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Hi serius Which BKF book are you using to learn the breathing and the taoist meditation?

well heres an article explaining how Dayan Qigong, or Wild Goose Qigong induces the MCO through its movement exercises, so by doing this qigong, which was deemed by the chinese government as one of the most effective and one of the safest styles out there. So obviously this style is always creating the MCO, but doing so in a safe way that naturally puts it in balance. Heres an article on it My link

here is an interesting article about how wild goose qigong induces the MCO through movement. My link

Nice video, I think I'm gonna cook up some tea right now . I don't really see how one can get drunk without alcohol, I guess just drunk from joy of drinking tea

Thanks for all the good comments. Personally I am not a big drinker and never care to drink for the purpose of getting drunk. I just occasionally enjoy a good glass of wine or beer, especially when I visit my family in Italy . It sounds like a drink here and there in moderation will not be to detrimental to me. Howbout you guys, do you occasionally have a nice drink once in while? Also I think simply doing qigong your body will force you to give up certain habits. Last year when i was really getting into qigong, it was like my tolerance to certain things changed. After a month of qigong, I got really sick just from eating a chili dog, which 3 weeks before my body could have easily been able to handle. I was forced to give up certain habits in replace for healthier ones. This is probably how the taoists decided what is healthy. They weren't told by some higher power what rules to follow, they simply listened to their bodies and found what worked and what didn't.

Also i think a buddhist way of looking at it is that if karma doesn't catch up with the evil doer in this life, then the next life they will pay for they're deeds and drop down in the chain of life and maybe instead of a being born a person, they'll be dog, or slug . For example I doubt Hitler came back too high of a life form in his next life. Of course everyone will have different views on this issue.

Hi Scotty, Just to comment on what you said about qigong masters dying young. I've been that qigong masters who seclude themselves to their alchemy in the mountains live to a very old age, however qigong masters who use their gift for healing and end up giving too much of their own chi away without re-cultivating it do not live too long, which only makes sense. Also Bruce Frantzis comments in his book Opening the Energy gates, that certain styles of qigong that are very forceful and involve vibrating ones chi can result in serious health conditions; so obviously some qigong styles can be counter productive and harm ones energy.

Hi Pietro, Could you, or anyone else please elaborate on what is the difference between a taoist master and immortal? You said BKF was 3 years away from becoming an immortal.

Hi Craig Ya theres a local class for the dayan qigong, which i would go to once a week. Her teacher is Dr. Bingkun Hu My link and he comes at least once a year to do a workshop at the class. I am excited to start and think i will at least try to get through the first two levele and see where i am from there. I do feel drawn to the teachings of BKF and perhaps later in my life i will get the opportunity to learn his practice too. Scotty said I too would be interested in why you prefer Dayan to BF, it very well may be a better system, but i am just curious as to your reasoning

hi everyone, thanks for all the great responses. I found this from an article on dayan wild goose qigong and thought it would be beneficial to this thread. heres the site if anyone wants it, its a very good article on qigong, specifically dayan qigong, My link

So what your guys opinions on the taoist's postion on celibacy? From what I understand taoist philosophy is based upon living balanced life. Both a life of celibacy and constant sexual activities would be on both sides if the extreme. My link, heres a link talking about taoists view and has quotes from taoists masters saying their view on how often a man should ejaculate. What all the masters have in common is that they limit ejaculation to about twice a month, and say that one should have a ratio of about one emmision per every hundred copulations, therefore these masters learn how to copulate without ejaculation and control their orgasms. What does everyone here think about this? Do you think these practices of sexual control should be more talked about in modern day taoist thought? These masters say it is vital for a man to begin looking into taoist sexual control practices by age 30 and by age 40 having learned and practice them, otherwise serious ailments will bestow upon the body. Obviously this field of practice was looked upon as very important to these taoist masters and necessary for perfect health. They also say how simply retaining from ejaculation altogether is unbalanced and will lead cause the body to build up sexual desire and climax in a wet dream or nighttime emission, which these masters say is 100 times worse for the body than a regular emission, so avoiding the issue seems to go very against the taoist philosophy of balance and control of ones life.

