. Because it IS simple, and one can use studying to unravel the complexity, if one's intention is firm. So we say we have something.... that implies a distinction between something and something else. Bingo, Yang and Yin. Applies to any context, any naming, any creation, any thought or idea - this is a new division of Yang and Yin from some source. And then this Yang and Yin begin to interact. Perhaps Yang shoots off like an arrow to merge with the Yin in some other dynamic, like a feeling expressed verbally to another. Or, perhaps Yang remains close to it's source and matching Yin, as an emotion being explored internally. Either way we have Yang and Yin in motion, embracing each other and inviting change. The ancients saw how to explore this change through more complex groupings of Yang and Yin, in order to better match the reality of the current context. So our original Yang and Yin are combining into groupings of mixed Yang and Yin. In the simplest combinations we have 50% + 50% in different orders of Yang and Yin. But again we can't leave out our law of duality. The law of duality is where the paradox comes, right from the beginning. If we name somthing, we call in its opposite. Nothing can exist as separate from other things without maintaining duality. So our original something and nothing, Yang and Yin, revolve around the center of their duality. We might even call this center Tao. It eludes comprehension. And even as Yang and Yin further polarize from 2 to 4, the change between them remains. The change between the 2 is the 3rd. The change between the 4 is the 5th. Perhaps one could perceive this as the Yang center of any Yin dynamic. Because of this paradoxical centering principle, nothing can ever fully be removed from connection to the source, and so the direction of creation is ever one of polarization and recentering. Our 4 fources of 50% Yang, 50% Yin, also get drawn back to their center even as they expand out. And we can't forget that we are opperating under two polarities that are a part of the greater polarity, so we actually have three centers. Thus the 4 forces unfold cyclically, always bound to their original center, like spokes are bound to a hub, even as their 2 more recent polarities also create new centers, which even more complex mixings of Yang and Yin will be drawn to revolve around. There we have our six, and it's all explained in the Tai Ji symbol: Lesser Yang flowing into Greater Yang Lesser Yin flowing into Greater Yin The two above dynamics revolve around the center of the circle. But as Greater Yang culminates and surrenders to the birth of Lesser Yin, this operation is no longer between the original Yang and original Yin, but instead it is between Greater Yin and Lesser Yang only! And at the heart of this polarity we find Bright Yang created in the midst of Greater Yin. This Bright Yang and its counterpart, Terminal Yin, might be seen as the Up and Down in the 6 directions of energy. Yet at this simple beginning, without context from any pre-existing layers or paradigms of Yin and Yang, we might call them Inside and Outside. This is only using the very simply principles of polarization and centering, and the "math" our ancestors left to help understand this, via the I Ching and Taoist Cosmology have been studied for thousands of years. This math will not add up logically if one is only tapping into the conscious mind. The subconscious mind and intuition are also part of our whole and need to be reunified. The actual fabric of reality will remain mentally confusing until one reunifies with it, which is done by returning to the center. Therefore, if one wants to study this particular and ancient perspective more in depth, I strongly advise one to feel enough of a resonance with this material to justify spending a lot of time studying it in depth and reaching one's own conclusions. Some of my conclusions have been: The four forces and their Center, comprise the dynamic of the Five Phases, (Five Elements), and this describes the flow of principles that are more "spiritual". There is no separation between self and other, and transformation is welcomed without struggle or attachment. The four forces and their two polarities comprise the six directions of energy, the 6 types of Qi. I believe this dynamic contains the separation between self and other. See, at first we have the 4 forces and their common center... but as the dynamic evolves and diversifies, more of that Bright Yang and Terminal Yin begin to polarize with each other and become more of an inside and outside polarity, forming their UP and DOWN-ness, and this in turn crystallizes the entire structure, forming In-Out, Left-Right, Front-Back, all revolving around a common center. Here we see the principle by which things twist and make the way back difficult to discern. Work must be done to re-unify the two dots, following the principle of the 5 phases, dissolving one of self-other and returning to the original Yang-Yin polarity. So it is the principle of these two dots that people like ignoring that ends up creating an inside and outside, which in my mind is the separation of self and other and the manifestation of the fabric of our material reality. At first the 2 dots were independent of each other, but as they come to rely upon each other their identity transforms. At the level of a human being, that human has a inside, outside, and directions of orientation, but the directions of Up and Down are related to the In-Out of the Earth, even as the Up-Down of the Earth are related to the In-Out of the Sun, and so on. Also, we maybe operating in a six-qi context, but we are still comprised too of the more harmoneous 5-phase system. One might look at it as though our spirit (5) has joined the body (6) and this is what results in animated physical life as we know it. Once the original energy is exhausted, the life form can no longer remain animated and it's lightness separates from it's heaviness. So Taoists attempt to re-unify the 2 dots (my house and the other house), and work towards flowing with the principle of the 5 to harmonize the 4, to return to the 3 to the 2, and the 2 to the 1. So the 6 directions are pretty fascinating. To continue answering the question, we evolve to the Bagua. Probably time to post this diagram: The "Ba Gua", or, "Eight Trigrams", are 3 lines of Yang and Yin. The middle line is sorta like the dots in the Tai Ji symbol. So the "Eight Trigrams" help to describe how the four fources are guided inward or outward in different ways. But those dots gravitate to an internal-external dynamic. So the hexagrams of the I Ching are comprised of a lower Trigram and it's center "dot", which is under the upper Trigram and it's center "dot." Within the context of the six directions of energy, the I Ching Hexagrams explore how these two dots are interacting within the greater flow of Yang and Yin. Sure it is a lot to take in. Simple when compared with equations though. If this way of thinking tickles you, go study and come to your own conclusions! If this baffles and confuses you, then follow your heart to what is clear!

