dawei

I am curious who is trying to do this retaining? At the time of the Laozi writings the kingdom was fractured into factions all 'warring' for their own superiority among themselves; and they were at least 200 years prior to unification... Laozi was from Chu who was a super power at the start; and again after the fall of Qin. But Laozi seems to see the warring way is not worth sticking around to see what happens. I am always interested to learn more as I have spent almost 8 years writing my own history of early china.

I am not sure what you mean by casting a different light. There is a difference [throughout their history] of how they treated the 'barbarians' vs their own ethic group; this goes back to even the 'legendary period' and how they trace their origins as descends of Yan and Huang [Di], and even as Han. It has always been very important to them to cast a national identity. The first Han emperor, Liu Bang, instituted this form of 'barbarian' appeasement just to keep them from having any ideas of fighting. It was a ploy used over and over again in different forms. What may be ironic is that after slaughtering their own in civil wars they would try to appease the barbarians; IMO, the paramount need to maintain isolationism drove this mentality.

yes.. commonsense. Fish don't seek the net, nor try to keep it nor protect it... but they do run into it and get a surprise.

Me three...

I think this is a good point. I recall once wondering how well my Huiyin was truly moving (or responding to) my feeling of flexing. So I went to the source and felt it's movement while doing the breathing. To my surprise, I found that there were times when I was flexing but there was really no movement going on. This was a great lesson to discover; flexing is not necessary moving the area. The unison of the breathing and the movement is important and they support each other well. I often do NAB in the fire cycle to 'turn the Qi' (some call it drumming and beating or some a turbine); After that, I stop its turning; condense it and drop it into the perineum and immediately do RAB in the fire cycle.

"B" is pure nonsense... the unkind don't care to keep anything... Your "A" is also bordering on nonsense... which means your english cannot really put forth your meaning. Honestly, I think you have a valid idea but it doesn't come out in english. I might add that it is NOT "BY" the unkind... it is "FOR" the unkind... don't ignore the opening lines.. this is about DAO, not the unkind. I will add... of course... JMO

My understanding is that it can flow both ways and one can practice it both ways. I mentioned above at least one reason each is used; but the fire path will help resolve acquire emotional issues. When I said the fire cycle with the RAB 'burns' the spine... it is burning through (release the blockages of) the stored emotions stuck in the spine. If you are naturally in the water cycle, I would encourage it.

The original link provided explains some uses of RAB which can include for healing, energy packing and Qi emission, etc. Ergo, there are practices/trainings which use it outside of martial training. One can use the NAB or RAB in practices with the MCO. The MCO has two directions: 1. Fire Path (Up governing vessel and down conception vessel); regulate emotions and acquired mind. 2. Water Path (Up conception vessel and down governing vessel); regulate spiritual perception and the original mind. RAB is NOT against the course of nature. There are many times when we do it naturally in exercise and in medical conditions. Did you know that we are born with our energy flowing in the water cycle? If that was our 'original nature', when and why does it change? Did you know older ladies naturally change back to the water cycle? You cannot really say something is against the natural flow without defining the meaning better; and also one needs to know that our environment changes our original natures. Some practices seek to restore (or connect with) the original Way. So, should we call it "against nature" if it simply seeks to "return to the source"? I think "against nature" is not a good way of explanation since our nature is probably very far from being the original nature or naturalness.

There are a few words which differ from the oldest texts and which Hendricks bases his translation on. Maybe just the opening lines can be looked at for an example: This is the Wang Bi... but he simply follows He Shang Gong word for word. The Fu Yi had one extra word here so Wang Bi is just following He Shang Gong and Fu Yi. 1. 道者萬物之奧。- hidden recess / profound 2. 善人之寶，- treasure 3. 不善人之所保。 - protect This is the Ma Wang Dui text (A): 1. 道者萬物之注。- pour, flow, concentrate , notable 2. 善人之葆， - original, preserve, cover 3. 不善人之所葆。 - original, preserve, cover I personally think that "treasure" was pushed too hard in this chapter after everyone followed Fu Yi's changes to the opening. In the first line of the modern text, 奧 means the southwest corner of the house which is where worship occurred and grain stored. This naturally lead to an interpretation of the second line modern word 寶 as treasure. The oldest text seems to have a simple meaning, not trying to push the idea of 'treasure'; Just that the flow of the ten thousand things preserves both the good and not-good.