Hi everyone, Let me just say a little about myself first. The first time I experienced energy was practicing qigong for the first time last year. It was an amazing experience and was like a whole new sense opened up to me. My teacher was this guy My link he seemed very authentic and the real deal. However he spoke no english and everything had to be verbalized to me through his assistant. This method of learning was hard for me and alongside school, I ultimately stopped practice after about a month of training. It was good qigong though from wudang mountain. I dont know if this is fast for qigong, but i could feel recognizable chi on only my third day of practice; this may be partially be due to the fact my master put his own energy into me to i guess jump start my chi, kinda like jump starting a car. Well anyways i am now in college and really want to practice qigong. Last night i checked out golden shield qigong which is basically the equivalent of shaolin iron body qigong where the practitioners spent the whole time hitting themselves with sticks and bricks as hard as their bodies could take to force chi development. Bruce Franztis harshly warns against this kind of forceful and vibrational qigong, so I am wary of pursuing this style. Although I would really like to start a practice of Bruce Franztis's qigong, the closest instructor is an hour away and that is too far for my busy schedule. I did find a class of wild goose qigong in town. Has anybody had any experiences with this style? Any advice or comments are gladly appreciated. Also what do you guys think of Bruce Frantzis's qigong, is it one of the most thorough styles out there that can take a person from beginner to advanced master?

Do you guys all listen to peaceful music while doing energy practice, or simply listen to their surrounding? I just recently bought this album off itunes to listen while doing qigong, and I have to say its the most profoundly peaceful healing music i've ever heard. My link Just thought I'de throw down my little find incase anyone was interested. Another truly healing album is My link. This second one is for anyone like myself who enjoys the didigeridoo.

Hi everyone, Let me just say i'm excited to be a new part of this amazing world of spirituality. I have always been drawn to mysteries and the things that people can't quite explain, always knowing there was more to it than coincidence and that we were all part of something greater. My interest in spirituality really took off as I began doing qigong for a while and it was amazing to start feeling my own chi, it was like a whole new sense opened up to me and from that point I knew I was starting to get in touch with this greater reality we are all a part of. Since then I have read many books on different topics. But sadly due to school and my busy life I put qigong to the side and focused on other things, however the spark inside me has been reignited and my passion for spirituality has been rekindled. I have looked into local qigong classes in my area and am really excited about starting this one called Golden Shield Qigong, or Jingui Qigong; I don't know if anyone here has heard of it before but it seems very good. I am particularly drawn to taoism, having read some of Bruce Franzis's works and also feel very connected to buddhism, in particular Tibetan Buddhism. One day I may partake in Dzogchen or some other practice, but for now I will just enjoy whatever the universe throws at me and let my own spiritual path evolve as it will. I am excited to be a part of this forum and am open to all kinds of views on spirituality, I do not think there is any one single correct way to practice spirituality, just whatever feels most true in your heart.

Well I came across this thread from a person on this forum who had horrible results with mantak chia's practicehttp://www.thetaobums.com/index.php?/topic/2889-semen-in-urine/page__p__26914entry26914 I also read people on this forum saying that taoist sexual can be beneficial but one must have the proper foundation of energy development first with their energy channels properly cleared to prevent the sexual energy from clogging your system. I think there could be benefit to learning Chia's system, but I would be somewhat cautious about it because many on this forum seem to warn against it until one is adept at working with energy. I will personally wait before I feel ready, if ever, to pursue this form of energy. Actually I looked deeper into the reviews on Mantak Chia's book and there were a sizeable amount of bad reviews saying that the practices Chia describes are too advanced for a beginner to energy work and a novice could do serious harm to their health. I am just writing this as a warning to those interested in taoist sexual practices, I someone wishes to practice it, there are a number of members who practice Chia's methods on this site and could help you on your path.

Hi, Thanks for conducting this interview. I read in BKF's book opening the energy gates that he discourages the use of taoist sexual practices, but he list very obscure just plain painful practices like hanging heavy weights from the testicles and sucking the testicles into the body for protection. These just sound dangerous and I would agree with him to never mess with those kind of practices. But I am curious about his view on Mantak Chia's practices of internal orgasm. Chunyi Lin from spring forest qigong also alludes to this that when done correctly sex can be very beneficial to ones energy instead of depleting. Obviously Mantak Chia's practices are very safe due to the high positive feedback from amazon and on his overall practices. I do not think Mantak Chia would be as acclaimed as he is without his practices being safe and helpful; not only that but he probably would have been sued by now or had his books taken off the shelves a long time ago if his methods were dangerous and damaging. I would just like to ask Bruce Frantzis his opinion on Mantak Chia's taoist sex practices of internal orgasm. This article http://www.universal-tao.com/FAQ/healing_love.html describe what I am talking about and says that celibacy is not the only path for those worried about depleting energy through sex. Instead sex can be used to further develop one's energy and spiritual lives.

