dawei

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Realize they have always seen outsiders as the foreign devil; and outsiders represented anyone outside of a stone's throw at times. The State of Chu were called Barbarians, and they were neighbors... Anciently they had names for those to the north, south, east, and west; all derogatory. Today you can still see it but it is kept buried deep. It has shown up on this site several times too. But yes, it is in the culture and rooted to the past, IMO. That's a philosophical idea for the most part; ask 100 chinese about laozi and they won't have a single quote; they might say something but your likely to point out to them that Confucius said it. But one can observe this sayings truism.

I have awaited your return to posting. Can you repeat it in 10 lines or less?

do vs think... this is the essence of life...

Yes, I am talking in metaphor And I think your further comments are "on point" to clarify it. Nice post.

as said in the quote: he dissolves all minds into harmonious Oneness. This is the passive way... it is one with Dao. St Paul said this, which is an active way... Though I am free and belong to no one, I have made myself a slave to everyone, to win as many as possible. To the Jews I became like a Jew, to win the Jews. To those under the law I became like one under the law (though I myself am not under the law), so as to win those under the law. To those not having the law I became like one not having the law (though I am not free from God’s law but am under Christ’s law), so as to win those not having the law. To the weak I became weak, to win the weak. I have become all things to all people so that by all possible means I might save some. The moral of the story is: Do you fell the dissolution of all into One?

49 One with wholeness of virtue has an unconditioned mind. He regards the mind of all being as his own mind He is kind to the kind. He is also kind to the unkind, for the subtle nature of the universe is kind. He is faithful to the faithful. He is also faithful to the unfaithful, for the integral virtue of the universe is undeceiving. In the midst of the world, he dissolves all minds into harmonious Oneness. All people strain their eyes and ears for excitement. One of deep virtue brings all people back to their childlike-heartedness.. -- Ni I find the same teaching in St. Paul on Christianity.

I tend to view the association of inner and outer as classifications. But in reality, there is no separating them on some level. I cannot just make my body an enclosed system without any external interaction.... One might say: I inhale, therefore I am internal; I exhale, therefore I am external. But to me, that is backwards: To inhale means I am external; to exhale means I am internal. But if we break it down, cut it up, and dice and slice it up... we can make some distinctions as to their source and goal.

I am not sure there is an answer to your question; or if there is really a valid question at all. One cannot understand chinese unless they understand xenophobia. And then, realize the concentric circles of self-family-others. Consider even the daoist mandate: Save self. The tough part of consider compassion is that it means either there is not compassion or a need for compassion... but due to the ideas of historical ideas of 'saving and giving face', the role of compassion is reduced to non-existent on some level. I almost think if you asked 100,000 chinese about this, they would say: You need to be compassionate... and then watch them and your lucky to see even a few who appear to live it. It is just an idea; it is not life for them. Their survival has been more about not needing to consider this social thorn/norm.

In a relative way; this is his weakness but he is strong to engage in it relative to 10,000 others who don't care about their body... but the observation is right: he has become more than fixated; it is taken him over. I think his advise is generally good and one should explore issues he raises... and then find if it is beneficial or not. B-I-N-G-O

I am curious by this idea that the Qin Emperor burnt certain texts... how was that really implemented and enforced? How would they know if Chu was burning books in question? It is enough to say that books were buried... many underground but some in walls, etc. Hidden from eyes...

FYI: He didn't just read it online and thought it was gospel... he wrote this gospel If you want to criticize someone's work the maybe offer to clear up what is worse and what is better. Otherwise it's just being critical for no productive reason to the author.

A normal reaction to your color would be RED... emotionally reactive but that is just surface level. A real understanding is black... deep, enigma, void seeking and emerging. Void is deeply misunderstood as nothing; it is everything.

of course not... how the F*! can I know this... but sometimes inner speaks to inner... I simply saw something.

Xinjiang terrorist.... good timing on the question...

