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Our new paper, Interpreting the Ancient Codes: Exploring the Classics of Taoist Alchemy contains an exclusive interview with Fabrizio Pregadio. In it, he discusses his interest in the Taoist texts of Nei Dan as well as his new translation of the Zhou Yi Can Tong Qi. The paper is available as a free download from TCCII. For those who don't want to download it, here is a selection of questions and answers taken from our blog: Q: How did you become interested in Taoism and Taoist alchemy? A: I was, and I still am, delighted by how Taoism represents the relation between the absolute principle (the Dao) and its manifestation in the world in which we live, and by how clearly it formulates several ways to realize the "return to the Dao." The essential features of these teachings are found in the Dao De Jing and are elaborated on (with some differences in emphasis) in the Zhuang Zi. Taoist Internal Alchemy (Nei Dan) is the main tradition that applies those teachings to the human being and offers a way to comprehend and realize them at the individual level. Q: What benefit can internal alchemy practitioners derive from studying the classic texts? A: What you call "classical texts" are signposts in the history of a tradition. By studying those texts, one can study the history of a tradition and how it has been transmitted and adapted to different circumstances. Texts, moreover, are often the only sources we have to reconstruct the history of a tradition, and this is especially important with regard to Nei Dan. We often think of Nei Dan as a "school" of Taoism, but this is by no means correct. Nei Dan is best described as a tradition with Taoism, with its own branches, schools (or rather, lineages), and individual representatives. There are often major differences among the different Nei Dan lineages. Studying texts is virtually the only way to identify those differences. There's one more important thing. I can hardly imagine a Chinese — or Indian, Japanese, Tibetan, Persian, etc. — adept of a tradition who does not know, study, and often memorize the main texts of his or her tradition. Knowledge of the written records of a tradition should also be important for a Western follower. Without that knowledge, a Western follower could easily end up twisting and distorting the tradition that he or she claims to belong to, according to his or her own particular perspective. Any Eastern tradition teaches exactly the opposite attitude: until one reaches a truly advanced stage, one should follow the tradition "as is," with no attempt to reinterpret it or adapt it to any contingent circumstance. The re-adaptation (or rather, re-codification) of a teaching to different historical or social circumstances is a very important and interesting phenomenon in the history of any traditional teaching. Q: Who is the intended audience of your translation of the Can Tong Qi? A: The intended audience is, generally, everyone who is interested for any reason in the doctrines of the Way of the Golden Elixir, as they are presented by the main textual source of this tradition. Q: You mention in your translation of the Can Tong Qi that you began your work on it back in 1990. Why is this text so interesting to you? A: Why is the Can Tong Qi so interesting to me? Well, first of all because, in 1990, after I finished my dissertation on Wai Dan, I told myself, "I'd like to work on the main text in Taoist alchemy" and less than one second later I thought, "This means I should translate the Can Tong Qi." Second, because this text is crucial to understand Taoist alchemy in virtually all of its aspects. One important point here is that the Can Tong Qi talks almost exclusively of doctrine, but we (in the 21st century) should not think that the "doctrine" of a traditional teaching is equivalent to a "theory" in the modern sense of the term. A theory is something that requires proof, and is subject to change in the course of time. A doctrine is something from which a whole tradition develops, and from which the practices are devised. The concepts of "theory" and "proof" are entirely alien to traditional thought; you have, instead, a doctrine that requires personal comprehension and verification. This is why the Can Tong Qi is so important: it has provided the basic doctrine for virtually the entirely history of Chinese alchemy, in all of its forms, with the only exception of the Wai Dan texts written before it was composed, and of some later Wai Dan texts that are not related to it. Download the full interview now.

They are attributed to various Nei Dan luminaries such as the patriarchs of the Bei Pai and others. This is obviously problematic from a historical standpoint. Issues related to dating are best addressed by those with specialized training in the area of textual analysis. Understanding the historical and textual tradition of a classic is one reason the work of scholars in this area is important. It would be great to see a new, critical translation of this classic by someone like Fabrizio Pregadio or one of his peers in the Taoist Studies field. For those who are interested, Pregadio comments on the important of both scholarly and practitioner based approaches to understanding these traditions in an interview we did with him. Here is an earlier post on this forum with excerpts and comments: http://thetaobums.co...rizio +pregadio

They both have 13 chapters. The first link has a series of prefaces. IIRC the Wilhelm translation was not done form a "truncated" text. I believe he states somewhere in his book that he dropped the last few chapters since he thought them redundant.

http://www.jnk.org.tw/wn01-3-02.htm http://www.360doc.com/content/10/0220/19/396690_16269439.shtml