I just read in Bruce Frantzis's Book Opening the Energy Gates of Your Body, that he warns against taoist sex practices because done improperly can be dangerous. Of course he mentions strange techniques such as hanging wieghts from the testicles, sucking energy up the anus through the spine, and sucking the testicles into the body for protection. These are all very strange techniques I would never pursue, I do not know his views on Mantak Chia's techiniques of internal orgasm but to me they seem safe. Chia's books on the topic are filled with great reviews and positive results on Amazon. Perhaps this would be a good topic to discuss with bruce franztis if someone has an interview with him. It sounded from the book that he didn't forbade taoist sex practices, but didn't feel confident in his ability to discuss it in his book. I would doubt the user friendly books of Mantak Chia would be too dangerous, otherwise I think he would have been sued and his books would have been taken off the shelves long ago.

Hi pietro, No I have not yet tried any of these techniques. This discussion has intrigued my own interests in the topic and led me to conduct my own research which I will continue to pursue. These are just some sites I felt begin to delve in this concept of internal orgasm which is very new to me. Speaking of research I found this great interview with Mantak Chia, I plan on reading some of his books on taoist sexual practices. AUTHOR QUESTION AND ANSWER What is sexual Kung Fu? Sexual Kung Fu simply means sexual practice. Sexual Kung Fu is a tradition developed over thousands of years of specific techniques men can use to experience multiple and whole body orgasms, cultivate their sexual energy for improving their health and creativity as well as to pleasure and satisfy their partners. Can anyone become multi-orgasmic? How long does it take? Yes, as long as they understand and practice the techniques. How long it takes for a man to experience a multiple orgasm and then to become regularly orgasmic depends on two things: his sexual strength and sexual sensitivity. Some men may experience it the first time they try, while others will take several weeks or even months to become multi-orgasmic. But any man can become multi-orgasmic as long as he learns to separate between his orgasm and his ejaculation. What is the difference between orgasm and ejaculation? Surprising as it may sound to many men, orgasm and ejaculation are not the same thing, although they occur very close together in most men. The Taoists and great lovers the world over have known this fact for thousands of years, but it was not until the 1940s that it was recorded in the scientific literature by the famous sex researcher Alfred Kinsey. In short, orgasm is the contraction or pulsation that you feel at the peak of sexual arousal and that floods your body with pleasure. Your heart rate also rises about fifty beats per minute. Ejaculation is simply the lower spinal reflex that often follows orgasm and results in the ejection of sperm from your penis. Many men have experienced orgasm without ejaculation when they masturbated when they were young and before their body had started to make semen. Kinsey found that more than half of preteen boys could experience multiple orgasms. Unfortunately, when most men start to ejaculate, they forget how to distinguish between the crescendo of orgasm and the crash of ejaculation. How can I separate ejaculation from orgasm? As mentioned above, it requires two things: sexual sensitivity and sexual strength. In the book, we try to show men how to become aware of the moments between orgasm and ejaculation so they can learn to put the breaks on. By the breaks, we mean slowing down their arousal rate and using their sex muscles to control themselves from falling over the peak and down the steep cliff of ejaculation. When do I let it finally go? Ever? You can ejaculate every time you make love after you have had a number of orgasms, if you like. But most men, after they are able to orgasm without ejaculating, end up not wanting to ejaculate all the time. When they orgasm without ejaculating, they usually feel energetic and calm. When they ejaculate, they usually feel tired and lethargic. But according to the Tao, there are no absolutes. It all depends on a person's age, health, life circumstance. If you are on vacation, you may want to ejaculate more than if you are working very hard and need to conserve your energy. This is just common sense. Isn't holding it in painful or dangerous? Most men assume that if they do not ejaculate, they will have "blue balls" like they had when they were teenagers, but with multiple orgasms, you experience the release of tension and pressure that accompany orgasm. Not ejaculating is certainly not dangerous. The Taoists have been practicing these techniques for thousands of years without problems, and the studies show no sex problems. Where does the semen go if it is not ejaculated? It gets re-absorbed by your body just like it does in men who have had a vasectomy. What is a full body orgasm? Most men experience their orgasms primarily in the groin. This, according to the Taoists, is because we keep our sexual energy exclusively below the belt. The Taoists developed techniques for spreading this sexual energy and sexual pleasure throughout their body. Once you are able to do this, you begin to feel your orgasms in your brain and the rest of your body as well as in your genitals. What do you mean by sexual energy? What we call getting horny or getting aroused is understood in Sexual Kung Fu as the expansion of sexual energy. It is this sexual energy that you can use to expand your orgasms and revitalize your whole body. Are there health implications to being Multi-Orgasmic? Yes. According to Sexual Kung Fu, which is also called Healing Love, people need their sexual energy and even need to experience orgasms regularly to stay healthy. It is strange how we accept