dawei

its all about the framework you think within... Ch. 1 has shown two sides of the same coin: Manifest and Mystery Ch. 2 now unleashes the irony of it all... 'the sage teaching no-talking' yet it takes it 5,000 words to get it out LZ is an everyday man (manifest)... maybe the Yang side to Zhuangzi's (ZZ) approach of sitting and forgetting it all. LZ makes you face the music... and calls it music Because that is how man talks, thinks and sees the world. He makes you ponder the usefulness of words. LZ is also a sage (mystery)... maybe the Yin side to his everyday man side. LZ makes you then ponder the uselessness of words and how they effectively keep one from 'going about doing nothing'... work is done and then forgotten. And it's not about the 'work' or being 'done'... as they are forgotten. He would make a much better therapist than ZZ on some level but just not as funny

The first two lines are to me similar to what I shared recently about 'the constancy of Dao vs the transformation of life'. The next two attempt a subtle link between them that is spelled out more explicitly in DDJ 42. Here is one link between Dao and Two; Then Two and the 10,000. In some ways, this is simpler and less controversy than DDJ42 where there are different interpretations of what makes up the "three".

Best absorption has been done in china for thousands of years... soak in alcohol... add in some ginseng.

It seems a debate between the part and the whole... Penumbra does not only not know itself, it doesn't know the whole. So while Penumbra is absence of the whole picture, Shadow stays within his own whole.

Draw a really big circle on a piece of paper.. then hold a pencil above, maybe an arm's-length... then let go of the pencil. See where it hits the paper? The circle is infinity (excuse the boundary... please)... the dot marked by the pencil is you... that is the "point" your asking about in the end, right ? Cuz without you.... the topic would not exist

You are now... D_T_I

here it is http://www.thedaobums.com/forum/480-bruce-qi/

ZZ beats a divine drum... and the sounds seem to repeat over and over till we just want to leave it... but each beat is a new insight to the origin of his point.. he drones onward but wants to mimic the worldly droneness. Simple message: You construct your reality and realm of infinity....

IMO, ZZ is recounting the thoughts of 10,000 arising thoughts.. in dualistic thinking and arising... as if to say... ENOUGH... You forget where you come from... NON-DUAL... go back to the mother's milk... grasp this and...well... I better stop my story....

you didn't notice it closed up... winter is coming

No limit... but if we imposed a fee, maybe there would be a built-in limit

Done

One of my cousins was a professional body builder and one day he said that the secret of 'back' boiled down to one area of exercise... work the upper back. He showed me various exercises, which I knew being in sports all my life. His point was: By exercising the upper back, we naturally stretch (upward towards heaven). We draw back our shoulders and walk upright with confidence. I think there is some truth to it...

by request of the OP, the thread was removed. This was a challenging topic to start with and a title which caught many's eyes. It could not really last under the continued jesting to get to the level of discussion the OP hoped. It seemed to turn more personal in the end and I've agreed to move it out of sight.

You compared methods... and then stated your method. This is the mind of duality. As was said [somewhere]: to claim to abide by one ultimate path is to fail in understanding. It is the mind claiming that path and thus it is not a path to anywhere except to please the mind. The ultimate path is no [mental] path. But to get there, is a mental path...

Wouldn't a teaching that "it's all happening right here" also be a method of control? "in reality, there is nothing to eliminate and nothing to establish" -- Hua Hu Ching. Tr. Ni

Thanks "It takes a village" seems to apply here TDB is like a flowing river and it should flow where it wants but there will be environmental influences which alter the landscape at times. Sometimes it takes irrigation or doing something to stabilize the erosion. The waters may move in new directions. Trees may fall in and change some courses. I appreciate those who take it upon themselves to plant flowers and foliage along the banks and even help to pull the debris out.

Welcome and good question... it will be asked for many life times to come as well I'd try this. Take about 4-6 completely and seemingly unrelated aspects to life and the universe and mention them to someone... and then ask what is it that ties these all together? Likely most will answer "God"... and you could ask how is it tied together? And maybe you'll get answers regarding the act of creation and God in all things, etc. You could then relate that the guiding force in the universe and life that gives everything its 'way' to come and go is also referred to as Dao. That instead of a religious undertone it is as Ni says, 'the subtle reality of the universe' that is in everything but asks for nothing.

Some folks might prefer that.. but then its a cop out in my book... at the very least, vote the lesser evil... however one defines it.

Attention and focus are powerful things in energy and in life. The first step may be to check your awareness of the situation: 1. Make a list of what you find your attention and focus tend to be one. 2. Then make a list of what you think you really want your attention and focus to be one. 3. Set out to keep your attention and focus on what is most important... and that could include anything from physical stuff to relationships to spiritual stuff. It's your call. I recall an ancient text saying when in doubt, focus on the lower dan tian... that's it. 4. Repeat in 4 weeks and see what changed

here it is http://www.thedaobums.com/forum/478-kar3n/

Thanks for sharing... he is interesting and amusing In Medical Qigong, we did shielding of self, bubbles on patient and a trash can to boot... Later... I threw the shielding in the trash can

Today I was [once again] reading the other work claimed to be authored by Laozi, Hua Hu Ching. But you can read some here, there is a subforum: http://www.thedaobums.com/topic/30438-hhc-study-background-and-criticisms/ I thought of starting another series on it but sticking to Hua-Ching Ni's elucidation... maybe post something of choice from each chapter instead the entire chapters...

I have it too... That Amazon book IS his translation of the TTC... as was stated on Amazon: "Foreign Language Teaching and Research Press has done a great job in taking Lin Yutang's 1948 translation of the Daodejing and republishing it, producing a beautiful paperback with a fine dust jacket." And as you requested: The Father and Son of Taoist Philosophy ... thread started by the Welcome master, Marblehead