The first stage in the above quoted 4 stage model is usually called "Building the Foundation" The last stage in this model is usually divided into two stages: "Refine Shen to Void" and "Shatter Void to Return to Dao." The last two stages are identified separately in the original post in this thread, but that post omits the first stage. The confusion arises because there are several different stage models (3, 4, 5, or instantaneous) used by different teachers. In effect all of them can be correct. However, we find most Western people appreciate a bit more detail. Such as this five stage model Xian Gong 1) Build the Foundation 2) Transmute Jing to Qi 3) Transmute Qi to Shen Dao Gong 4) Refine Shen to Void 5) Shatter the Void to Realize the Tao Likewise the times given are also estimates. It is hard to comment on them directly as it depends on the system being used and the individual student's starting condition and practice discipline. Usually you see the first stage, "Building the Foundation" described as lasting from 100 days to 2 years, depending on the condition of the individual when they start. This can vary by school, so it is normal to see differences in the listed times. All of these descriptions are merely heuristics, that is, models to help intellectually understand the process. At the end of the day all that matters is personal progress in cultivation.

This paper was originally written for our students. We thought it might benefit the Taijiquan, Qigong, Kung Fu and Nei Dan community so we are sharing it as a free PDF download. The Science of Qi Healing A Survey of the Research and Benefits of Tai Chi and Qigong Practices by Ted Nawalinski, Sc.D. Available as a PDF, free download

Hi Joeblast, Thank you for taking the time to provide your feedback. We understand your concerns. Here are a few points to clarify: We are offering this paper for free as part of our organization's service to the community. We prefer people not download it if they are not interested in the subject. We use a professional email service (Emma) to handle the distribution. You may unsubscribe at any time. The unsubscribe link is in the same email with the file download link. Best regards, TCCII

The story is not really ant-Taoist, but if you read the entire 100 chapter narrative it is easy to see how you could interpret it as ant-Taoist. Many of the villains are disguised as Quanzhen Taoist priests. The story is considered an allegory of the Nei Dan cultivation process. It is believed to be loosely based on the Qi Chu Ji's journey to the West to meet Genghis Khan. The semi-Buddhist theme in the work is more a reflection of the popularity of Buddhism at the time it was written. At the end of the story Monkey gained full enlightenment which makes him equivalent of Buddha and Lao Zi, so if you like the concept, then go with it. Unless you aspire to be an orthodox Daoist priest (who might favor Xuan Wu or the Three Primordial Ones, as pointed out earlier) then don't worry about it. What you put on your walls is a personal preference. At the end of the day, it is your own practice and attainment that matters.

That is an interesting question but your criteria make it nearly impossible for someone to answer. The way you ask it is close enough to a Taoist riddle that I'll take a shot. Essentially I read that you are asking how to begin your practice using only a textual lineage. You want to know what to do in order to start except that you don't want to "use physical methods or techniques." I assume you mean you don't want a form or something similar. It is important to remember that just sitting on a cushion and doing nothing is still doing something. That is, your a*s is still PHYSICALLY sitting (a technique) on something and you are DOING nothing (a method). That said, try it anyway: Just sit. Empty your heart (Xin, Heart-Mind). If you can do that, you are on on your way to practicing Dao Gong. If this practice comes easy to you, that is fantastic, you are one of the very few people who can start there. If it is difficult, then you might need another beginning practice. Good luck!

Ya Mu, Very interesting. You one of the first westerners I have come across of who knows this. One of my Nei Dan teachers, who also claims to have had the privilege of actually studying the book, mentioned the same thing.

Taomeow, you are unbelievably patient. There is something to be learned from that.

Effilang, As you probably already know, it is much easier and safer to learn internal alchemy from a teacher. However, if you are using the TY book, you'll need to very carefully study it. If I recall correctly, Mr. Lu translated the two fires you mention as fast and slow. He has a glossary and a pretty good index, so that should help. Good luck!

Friend, Your questions are fine. It is the random comments made by a few which makes those who actually might have lineage training in these areas reluctant to answer on a public forum. Since you seem sincere, I'll make a brief reply. In our Xuan Kong lineage (and there are different schools of Xuan Kong) the birth year of the person is less important than the reading on the house. 1) If the birth year of the house is wrong your reading may be wrong, depending on how far off you are. That is because the birth year determines the period of the house. These periods have 20 year bands and the exact year is most important near the change in periods. 2) If you don't know the period of the house exactly, but have a general idea, then you may be able to determine it by analysis. The methods require a bit of detective work and "reverse engineering." A certain amount of judgement and intuition is required. 3) The birth year is the birth year (just like your birth date), but the period of the house can be changed, at least in our lineage there are methods to do this. It often involves significant renovations and construction. It is usually easier to have the person move. At least where an ordinary house is concerned.

Terminology varies between schools, but Pure Yang, in the sense of Pure Yang Qi, is used to distinguish Pre-Heaven Qi from ordinary Post -Heaven Yang Qi. In other words, Pure Yang is often synonymous with Primoridal Qi, Original Qi, or Pre-Heaven Qi. Since Pre-heaven Qi exists prior to differentiation between Yin and Yang, "Pure Yang Qi" is not Yang except in the sense that it is contrasted with Post-Heaven Qi. Or, as one of our teachers, Master Li, told us, "Don't worry about it, just practice."