that pain is associated with illness, but we forget that pleasure is also associated with wellness. The problem is when a man ejaculates he loses much of this sexual energy he has created. This is the reason that many athletes and performers don't have sex the night before the big game or big performance. Musician Miles Davis talked about this, but what Miles and other men don't generally realize is that the drain is not sex but ejaculation. By learning to orgasm without ejaculating, they benefit from the sexual energy and waves of pleasure associated with orgasm (today, scientists might refer to the release of endorphins or other chemicals) without the depletion of ejaculation. A number of men have told me how they were able to avoid or end colds by using the Sexual Kung Fu techniques. In addition to prescribing certain pills for a particular condition, a Taoist physician would suggest love-making in a particular position--now that's, to quote Aretha Franklin, "Dr. Feel Good in the morning." What are some of the most fundamental techniques a man can use to enhance his sex life and move toward being multi-orgasmic? I think there are two very simple things that men can start to do. The first is to learn to be aware of their breathing. As in all martial arts and meditative practices, breathing is the way to gain control over your body. By learning to breathe deeply as he approaches orgasm, a man can learn to prolong orgasm and delay ejaculation. We go into much greater detail, but this is a place to start. Also, men can do the "Stopping the Stream Exercise" by which they learn to stop and start the flow of urine when they are going to the bathroom. The muscle that you use to stop and start the flow of urine (the PC or sex muscle) is the same muscle you use to help stop yourself from ejaculating. Why do you think it has taken us so long to learn about multiple orgasms in the West? Well, I think the fundamental problem comes from the shame that we feel around sexuality. For the Taoist, sex is just one part of being human. For them, just as we try to learn about cooking and nutrition to eat the tastiest food and stay fit, we should also learn about sex to experience the most possible pleasure and to stay healthy. How many men are actually multi-orgasmic now? I'd say probably somewhere between five and ten percent. Dr. William Hartman and Dr. Marilyn Fithian found that 12 percent of the men they studied in the laboratory were multi-orgasmic. I think this number might be a bit high, but it is still impressive. It is worth remembering that it is only in the last forty years that female orgasms have been recognized and accepted as normal. Back in the fifties, Kinsey reported that only 14 percent of women were multi-orgasmic. Recent surveys suggest that over 50 percent of women are multi-orgasmic! We expect that when more men realize that they can have multiple orgasm s and have a clear technique that the numbers will increase with similar speed. Already over the last fifteen years since the techniques in this book were introduced in the West, there has been a quiet sexual revolution going on among ordinary men who have learned to be multi-orgasmic. What do you say to the statement of some women, "Isn't one enough for them? What do I get out of it?" Most men who ejaculate when they orgasm remain focused on the goal of "getting off" rather than on the orgasmic process of love-making. Men who practice Sexual Kung Fu are not nervous or selfish lovers. They are in touch with their body and their partner's body, and are able to be much better lovers. Few men learn how to truly satisfy themselves or their partners sexually in this society. Sexual Kung Fu helps both partners to have the most pleasurable, passionate, and healthy love life. I would say that one doesn't have to be enough for men or for women; however, the issue isn't the number of orgasms, it is not about keeping score, it is about the quality and satisfaction of the love-making. Partners report much greater satisfaction with love-making once their partners learn to be multi-orgasmic. Can the techniques in The Multi-Orgasmic Man effect relationships outside of sex? As any sex therapist will tell you, when there are problems in the bedroom, there are problems in the relationship. While good sex will not solve all the problems in a relationship, it can certainly help. Sexual Kung Fu is a way of cultivating passion and intimacy in a relationship over a lifetime. It helps men and women to find infinite pleasure in their partner and not to become bored or seek after new sexual thrills. We call good sex "love-making" and that is exactly what the Taoist practice helps to do--make love. It helps partners to experience love and delight in one another, which can have a profound impact on relationships. How does the Taoist sexuality differ from tantric sex? There are some similarities between Tantra and Taoist sexuality, but unlike Tantra, which is part of the Hindu religious practice, Taoist sexuality was developed as a branch of Chinese medicine. You therefore don't need to believe any religious doctrines to be able to practice it and it is based on the workings of the body, not of any dogmatic belief system. In The Multi-Orgasmic Man we offer practical Taoist techniques that have been confirmed by scientific study to readers who are looking not for a new religious system but for a more profound experience of their own sexuality. Isn't there a spiritual side to Taoist sexuality as well? Certainly. Sexuality according to the Taoist was a profound spiritual practice. There was no separation between body and spirit like in the West. In Sexual Kung Fu, body and spirit are one and the same. What we have tried to do is offer basic techniques that all readers can use to become multi-orgasmic and to gradually add more subtle techniques for readers who want to use their sexuality as a path to improving their health and deepening their spirituality