Here is Flowing Hands: CHAPTER 62 The Dao is the treasured way of the Universe and the Ten Thousand Things. It treats all things equally and sees the good and bad in all men. The Sage is like the Dao; if a man is bad, he does not abandon him, nor does he give more preference to those who are good. He sees the world as one whole and so treats all things alike. When the king is crowned and the officers of state installed, do not send great gifts of gold and jade, but remain still and offer them your greatest treasure, the Dao. Because the Dao is unbiased, yielding and flowing, people like the Dao at first. For they each can find what they seek and be forgiven for all their sins. Therefore it is the greatest treasure that exists in the Universe.

I agree... I think the body-spirit is immortal. When the three treasures are transformed (or transported) back to the spiritual source then one completes the immortality [early] in this life.

I think Dennis explanation is good: It also helps to see when the RAB is used with the MCO in the 'fire path' direction, one is truly 'burning' the energy up the spine. There are various concerns to doing it, particularly for some people with certain conditions. I would think that a person would not try to do this often unless there was a specific practice or guidance provided.

I agree with the opening dissent... but your just explaining its cosmological meaning so far... Well... native chinese are 1.3 billion people... your speaking for them? I agree they do not think 'supreme ultimate' because they think in metaphorical application. They DO NOT think of Yin and Yang... what they think is what 'supreme ultimate' might mean as an application to them... it means: MAN IS VERY SMALL AMONG THE COSMOS. it is a very simple and pragmatic meaning, and it is cosmological in a humanistic way, as the chinese people are. Maybe our western egos think we are too big among the cosmos to think this way... It may be to a few martial artist who want to maintain a Wu Shu idea to Tai Ji... but once we start saying what the average chinese person thinks, we should better know the average chinese person, or else we end up with our own silly conventions and sayings. This is where it all goes so wrong... You should not extrapolate Tai Ji to Tai Ji Quan since you neglect the contribution of Quan and over emphasize some contrived meaning of Tai Ji... JMO... and here is why: Even if you want to talk about Tai Ji as the Yin and Yang energies, they are complementary and supportive; they wax and wane to each other as an ebb and flow. Tai Ji Quan is a combative martial art, as is said; 以柔克刚 , to use softness to overcome strength... And there is where it falls apart using Yin and Yang: Yin and Yang are not combative; they do not seek to conquer or overcome... this is an extrapolation in the western world. Quan is used in various ways but when combined with Tai Ji it gives it a very unique meaning as found in: 四两拨千斤. 4 ounces can move 1000 lbs. You do not find this meaning in Tai Ji alone...

When do you feel hot? at rest? Or only when working out? What time do you work out? What part of the country do you live? (influence of climate) DO you follow an aerobic or anaerobic style of workout? Also, what are your goals and expectations? Did you know your mental and emotional well-being can overheat too? What balance do you have to all this over-active workout.. do you meditate?

Nobody can tell you what your body wants ! I had some very strong Korea Ginseng for which I could only take a very small portion of; if I took the recommended dosage, my Qi was shooting all over the place, almost chaotic... it was too strong for my sensitivity. I had a friend who had some serious health issues but was incredibly well verse in 5 element theory and seeking some remedy. I sent him this. He took the recommended dosage (twice mine) and said the energy feeling was sensational; smooth and healing... ergo, only your body knows. Based on what I see on the attachment, it seems strong... for my body.

