JustARandomPanda

Creepy stuff can be stirred up by any deep practice. Let me show a stark example of creepy sh** that Taoist Internal Alchemy (if it's really good) stirs up: The stuff DNB is posting is not "unique" to Enochian Magick or Western mystery traditions. It's universal simply cause it's universal to people. If prajna is not cultivated - whether Eastern or Western - you're gonna be in trouble. Here's some Inner Alchemy (the first of the 3 Hermetic Disciplines) that can stir up creepy stuff too. In fact...it is the outer shell counterpart to the practice detailed in the book above. If you are able to tangibly feel and sense your auric shells it's possible to do MCO style sweeps on them too. But how many people have you met where this is a daily part of their practice? Not many I'll bet. You have to have a very deep level of both prajna and compassion before you start doing something like that. Plus your body has to be hot and ready to burn because you'll be opening yourself up to deep influences far beyond anything that's from the standard "subconscious" when you do it. If you don't have major prajna and compassion realizations then doing Enochian magick is likely to give the less "creepy" results than the practices from BKF's bagua book.

Inner Smile is awesome. I've always found it much easier to do than Secret Smile although I imagine both of them together would be a powerful punch for mental and emotional health.

Next exercise: This is a (highly modified and simplified) exercise inspired by the copius exercises in the Nowicki book. Visualization and Deletion training: I plan to do this at least 4 days a week for the next 3 months. I'll make space on my Chalkboard for it. Would be glad to hear if others would like to join in and we compare notes. I'm also going to try to scrape up the money to get the stuff to do the Scrying, etc exercises DNB has posted. Anyway..here's my contribution: Go to a store like Michael's or Hobby Lobby and buy the following: 1. A foam or wooden sphere. 2. A bottle of cheap craft acrylic paint if you do not already own any (white, red, blue, yellow). 3. A strip of craft wood and a bottle of Gorilla Glue or acrylic molding/modeling paste 4. Glue the sphere to the wood plank with either the Gorilla Glue or acrylic molding/modeling paste. Now... A. In a quiet place in your room set the wood plank with sphere in front of you. Focus on the sphere for approximately 1 minute. (see Note at the end of this post explaining yet another use you can use this Sphere for). As you gain experience the time spent on each stage will lengthen. B. Close your eyes and see this sphere in your mind's eye. Try to make the sphere as 3 dimensional and solid as you possibly can and hold it in your mind's eye for another minute. Now open your eyes and compare how "solid" and "colorful" your mind's eye sphere was to the sphere in front of you. Rate your visualization "solidness" and "colorfulness" on a scale of one to ten with one being exceedingly vague and hazy (almost not there) to ten - just as rock solid and colorful as the sphere on the plank sitting out there in front of you. Record this rating in a log book. Next step. After 3 weeks of doing the above exercise add the following step. This next step is *very* important btw because if you DO ever decide to craft your own Tulpa - this is a step that may well be one that can save your butt from any surprise, unwanted "hostile" or "negative" entities like what David-Neel experienced. C. De-materialize the sphere in your mind's eye step-by-step. Make the de-materialization as 3D as you possibly can. You are sending the sphere back to Neutral, Undifferentiated Space. Again...open your eyes. Compare to the "real-world" sphere and give it a rating in your log book. Note: This gazing at an object has a long history in Meditation training in its own right. In Buddhism it's known as Kasina training and the idea is to see how long and steady you can gaze at the object before your eyes (and thus attention) wander. I did this for a year by gazing at a large beach pebble on a wood tv dinner tray lit only by soft candlelight. After 3 months the pebble began to acquire a distinct bright pink aura. I was not practicing to "make" the pink aura happen. It happened spontaneously. I'm still not sure what the significance of a pink aura is. If anyone knows I'm itching to find out. Basically the exercise listed above IS Kasina training in every way with the exception being that the focus is placed on building/dematerializing the mental image as concretely as you can rather than how long one can focus on it before the mind wanders (although eventually it does become precisely that as the time spent on each stage lengthens). Eventually you can extend the stages and higher levels of Kasina don't need any external support at all. Here is a far more detailed exercise in Kasina than I gave above. Notice that someone highly trained in Kasina can get to the 2nd Jhana - that is, one of the 4 states (something - alas - I have never achieved). So the above exercise can also be good for training in serenity meditation. Higher levels (beyond the 2nd Jhana if I recall correctly) are said to be better served by switching to shamatha or anapana meditation on the breath. However, I feel Kasina is still useful in its own right because not only does it lead to up to 2nd Jhana but (unlike with breath meditation only) that skill crosses over to be useful for working with thought-forms, elementals, etc.