Hi FGS, In our interview with him, Fabrizio mentioned he was working on translating some of Liu's material. Let's encourage him to publish it soon. Cleary was one of the first people to make available in translation many important works, but he (to use a Chinese saying) "eats a lot of the meaning." I am really looking forward to Fabrizio's treatment of the material.

That is because the link is to a free download of our whitepaper "Interpreting the Ancient Codes." It is short collection consisting of an interview, review and essay related to the Can Tong Qi and the importance of a sound translation. Fabrizio Pregadio's translation of the Can Tong Qi is cited within the paper. If you prefer not to download the paper you can find the book listed on his website. If you are interested in serious academic research on the subject of the Can Tong Qi, then you might want to also consider getting the recently published Volume 2, which includes a comprehensive bibliographical study of the ancient text. The work that went into it is simply incredible.

I can tell you what my teacher, Chen Quanzhong, told me about it. Tongbei contributed not only the concept of "power through the back" but also some of the movements and drills. One example from the form is Shan Tong Bei (Flash the Back). A second example, the Chen spear form, may represent a later round of borrowing. When the staff form was lost, Chen family borrowed the Tong Bei staff work to create the current Pear Flower/White Ape Spear form. Some of the stranger looking drills in Chen Tai Chi (and other internal arts) are for developing this type of power through the back.

As you may know, Tongbei Quan is one of the arts which influenced Chen Tai Chi Chuan. Which line of Chen Laojia do you practice?

K, Yes, the arrow of the Lou Pan needle points South. There is no easy answer for how to buy a Lou Pan. Generally your teacher will give it to you. Since there are several variations on them, your teacher will tell you which type to buy. However, when buying one, you should check the quality of the craftsmanship carefully since they are made in China! Also, if you have a known good compass, check the Lou Pan against it before you buy it. CD, The difference between variation and error is actually an important one, and your definition is not one I learned in engineering school. In the case of compasses, error is what you get when you have interference with your reading, such as from large amounts of metal in the environment. In the example that I gave earlier the error was a staggering 10 degrees! The difference in true north and magnetic north is called declination. Declination is printed on most navigational maps. The easy way to calculate true north is simply to add or subtract the declination. You can easily look up the procedure for this online. Lacking an official declination number for your area (or supposing you live a few hundred years ago) you could calculate it from the North Star or the arc of the sun. Again, I am certain someone has posted the procedure online.

It would be more accurate to characterize the difference between the magnetic north and true north as a variation depending on time and space, and not as an "error." There are many ways to find true north. You don't even need a compass, but it is easier with one. These methods are not secret and are well known in the west.

We use magnetic north.

Agreed, this is one of the better discussions of the subject. There is not much to add to what has already been said, except perhaps for sharing an example of the problems with getting an accurate compass reading. As has been mentioned, magnetic fields can throw off the accuracy of the compass reading. Major sources of interference during the reading are metal in the door frames, walls (including wires) and floors. We had this problem earlier in the week while performing an analysis for a client who just bought a new apartment. Due to the layout, the apartment had an usually high concentration of metal near the entrance. In addition, not only was the door frame metal, but the door was metal and the walls had commercial metal framing instead of the wood generally used in houses. The floors were reinforced concrete. This case required dozens of reading from various distances to find a place sufficiently free of interference. It took a long time, much to the owner's surprise, but it is worth the effort to get an accurate reading.

We found a video interview of one of our Taoist priest friends talking about Turtle Breathing from our recent trip to China. His explanation is in response to a question about the 4th movement of the Eight Brocades. (Note that if you understand the principle of the breathing as described in the classical texts then you can add it to many practices. For example, there is a specific practice called Turtle Breathing in the southern school (Nan Pai) which includes a Dao Yin.) In the video, Master Wang also discusses the Wudang origin legend of the Yin Yang symbol. My colleague is the interpreter. http://www.youtube.c...=1&feature=plcp Edit: I couldn't figure out how to embed the video, so if someone can point me in the right direction I would appreciate it.

Hi Joeblast, Thank you for sharing. Are you talking about the Can Tong Qi or Wang Mu's Foundations of Internal Alchemy? Your reference sounds like Foundations, but your citation matches neither of the books. If I had to guess you are referring to pages 27-34 of Foundations, specifically note 38 on page 30. Is that correct? If so then I agree that is one of the more interesting and useful passages for Nei Dan practitioners. Fabrizio is in the best position to address the origins of the footnotes since he is the translator.

Hi Joeblast, It's great to hear your found something of interest. Would you care to share any of those with us? It is always interesting to find out what resonates with people!