GD: 高下之相盈也 MWD-A: 高下之相盈也 MWD-B: 高下之相盈也 HSG: 高下相傾 WB: 高下相傾 FY: 高下之相傾

I don't think this side topic is really about ZZ... but rather, how was it compiled and when. Whether it is close to the time of ZZ is not really about ZZ... unless someone has research showing something compelling for why it is in the time of ZZ but still not sure if that is anything to do with ZZ on some level.

I hate to be pedantic but this is a Deci thread Or is it being essence itself? and Potential itself? --- I get what you mean but it seems to convey the need for human doing and intervention to achieve a state or possess a state.

This is worthy of a separate thread... and would be interesting to research. I tend towards a syncretic text.

Good point... As I have been fascinated with cosmology, I have read and researched this text only second to the DDJ. The one reason I see it as potentially not belonging to the DDJ is that the DDJ is rather inferior in such a developed cosmology. But there is a line for line repeated in both... but that line is also in The Spring and Autumn Annuls which reflects the State of Lu history 772-481 BC. “I do not know its name but if pressed, I call it Great"... Which simply begs research into 'Great'... or at that time, "Great One" -- Da Yi.... first characters of the text in question !

What is also strange is that no subsequent find of the text exists either. And I don't know of any mention or quote of it by others... so it was never even considered for the Daoist Canon.

In my reading of Wagner's book where he often compares all the versions, there seems little added... in fact, I saw it closer to WB than the older text it would date to... as this link also suggests: Daode jing guben pian [TEXT NOT REPRODUCIBLE IN ASCII] 2 juan Edited by Fu Yi [TEXT NOT REPRODUCIBLE IN ASCII] (555-639) 665 (fasc. 346) "Ancient Recension of the Book of the Way and Its Virtue." This is the plain text of the Laozi, without commentary, based on a manuscript discovered in A.D. 574 at Pengcheng [TEXT NOT REPRODUCIBLE IN ASCII] (Xuzhou, Jiangsu), in the tomb of a concubine of Xiang Yu [TEXT NOT REPRODUCIBLE IN ASCII] (233-202 B.C.). See 770 Hunyuan shengji3.20a. The date as well as the stylistic characteristics of the present text establish a relationship with the manuscripts of the Laozi found in 1973 in Han tomb no. 3 at Mawang dui near Changsha (Hunan). The division into a Daopian [TEXT NOT REPRODUCIBLE IN ASCII] and a Depian [TEXT NOT REPRODUCIBLE IN ASCII] may therefore well correspond to the original arrangement of the text, while the arrangement into eighty-one chapters, according to the so-called Heshang gong zhangju, as well as the indications on the number of characters in each chapter are probably of Fu Yi's own devising. The present text contains 5,556 characters, almost 300 more than the Heshang gong commentary version of 682 Daode zhenjing zhu, which has 5,274. None of these numbers correspond to the indications supposedly given by Fu Yi on the versions he examined in his time: 5,722 characters for the manuscript found at Pengcheng, 5,683 or 5,610 for the Wang Bi commentary version, and 5,555 or 5,590 for the Heshang gong commentary version (770 Hunyuan shengji 3.20a). The present text, however, shows greater affinities to the extant Wang Bi edition than to that attributed to Heshang gong. Ref: http://www.bookdialy.com/book/609275/taoist-canon

I do think it is a compelling argument to consider that this should possibly be considered a part of the text. Parts of that text (Da Yi Sheng Shui) contain lines which are in the DDJ (25). But the original team which dealt with the Guodian finds, could not find a reason to leave it together with the DDJ as their knowledge of the other versions (MWD, Deida, HSG) have never mentioned or included them. It has an incredible visual cosmology more like an unrolling.. and the emphasis on water rather than Dao puts it among other very ancient texts which did the same thing.

Valid question. It seems that most of the time that a taboo character change occurred that they did not go back to the original character. Even Fu Yi (555 - 639) version, whom often went back to original MWD characters did not always do so. It may be that after so much time, the original meaning was lost and the surrogate replacement made sense to all.

The dating you give is because the commentary is supposedly prefaced by his great uncle, Ge Xuan (164–244)... and if true then we must go back 100 C.E. But some feel earlier in Han is appropriate.