Here is a bit of theory in Magick. This info and exercise comes from Dolores Ashcroft-Nowicki (of the Western mystery school Servants of the Light) and can be found in the book Magickal Use of Thought Forms. ***** . Second entry: Desire

Magick needs generative life force. Here is a proven method for raising one's generative force (jing for all you Taoists) quickly. This is geared toward women but men have had just as much success using it. For this Exercise you need several things. Witch's book The Orgasmic Diet Also get and take daily: Very high load purified Fish Oil capsules (1,400 - 1,700 kg depending upon your weight - this is equivalent to eating wild-caught fatty Omega 3 loaded fish like salmon 2x a week). Zone Labs is one brand that makes these high load fish oil capsules. I take Life Extension's fish oil capsules because it's combined with sesame lignan extract. Scientific studies show that sesame lignan potentates and extends the lifespan of the fish oil in one's bloodstream. More bang for the same buck. You could also substitute Krill Oil (aka Marine Oil) as long as it has the required amount of DHA/EPA. 1/2 oz of dark chocolate 1 multivitamin 1 vitamin C tablet (or a glass of orange juice) 777 mg calcium 270 mg magnesium 4-7 mg zinc 2 milk thistle capsules (my own addition, it's not in Witch's book) - the reason is that Milk Thistle has been shown scientifically to help rejuvenate the kidneys - which according to TCM stores jing. Anything that aids your kidneys is something I think is helpful when it comes to building up and storing more generative force. Perform 25 - 50 kegels while focusing one's attention (concentration meditation) at one's cervix (for women) or perineum (for men) Cut out all foods or drinks that are a stimulant. This is important. Stimulants like gingseng and caffeine will obliterate the gains made from the other supplements. Diet: 30% protein (meat, diary, vegetables and fish), 30% fats (monosaturated fasts, such as olive oil and saturated fats such as dairy , meat and poultry), 40% or less carbohydrates, avoiding starchy ones ( white bread, potatoes). Every few days, you will need to take 27mg of iron (as a tablet) if you are not menopausal or have some other contra-indicative medical condition. For women who really want to develop generative energy to a very high degree you should also invest in Gyneflex vaginal weights. Think of them as miniature for your yoni. For me it took about 6 weeks to gain any results whatsoever. Most women do not take that long though (I was a hard case...). However...once it kicked in it kicked in hard core. Using the above protocol you will develop the power house needed for magick work as well as any other inner alchemy practices you may be doing.

More practical advice: Begin practicing 'deletion' of whatever visualization or other sensory-based training you are making. I do White Skeleton meditation and deletion is one of it's main components. Perhaps DNB or Theurgy can share a deletion or dissolving practice for Western mystery practicers. Also gotta make a plug here for Yuen Method because it's MAIN practice is all about deletion and neutrality. Combined with the Liao Fan log, or dissolving practices like with BKF's Energy Gates it makes a powerful punch. Edit: Also want to plug the following 2 books. Train Your Brain, Engage Your Heart by Amit Sood (Thank you Scotty for turning me on to this wonderful book!) The Four Immeasurables: Practices to Open the Heart by B. Alan Wallace

Interesting...first it's claimed that Taoist Alchemy practicers are the "do, don't talk" people since studying spiritual practice takes time away from actual practice. Then it's claimed that Westerners are too different from the Taoist Alchemy practicers because Western Tradition folks rush into practice rather than examining it carefully first. I don't agree with the assertion that Western ways of practicing are "too different" from Taoist practicing. Taobums History shows plenty of people have hurt themselves from forcing MCO plus having all kinds of weird "entity" experiences or "hostile naga" experiences from doing Taoist Alchemy practices. Alexandra David-Neel deliberately created a Thought-form entity (a little monk) who though at first was friendly eventually became hostile. She had to dissolve him later because of this. So that's both Taoist practices and Buddhist practices that also have negative experiences within spiritual traditions. It's not something exclusive to Western mystery traditions. My PRACTICAL Advice (especially if you are worried about the above): In addition to the beginner Western Tradition practices you should begin the following in lock-step with these exercises (if you aren't doing so already). Note: I picked these ideas up from Liao Fan's Four Lessons. For a more home-grown Western version you can also read Benjamin Franklin's autobiography and discover he did the exact same thing as Liao Fan. 1. Buy a blank notebook. Divide the page into three columns. On the first column write Virtue. On the second write Vice. On the third write Good Deeds. Now begin practicing Confucius' Golden Rule - Do not do to others what you would not want them to do to you. Say this Confucian Rule several times through out the day (either silently or out loud) for the next few weeks at least. 2. Begin doing 1- 4 Good Deeds per day above and beyond what you normally are accustomed to doing. Example: If you have a habit of not walking your dog begin walking your dog daily. That counts. 2nd example: Buy a bag of bird seed and go feed some birds - especially in winter time when food is scarce. Do this daily PRIOR to taking your own meal. This also counts. Place a hashmark, asterisk or some other notation in the Good Deed column of your log book for each specific deed you performed. 3. At the end of the day review your actions. For every behavior that was the acting out of a vice put a mark in the vice column. For every situation that came up that day where virtue prevailed put a mark in the virtue column. Do this every single day. The advantage of the above system is that over time you will see a marked reduction of the tendency to give into your vices. Especially the one(s) you have the most trouble abstaining from when circumstances arise that make it easy to repeat your old vice tendencies. You'll also have a log tracking your good deeds. This is better than relying solely on gut feeling that one is increasingly practicing virtue. The log makes it possible to actually see that you are training in improved conduct - both internally and externally. In addition to the above you may want to add something new to your daily meditation practice. A specific meditation devoted solely to Loving-Kindness. There are several available. Some Sufi, some Buddhist, some Hindu, etc. But the tradition the practice comes from is not the point since no spiritual tradition can claim loving-kindness is exclusive to it alone. As a side note: I have done (still do) the above myself. Although I actually bought and mounted a chalkboard on one of my walls and every day I put a mark under the various columns having to do with my assorted spiritual/alchemy practices of which I consider morality to be the foundation of it all. I have a visible track record showing what I practiced that day, where I slacked off and were I fell short of manifesting virtue. BTW - without practicing virtue you can forget about being a Mage, Sage or Buddha.

