strawdog65

Hi Joeblast! I watched the video. It changes nothing. It is just further evidence of a sickness of the mind, that exists within our culture because of an inability to think outside of the box we are told to remain within. Rights are what the society determines them to be, nothing more. The reason that everyone would have a right to food, shelter, and education is because the value of the Human being within the society will have been changed. How we value Human life dictates how we appropriate "rights". When talking about an entirely new form of society, it makes sense to leave your own preconceptions of what was before, at the door. What say you? If we are starting something new, why would we apply the failures of the past to this new paradigm? Doesn't make much sense does it? It is the ignorance of saying food, shelter, and education are not rights to anyone unless they earn them, that highlights why our world is so messed up right now. There is no hope for any future society that does not elevate ALL of its people. A world society must treat all Humans with worth and value. Just because we in our present society have placed education, food, and shelter only into the hands of those that can pay, does not mean it is a concept that is of use in the future. Especially when it is counter productive to our survival. There will be no monetary system. Machines and technology will supply the labor. There will be NO THING to pay for because all will be given and shared freely. Money and the monetary system is a construct, and nothing more. It is a closed mind that does not see the illusion of how we now live our lives, without also understanding we are the arbiters of change. You and I.

Hi Sunya! I wanted to thank you for seeing this idea of the Venus Project with such clarity and honest hope for the future of our race. I realize that because we are all individuals coming from different frames of reference, and this Idea may be abhorrent and scary to many people, because the change would be so great compared to the world of today. You get what I got from this Idea... it is an incredible inspiration! It gives me hope that an idea may be able to change the world for the better, after all. Sunya, thank you for helping me to provide answers to the critics. Those that focus their minds on always finding fault, and feeding negativity do so at the risk of never seeing the possibilities that exist to an optimist. I choose to be an optimist. Peace to you Sunya!

HI Manitou! I think that the greatest comfort to me is the knowledge that even if all were to end this very second, it would only mean that we are all only returning to our source. There was no beginning.... and there will be no end... only Transformation. Peace!

I love hot oatmeal. Plump raisins, walnuts all peeled, Steaming spoon, Yummy!

Michael, I understand that both you and Joeblast are genuine in your concerns. And this is a great thing, it shows me that you are both people that believe in what is true to you with much conviction. People like yourselves will be important to the success of any future society. I know you are both meaning well by your disdain for an Idea you feel is a sham, or wasted effort because you feel that the same players will end up having control of whatever system the future will bring, but is that enough of a reason to kill an Idea that has the promise of changing the world for the better? The reality is there is much technological work to be accomplished. As well as more technology to be discovered. Technological hurdles are something we can work out. The sociological issues are more of a concern to me. It is true that there is the belief that mankind will have to come to the brink before change is expected. But when has mankind ever willingly changed? I think there is quite a precedent for unwillingness to change being met with no choice in the matter. Advancement in all things arrives of it's own accord, and so to is true of the next step in world society. Can anyone say that vast and sweeping changes will not occur? Maybe in our lifetimes. Nothing is going to happen overnight, or even quickly, without the incentive of us having no other choice, because it will mean the survival of the Human race. When it is survival, why would these ideas not be allowed to be given a chance to work? Anything like the Venus Project happening is a long ways off for us. But that may not be the case of generations to come. What other options would you bring to the table? Do you believe that the monetary system and the socio-economic structure that we exist within now, is the path of the future? How are we as a society not culpable for the failures within our society? And why would we not change things for the better for everyone? I personally believe that we as the dominant controlling race of this planet, can and should do better than we currently do in taking care of this world and all of the life upon it. We have to think big and we have to start somewhere.

JB, Before attempting to tear something apart, you should have at least read the information. Then you would have had a lot of your concerns and questions already answered. Negativity is the easy way. I have yet to hear from you an alternate/ better Idea then the Venus project presents. Critics are a dime a dozen, but having a new vision is beyond price.

Strange reality, Knowing our time is so short, Dew drops, on green leaves.