heres a Taoist website I found which also describes the importance of internal orgasm instead of outward. It says if orgasm is outward there is a brief feeling of sexual pleasure, and then loss of sexual energy. If it orgasm is internal and directed up throughout the energy channels then the entire body is filled with blissful pleasure which can last much longer and can lead to spiritual bliss and development. It says outward ejaculation should only really occur when fertilization is intended. Heres the websitehttp://www.universal-tao.com/FAQ/healing_love.html. But don't quote me on any of this, do your research and test it out yourself, no knowledge can replace direct wisdom through experience

here is a great article I think that could really help your problem, he describes a method that could really be useful, I don't quite know if it is tantric, but might be related to tantric practices. It involves learning how to express the flow of energy upward through you body rather than out your genital. http://dreamhawk.com/relationship-sex/tiredness-after-sex/ Also Chunyi Lin describes this process also, but doesn't go into great detail how to achieve it. http://www.thetaobums.com/index.php?/topic/16067-interview-with-chunyi-lin-of-spring-forest-qigong/ He says that sex and orgasm can deplete qi, but also if done correctly, says " ,At the right level you can utilize the moment of orgasm to take that sexual energy and move it up through your heart and to your mind to develop "wisdom energy" which is very beneficial. So basicly sex can in fact be used to further develop one's chi by learning to control your orgasm. The first link I provided is descriptive and helpful for someone to achieve this. - best of luck

The old T.V show Kung-Fu with David Carradine is a complete classic that I absolutely loved watching when I was younger. It really shows how someone can be a warrior of true peace and compassion. I think this show really put the love of asian ideology into my subconscious and helped lead me to the path of internal alchemy along with continually trying to be a being of love and compassion. Also the Dragon Ball and DBZ series are not only super fun to watch lol, but also have very cool depictions of chi power, energy development, meditation, connectedness with the universe and more. I personally found that together, both these fun shows helped shape my belief on spirituality and without them, I might not be writing on the Tao Bums forum right now. Interesting thought isn't it

Thanks everyone for the great responses . I think i'm starting to get a feel for both of these amazing religions. I found a good article just addressing enlightenment using taoism and tibetan buddhist philosophies. http://www.sacredtransformation.com/article2.html My link

I would say i understand the just of buddhism, however i cannot say the same for Taoism. Does Taoism have a similar ideology of reincarnation and a system of karma similar to buddhism? What are the main defining characteristics of Taoism that set it apart from Buddhism? Also is neigong usually associated with taoist energy practices, while qigong is usually buddhist? Also I would be grateful if someone could describe in their own words a definition of qi, jing, and shen. Is one enlightened once these three are in perfect balance and have reached their full potential? Are these three concepts a from Taoism?