Ni Hua Ching, The Uncharted Voyage Toward the Subtle Light

Sorry - I feel my comment sums up what Zhuangzi is speaking to in this section, but it came out all wuwei. I feel Zhuangzi showed us different applications of wuwei for different people, as well as showing how doing could be put to use in different ratios with nondoing to achieve different results in different situations. And if we take it further, perhaps it also unveils the doing to non-doing ratio as a means for identifying the point of balance in one's interference.

It begins with doing and hardly can one see a thing, when it comes to non-doing, all begin to understand. But if you only see non-doing as the essential marvel, how can you know that doing is the foundation? Awakening to Reality Wuwei is a method, a choice. Choices make change, choices are part of the doing that is the foundation of non-doing. Being a cook was the Cook's doing and he used non-doing to nurture this purpose. Ruling was the king's doing and he saw how non-doing might help nurture the life of his kingdom. Selfish interference is humanity's doing and could use non-doing to settle into harmonious relationship with other life-forms. Living is a taoist's doing, and a taoist uses non-doing to return from duality. But still choices, still change.

Wang Mu's Foundations of Internal Alchemy answers many of these questions.

Zhu Yuanyu: Yin and Yang always attend upon one another. Their coming and going is called "transmutation." The inchoate Spirit is at their center, silent and unmoving.

I like your thought process here, though I see you still attach to right from wrong and I'm not sure why.... I can choose to walk down completely random roads and still somehow find my way to where I need to be, somehow. The six directions of energy are pretty cool!

http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2003-01-31/entertainment/0301310448_1 This month and its opposite, Ox, are both yin earth, so when I think about it, the domesticated animal seems to fit better... but I'm not Chinese. I find it interesting what ChiDragon says, which is supported by this article.

Also... the stems and branches appear to be used to help understand Neidan, so studying the phases of life may be helpful in this regard. Quoting Pregadio's translation of Wang Mu's Foundations of Internal Alchemy: Li ☲ is composed of the false yang surrounding the true yin. So here we can see that the true yin alludes to the Ji Soil. And we can see that the Horse month has 3 active hidden heavenly stems - Yang Fire and Yin Fire surrounding Ji, Yin Earth. If one examines trends and patterns over the past year, perhaps one might come to some interesting conclusions on where this Ji-Soil might be found and what happens when it is refined.

Indeed! Though I was referring to the cycle as it repeats every day, solar year, and lunar month, the cycle of the soverign hexagrams flowing like the taiji symbol. This year I've taken a deeper journey into chinese astrology and the 10 celestial stems and 12 earthly branches. The 10 heavenly stems are pure energies: the 5 phases of wood, fire, earth, metal, water, which divide into pairs of yin and yang. The 12 earthly branches are a little more complicated. The earth is receptive and passive, just like hexagram 2, so the earth receives and stores the heavenly energies and allows them to combine. Each of the 12 earthly branches is like a box that has stored ALL 10 celestial stems, but these boxes are passive. Depending on the phase of the cycle, certain energies are activated within these boxes, and this is where they derive their personalities, which are given animal names instead of being described by their multiple active 5-phase components. These active components are called "hidden heavenly stems". For example, the month known as Dragon is a box containing three active hidden heavenly stems. First dragon is during the period of Spring, and comes after the two mainly Wood phase months, so as we enter the month of Dragon there is a little yin-wood-phase energy left over. Second, Dragon serves as a storage vault for water - the lifecycle of water is born in early autumn, prosperous in winter, and is stored away in Dragon. Finally, and primarily, Dragon is yang Earth (the Wu in WuJi), and helps to orient and transition the wood of spring into the fire of summer. Sorta like collecting firewood and putting it in a firepit so that when the flames come the wood is burning the way we want it to. Dragon is a very entrepreneurial combination of energies. Further, for Dragon these are the energies activated by the cyclical phase position of earthly energies. However, this 1 earthly branch will also be paired with 1 heavenly stem. This heavenly stem is the more active force, and depending on how it further arouses and combines with the earthly energies, we have one of 60 pairs of stems and branches - like our current wood horse year. Horse is the central phase of summer, noon, the full moon. Externally yang, internally yin, it is composed of the hidden heavenly stems Yang Fire, Yin Earth, and Yin Fire. Naturally these energies are hot and dry, but when aroused by the heavenly stem Yang Wood, that wood feeds the fire and it burns even hotter. There is a old system that was used to combine these 60 stem-branch pairs into a resulting 5-phase called NaYin. The Wood Horse would combine to the Metal phase, and is said to be like metal that is smelted 100 times. This year I've seen many people tackling such grand projects which consumed 100% of their energies and left their normal yearly endeavors dormant, as they've attempted to shape and refine these grand projects. The coming Yin Wood Sheep year is the matching NaYin Metal pair, known as the leftover charcoal from the great fire. Like Dragon, Sheep is a primarily Earth phase, but Yin Earth (the Ji in WuJi). It contains the leftover Yin Fire of summer, and stores the wood of spring. The flames may be dying here, but the coals are still HOT, and the Yin Wood heavenly stem helps them stay hot for a long while. This is a Yin year following upon a Yang year, so I anticipate many of the projects began this past year will now begin to integrate into a more completed state, come to find their proper places on earth and settle down a bit. This is also a maturation phase in our yearly cycles as what was initiated in previous years and forged into shape this past year, will now be set into place and begin to mature, as a fruit ripens after being formed. So more to the point of the quote.... the forging energies of the Wood Horse year have waned and those projects have perhaps slowed, and now as the yang energy returns those projects will now begin to settle into place and more and more we'll see how they are manifesting out in the real world as the year unfolds. At least this is how I am perceiving things.... it's always exciting to see what interpretations others come to!