Sleep with the fishes, Mr. Limpett is calling, Audio sonar.

Hi Michael! Let me just say something first before continuing. I really appreciate you taking an active role in this discussion, it helps to flesh out what is being presented, and I thank you for your interest. In post #46 you said that "it dances around the power" Which to me alluded to asking who has the power. Which is everyone. I know there is a lot to read, but there are also videos and other presentations of designs and interviews with Jacque Fresco. It is difficult to have a detailed conversation about the Venus Project without the same frame of reference to draw from when we speak. Many of the points you are making about who would work and who would be lazy, and money and the societal change that would take form, are answered in the Essay and other presentations. We are talking about a societal change that would take place when the world will have reached it's breaking point and there would then be no other choice. A complete failure of the world-wide infrastructure in place now, would be the beginning of something like the Venus project becoming a reality. It is a model for what do we do next? By no means is it a model where people will say " yeah I want to give up all my things and stop being a completely selfish ass, and go live in a communal society where the good of the many is actually the driving force". Almost no one living in todays world will want to give up their "stuff". But we can not continue to live and waste and have no concern for the people of the world, it is a system of living that is destructive. We have only been able to do this to this point because the numbers of people and resources have been in our favor to be wasteful and callous of others. We are quickly approaching a new era in our history of the world, new thinking, new models of future society will be needed to deal with the population and limited resources. This is what the Venus Project is. Would I join? Yes I would. I would be honored to be part of something so incredible. My attachment to "stuff" is less important than something of such great importance. And I believe that there are many who would agree with me. Life isn't about "stuff" it IS about having a connection to what you believe is of value. I believe this project has great value. Your assertion that capitalism has helped with poverty... is false. Do some research on the World Bank, and see what capitalism has done to the poor people of the world, it's just slavery to the monetary system. Capitalism has NO regard for humanity or Human rights whatsoever. It is a mistake to look at what individuals have done to help the poor, and chock it up to good ole' Capitalism. Especially when the capability to help the poor of the world is underused, and devalued. Education, along with food and shelter are what holds all people back. We must change the attitude that things need to be "earned". This only makes sense in a society that values money over Human life and suffering. When people are treated with dignity and respect by understanding that basic Human rights are more than philosophical words, but are in fact things that are minimums to the life and growth of all people as individuals within the society. Thats when it becomes obvious how the monetary system has perverted what is acceptable and right. Profit and greed are what stands in the way of feeding, educating, and making sure all people have a place to live. Removing the monetary system, removing the idea that nothing is worth doing unless there is a profit to be made, would go a long way towards understanding and valuing Human life. The question about the Tampon factory is a funny one. Especially since it totally ignores the ideas being presented. Machines and technology would almost remove man from all menial and purely physical labor work. But then if you had taken the time to actually read and comprehend what is being presented, i don't think we would be discussing this so much. The Venus project is something totally new.

Sisyphean turds, Tumbling downhill into dust, Tart, strawberry field.