Sorry... I can't quite follow what it is you want. You talked of Ginseng and then followed someone who talked of a Siberian , which is NOT ginseng; even they advised how to get it, you did not get it as their recommendation... first you want to chew it and now you want to seep it in 151 Rum. Would it not be easier to just buy some various forms and try them and see what your body wants? In the end, you bought the very thing you did not ask about. Maybe your destiny will find this is what you needed. A few notes: 1. IMO... Korean (and I mean good stuff) is better and stronger than chinese ginseng. I have pure chinese gingseng grown from a country side but the korean stuff (ie: good stuff) is verified by others I sent it to as more powerful... 2. American gingseng is a YIN effect but you need to know if you truly need it. You can feel truly energized but can get shakes from it if it is not really what you need. 3. Seeping ginseng in alcohol is a long continued history of practice. I am not sure how western Jiu measures up against that used in china. I have never tested the western stuff against chinese strong stuff; the latter I know very well. Mix Gou Qi Zi with it as a common balance to the seeping brew.

http://news.ancientayurved.org/2011/02/exploring-complementary-therapies-that-can-help-with-cancer/ another: http://shaolinyijinjingmsia.blogspot.com/2009_09_01_archive.html I have found this is a topic not worth discussing here due to the above reasons...

Here is one difference in how I understand what you are asking but it would be interesting to hear Michael's thought. When one emits healing sound (to self or another), it causes vibration at the jing [audible] (physical organ), Qi [semi-audible] (energy container) or Shen [inaudible] (expansive) level. In meditation, one reaches an awareness of the vibrational levels and a sound emerges (probably Qi or Shen level). So I see this going the opposite direction but I don't know if it contains the same healing intention/will.

This completely ignores Qi emission and receiving... almost anybody can walk up to another person and do Qi emission (given a few easy instructions) and the other person will feel it. This has nothing to do with "repair". That's like saying that when an acupuncture needle is inserted and one "feels" the Qi flow it is only because of repair? Or taking some herbs and feeling Qi flow is only because of repairs? It is because of Qi flow itself... not just because of repair.

Inedia or Breatharianism... you can also look at Youtube and find people who follow Qigong practices to sustain it. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inedia

This is where Medical Qigong deals with this issue much more. I am not sure exactly what methods are used but I suspect even "soul retrieval" might be valid to do. But my qigong master is a big believer in being able to change cells (inherited or not).

An example of it's use is standing Wu Ji Daoist MCO. This is from Jerry's book: "The most important basic techniques of Medical Qigong training are guided by eighteen rules of proper form and structure. The main point of Postural Dao Yin training is to relax and seek quiescence while in the various postures. Tension in any area of the body restricts the whole structural system, since the body seeks to balance its structure naturally by shifting its energy and weight. The general function of the muscles is to guide the flow of energy through the channels. The following is a list of the Eighteen Rules for proper standing postures, these rules apply to every school of energy cultivation: 1. Stand with the feet flat, 2. Bend the knees, 3. Relax the hips, 4. Round the perineal area, 5. Close the anal sphincter, 6. Pull in the Stomach, 7. Relax the waist, 8. Tuck the chest in, 9. Stretch the back, 10. Relax the shoulders, 11. Sink the elbows, 12. Hollow the armpits, 13. Relax the wrists, 14. Suspend the head, 15. Tuck the chin, 16. Close the eyes for inner vision, 17. Close the mouth and tum your hearing inwards, and 18. Touch the tongue to the upper palate, Each of these eighteen rules is described in detail... . . . The anus is divided into five regions: Front, Middle, Back, Left, and Right. By contracting the anus in different parts, you can bring more Qi to the various organs and glands."

Yes, IMO some herbs can but may not "open" up as well as some practices (movement or meditation), depending on what needs to be opened.

Not sure I follow what your asking. It sounds similar whether you practice on yourself or emit to another.

Zong Qi is called Ancestral Qi (or gathering Qi since it gathers in the chest area; resides in the middle dan tian). Zong Qi since this location is the place of unprocessed emotions. The Zong Qi helps with respiration (lungs) and the pulse (heart). BUT... Yuan Qi is also called Ancestral or Original Qi, and this is the pre-natal Qi which resides in the lower dan tian and will have past life imprints. I have not heard this association in regards to suicide but suspect it is the [inherited] Yuan Qi. We were discussing the DDJ Chapter 60 in the subforum and I was explaining Gui and Shen (the two polar sides to "Spirit" and how the chapter implies to not harm the spirit so that later (after death) one's spirit does not harm others later).