Hey Michael! Thanks for showing more interest and asking questions. I think it's great that you are doing something real and measurable to help people in Africa. That is a positive, useful contribution. I can not claim to be doing anything like that at all. Actually I am doing nothing like you. I am just a humble, average man taking a stand on a subject that I honestly believe in, and would like to have others find out what got me so excited about it. I choose to be optimistic with what has been presented, because I see that it is an easy path to take being negative and rationalizing negativity with being a "realist".. No I have not done anything like you, but then I'm also not interested in proving that I am having to do anything other then what comes natural to me as the person I am. I also have no need to say... look at me, look and see what I have done. I just endeavor to treat the people in my life equally well, regardless of their differences from myself, on a daily basis. My practice is not as measurable as what you have taken on, but it is none the less very challenging. I do think you are missing the important points I was attempting to make with my comments about rights. Adhering to a view because it is within your experience and not being open to a new view is very shortsighted. Rights are what we decide they should be, there are no rules other than that. If we as a future society decide that an education is a right of all people word-wide, where is the issue? Isn't a lack of an education a major contributing factor in people resorting to a life of crime? Wouldn't more education help? Isn't a better educated society beneficial to everyone? I fail to see the negative in what I'm saying. As far as the right to live comment, Was that an attempt at sarcasm? When we make comments like saying that food and shelter are not rights, this shows an ignorance of why they should be rights to everyone. It is the basic necessities of life, like food, shelter, and education, that shape the society. When these are denied to people they are justifiably malcontent. A more Humanistic society would naturally see that these are innate rights to all Human beings Because they determine how the people within the society are able to contribute to that society. If something is beneficial then what is the downside of what is being said? An educated society is better suited to take care of their world, and see the "realism" in cooperation for the greater good. Our world, our society, our leaders, have it all wrong. Many of the issues within society are rooted in the differences between the people who "have" and the people who "have not". Education is a big part of this problem. Education should be available at no cost to everyone. The hoarding of education and knowledge in general helps to hinder the real advancement of people world-wide. We are all stuck on the monetary system idea! Money is a creation. It is not the only workable economic model. It is a hard concept to get your mind around, I am still trying to fully comprehend it. As Taoists, is part of our Human nature to be selfish and not care for others? As Taoists, is not the benefit to the world also a benefit to ourselves? As Taoists, what care should we have about costs and money? I ask because I see a lot of concern for the "reality" of what is being proposed, but I see very little of the Sage mentality in being selfish and callous. As Taoists is disdain and incredulity for new ideas common? I am not understanding the animosity. You ask about who has the power? Let me ask you... if this is a concern to you Michael, who has the power right now? Can you honestly say? I doubt that anyone of us know , or could tell any of us who actually has the power that controls world events. Is this even actually knowable? The hands of power are never seen, only the puppets are seen, by us the ignorant observers. It does not really matter, because we are talking about a hypothetical future society, and to talk about it now as though we can sort this mess out without taking into consideration what will be happening at that future time is an exercise in futility. The power will be in the hands of whomever the governing body decides it should be, which would be decided based upon what was transpiring at that future point in time. (see what I mean? sounds ridiculous, doesn't it? talking about something before it is possible because it's a future event.) It seems that the idea of people being free to learn and contribute based on their individual attributes is somehow irritating to your personal philosophy. Why is this? Could you please explain your point of view? Michael, did you actually take the time to read the essay and go to the Venus Project site? I am having difficulty with the animosity I am perceiving from the words you wrote. What reason is there for animosity and distrust of Ideas being presented by a man who is now going to be 93 years old? Jacque Fresco's ideas are incredibly inspirational, this man has no concerns for power or our money. I think a better look at the website, with a more open mind would help to elucidate some of these feelings of undeserved animosity. You are entitled to your own opinion of anything at all. But, perpetuating negativity is not advisable as a source of inspiration.

Thanks Immortal4life! Those look like shows I will have to watch! Thanks for the links! peace!

Prana in top coat, On his way down to Puna, Dung beetle struggles.

The "rights" of a society are determined by the actions of a society. The rights you have listed make a nice bumper sticker. Because they are considered to be of irrefutable importance they are considered rights. All Human beings have a right to live and not starve, especially when there are food stores going bad because there is no profit to be made. All Human beings have a right to shelter from the elements, and with such, a restored respect for the human condition. All Human beings have a right to be educated so that they can contribute to their society, and live meaningful lives. How can anyone honestly say that an education is not an obvious innate right to any Human being? This "rights" thing is a perfect example of the type of thinking that separates people all over the world. How can anyone of conscience elevate some people with education while turning a blind eye to the rest? We as a society dictate what is a right and not. Obviously we are not doing our best to elevate everyone to a standard where they are able to make the best contribution they can to society, and in fact we are actively holding people back by not seeing this. Joeblast, you can't honestly believe that human beings have no innate rights to live and be alive and be educated and contribute to society? Can you? Do you not see the shortsightedness of this attitude? How many future Einstein's need to starve and die young and uneducated because of the attitude that an education is not an innate right to all? Do you not see it?

Hi Joeblast! Thanks for showing more interest! I appreciate all you've said and they are all very valid concerns and do error on the side of not taking any risks, but you are missing a vital element of what is being proposed. This would be a society without a profit based, greed based, monetary system of any kind. By world cooperation and understood consensus, all humans would have the innate right to food, shelter, education, there would be no askance of anything other than our contribution to the society by means of whatever our aptitude and abilities we possess. By todays society and monetary system... this is not only unheard of, it is quite literally incomprehensible to many people, because it is so far outside of what they have lived their lives within all their lives long. I do not believe this is going to happen of it's own accord. I do believe it will be something that happens after war and suffering on a world-wide scale, and it will be something that is our last chance before the descent into chaos and a loss of the technology we now possess. For a society to not do something because of "price" is ridiculous. Money is a manufactured part of our myopic society, it only has value because we agree to it. Services, food, skilled workers, people of innate and learned ability, these are of true value. When a society sees that existence is not something that should ever be denied because there is no profit in it, thats when society will understand that the value of life is beyond any manufactured price. To remove desire and greed, we must have compassion to take care of everyone because we can, not because there is profit to be made. Peace!

Kay Sa rah Sa rah, whatever will be, will be..... I am suprised by the apathy with which these ideas are being met. Are you all so comfortable inside your little bubbles of existence that you just don't care about anything else? I am totally with the idea of "living life now" and being in the moment. It is how I go thru my everyday, not focusing on anything but what is right here before me, and accomplishing what needs to be done because it is whats needed right at that moment. I know many of you will say whatever will be will be, just like the song quoted above, by Doris Day. But do you really feel such apathy for what the future holds and what direction it takes? The post about Wiki Leaks seems to be a one with a lot of people interested in holding people accountable, and getting to the bottom of conspiracies behind that mess. Do you all not see that we as a world, are constantly being manipulated by our societies and governments? There is no longer any country that has true independence. We are all very reliant our other countries to supply us with the things that we so desperately need to buy to keep up with the jones's. We have become materialistic Pigs, all feeding at the very same trough, all worshiping the very same principles of greed and scarcity that keep us in the bonds of slavery that we insist is not true. No one living within any society anywhere in this world is truly "free". The very act of living within something dictates the very limitations of our bondage. Only those who have left this material plane of existence are free from it. So face up to the fact that You and I and everyone else we know on this planet, is not free. Because we are not free, and will never be free we should try and do what we can to make changes to improve existence for everyone. The Venus project is more than just "pie in the sky" if you really grasp what is being said. We live within a system that manufactures scarcity to inflate prices and create profit for the ones controlling our society. Is it not obvious that as the world population explodes, we will reach a point where the excesses / luxury of the wealthy, mean by necessity death to the poor? A scarcity based world economy, cares not for people living or dying. It's only care is one of manipulating the price/value of said product to create wealth for the proprietor of said product. This manipulation is accomplished thru, production and non-production. Just like OPEC does controlling the amount of oil that is produced so as to keep the prices inflated to continue the profits for those that are part of OPEC. So too is this true of manufactures and suppliers of food and resources world-wide. If there is no profit to be made then why produce anything at all? Cut back production, create scarcity, drive up prices and then slowly produce to the now inflated demand. A vicious, callous cycle that is demeaning to the value of human life and suffering. It is a crime against humanity when starvation, and suffering is permitted to continue in the name of profit.

Hi Sunya! I know what you mean! I feel like I'm having to fan this small little flame so that it will be noticed before it goes out! The incredible concepts that are the Venus Project are really mind changing. I always thought to myself, isn't there a better way to live and have a society then what we have now? I always thought about it, but the concept of an economy based on world resources and NO money system just blows me away! There was a comment made about someone watching too much Star Trek, in regards to this idea, and I have to say, if the Star Trek comment was meant to be a slight... it's not! What's wrong with a Star Trek form of government? I don't think people realize the ground breaking nature of what a world based on the ideas being presented, would be like. It is very exciting to think that the human race is able to become something more than materialistic and greedy. That we have the seed of great societal change looking us in the face, and all we have to do is be receptive to it. I will keep trying to bring some awareness of this to TTB and hope for the best! At the very least I have reached one person ... You Sunya, and together we can spread what we know. Sometimes things take time. Peace!

Hello Everyone! Isn't the shallowness of the view that we are whatever country we are born into and what language we speak, and the color of our skin, an obvious shortcoming of a mind that does not fully see the reality of it's existence? Can we not preserve our cultural gifts and still come to an agreement that this is a shared world, and as such we are all part of it, equally? What is the next step in the natural progression of a world society if not a one world government? Can anyone honestly say that they continue to see the present form of government succeeding in the future? I think that we are obligated to change how we perceive this world and the thinking of the people populating it, and realize that we must eventually reconcile our desire for separation with the actuality of us all being connected to each other, and needing each other. If the thought process of identifying with a country, or a belief system could be altered to identifying with our entire world, would we not see people differently? Imagine no countries, imagine one world, with one people that understand and grasp that they are brothers and sisters only separated by the thoughts they believe to be true, which are not. As long as people of all countries, ethnicities, and belief systems focus on what our differences are, we will never know peace. It will take the shift in consciousness that we are a one world community, with billions of individuals making up the whole, and that we are all children of planet earth. When population reaches the point of resources not being able to support the people of the world, that's when there will be change. There are resources available to be shared. The issue with sharing resources is that there is no profit to be made in helping others unless they can pay. So resources, food, oil, technology, sit and are not used unless someone is making a profit. This type of world economy will become unworkable in the near future. A profit based economy is a symptomatic of the lack of regard for life and stewardship we have for our planet. It will lead to more war and ultimately planetary destruction. The way out is for us to change. Technology will be the key to this change, machines will eventually remove man from the work place, it is inevitable. Once machines take over the work place what next? This isn't as far fetched as you may think, the progression has been and will continue to be work that has been done by mankind, will continue to taken up by machines and computers. Man will become obsolete as a physical means of getting things done. This is when it gets interesting. Repurposing mankind: what will we do with all the people? People will need purpose. How about them working for the good and betterment of the world we share? When you eliminate working for profit, you enable people to share their gifts for what they are good at, freely. One world, One people, One future together. Peace!

Balloons like static Happy, clingy, faces, smile. Pop! goes the weasel.

Part 7 By: Jacque Fresco/ The Venus Project The Venus Project The Venus Project is an organization that is founded on the ideas, designs, and direction presented here. It represents many years of research and dedication on the part of its originator and Project Director, Jacque Fresco. Its 25-acre research and design center is located in Venus, Florida where the future is taking shape today. The function of The Venus Project is to design, develop, and prepare plans for the construction of an experimental city based on the -principles outlined above. Here we have constructed nine experimental buildings, are developing alternative energy systems, city designs, transportation, manufacturing systems, and more. In support of this research we are creating blueprints, renderings, and models, holding seminars, producing books, videos, and other written material to introduce people to the aims of The Venus Project. The Venus Project is in the process of introducing a set of values and procedures that may enable us to achieve social transformation. The Venus Project will provide the designs and blueprints for a prototype community to test the validity of its social proposals and to establish a permanent planning center that could be used for future short-term and long-term project planning. It also proposes a relevant orientation for people to be able to adapt intellectually and emotionally to our new technological age. Anything short of overall social design would be inappropriate and far less effective. Our proposals will be submitted to the general public and all educational institutions, and we invite their participation. If enough people find the proposals acceptable and choose to join with us in this new advocacy, this could help to form the nucleus of an organization to further the aims of The Venus Project. The circular configurations of the new cities as proposed by The Venus Project are not merely stylized architectural conceptualizations, but are the results of years of research to provide an environment that would best serve the needs of the occupants in an efficient and economical manner. Without sufficient knowledge of the symbiotic interrelationship between humanity and the environment, it would be extremely difficult to develop workable solutions to our many problems. In the planning of this new city The Venus Project has taken this and many other factors into careful consideration and study. This new experimental city would be devoted to working towards the aims and goals of The Venus Project, which are: 1. Conserving all the world's resources as the common heritage of all of the Earth's people. 2. Transcending all of the artificial boundaries that separate people. 3. Evolving from a monetary-based economy to a resource-based world economy. 4. Reclaiming and restoring the natural environment to the best of our ability. 5. Redesigning our cities, transportation systems, and agricultural and industrial plants so that they are energy efficient, clean, and conveniently serve the needs of all people. 6. Evolving towards a cybernated society that can gradually outgrow the need for all political local, national, and supra-national governments as a means of social management. 7. Sharing and applying all of the new technologies for the benefit of all nations. 8. Using clean, renewable energy sources such as wind, solar, geothermal, and tidal power, etc. 9. Ultimately utilizing the highest quality products for the benefit of all the world's people. 10. Requiring environmental impact studies prior to construction of any mega-projects. 11. Encouraging the widest range of creativity and incentive toward constructive endeavor. 12. Assisting in stabilizing the world's population through education and voluntary birth-control to conform to the carrying capacity of the earth. 13. Outgrowing nationalism, bigotry and prejudice through education. 14. Eliminating any type of elitism, technical or otherwise. 15. Arriving at methodologies by careful research rather than random opinions. 16. Enhancing communication in the new schools so that our language and education is relevant to the physical conditions of the world around us. 17. Providing not only the necessities of life but also offering challenges that stimulate the mind, emphasizing individuality rather than uniformity. 18. Finally, preparing people intellectually and emotionally for the possible changes that lie ahead. Like all other innovative social proposals, it starts out with a few devoted people that dedicate their time to informing others of the humane benefits of this new direction. People are invited to participate in whatever capacity they can to help carry out the initial design phases of this new experimental city. An interdisciplinary team of systems engineers, computer programmers, architects, city planners, sociologists, psychologists, educators and the like would also be needed. The design of The Venus Project does not regard environmental conditions as fixed or static. We must allow for adaptation and change within the system as a continuous process. This would avoid the tendency to perpetuate temporary arrangements beyond their period of usefulness. The circular city proposed by The Venus Project would be a transitional phase and could evolve from a semi-cooperative money-oriented society to a full resource-based economy. This could be the prototype for a series of new cities to be constructed in various places throughout the world. The rate of progression will depend upon the availability of funds raised during the early stages and the people who identify, participate, and support the aims and direction of The Venus Project. As these new communities develop and become more widely accepted, they may very well form the basis of a new civilization, preferably through the process of evolution rather than revolution. We are well aware that no one can actually foretell the shape of the future. We can only extrapolate on present information and trends. Population growth, technological change, worldwide environmental conditions, and available resources are the primary criteria for future projections. We are also aware that there is no single philosophy or point of view -- religious, political, scientific, or ideological -- that someone would not take issue with. We feel certain, however, that the only aspects of The Venus Project that may appear threatening are those that others project into it. The Venus Project is neither Utopian, nor Orwellian, nor does it reflect the dreams of impractical idealists. Instead, it presents attainable goals requiring only the intelligent application of what we already know. The only limitations are those we impose upon ourselves. The Venus Project does not advocate dissolving the existing free-enterprise system. We believe it will eventually evolve towards a resource-based society of common heritage in due course. All that The Venus Project offers is an alternative approach for your consideration. It is not possible in this short writing to present the precise methodology and operation of a global resource based economy. We encourage you to become better informed about the proposals of this project through our books, videos, lectures and seminars. If you identify with this direction, we welcome you to join with us and work towards its realization. Comments? Please take a moment to visit The Venus Project website. It's our future, it's our world, it's up to us to make the change. Peace!