Found an interesting essay by Sam Harris and his take on Buddhism and Buddhist meditation. Killing the Buddha

Very nice Aaron! I am discovering this truth more and more in my life daily as well.

Decided to cross-post a post I made in another thread for information purposes here (I also edited that other post with additional info). Anyway....for informational purposes: ******************* The Traditional Western Astrological Theurge group is run by Christopher Warnock ;and is called Spiritus Mundi. I have only ever submitted 3 posts to the group in the entire year I've been a member since Warnock pre-approves all posts before allowing them to go out to the group and archives. He runs a tight ship. The flame wars, ridicule, etc so common at TTB simply doesn't happen on Spiritus Mundi. Despite this (probably even *because of* this) the mail list is quite lively. It makes it tough on a beginner like me because the majority of participants are experienced Traditional Astrologers (Quick Edit: NOT MODERN Astrology - Warnock will not approve posts that use Modern Astrology - SM is ONLY for pre-1700 Astrology) with decades of astrological and theurgic practice and a lot of the time I can't make heads or tails of what they're discussing. Only this past month - after spending an entire month on half of a chapter discussing Essential Dignities/Debilities [using rote memorization, plus daily home-made flashcards, plus a blank notebook for my own notes, astrological artwork and graphics, - and after all of that still didn't understand it well enough so ended up getting a book dedicated to that topic alone] on various pointers about them - have I been able to get an inkling of what some of the posts that mention this point (ie dignities/debilities) are saying in regards to it's importance to theurgic magic, rituals and talismanic consecration. If these things do not interest you then don't join the group. You'll find the discussions boring. Oh...Warnock seldom approves beginner questions. And if he does it's because within that question is something that even advanced practicers will find beneficial to discuss. On the upside - if you are willing to teach yourself Traditional Astrology for mundane and spiritual growth (since ultimately the latter is to transform or "realize" the former) - this means you'll see things discussed of an advanced nature (not the kind of stuff one typically sees in free-for-all forums like...say...Taobums). Imagine how the information on Taobums might change if it were run the same way? To give you a demonstration of what Warnock's group would do. 1. Let's say you discover the following consecration magic on someone's blog: Yin Yang Elixir: -Holy Grail- You have all the instructions now from this blog for this consecrated/charged/imbued Yin Yang Elixer. But there is a way Spiritus Mundi people will 'crank the Elixir to 11' (cheesy ref to Spinal Tap, yall). Before you begin you make an astrological chart to find out the very best time frame to create the Yin Yang Elixer (Electional Astrology). This way not only will YOUR intent/will, chi, shen, whatever, etc imbue and consecrate the Elixir but so will that of the Planetary aspects of the Tao when THEY are at their very best for this particular activity - You know, "As Above, So Below" (over and above what is provided by the person's own practices and virtue). You are tapping into the "practices and virtues" of the Heavenly Spheres and Mother Nature itself. Does that help make it more concrete what Spiritus Mundi (and Geomantic Campus too) practicers do? Since studying Traditional Astrology and joining this group I now...at long last...finally understand why Astrology was considered one of the three hermetic practices. It is nothing less than trying to "imbue" your life with the Tao and not only during those times when you are actually doing your practices and meditations. Those "ordinary" moments when you aren't practicing need attention and transformation too. Astrological Theury (and Astrological Theurgic Talismans, etc) is one way to do it. Ditto for Traditional Western Geomancy. I am also a member of a Traditional Western Geomancy mail list (also at Yahoo) called Geomantic Campus. Everything mentioned above about Spiritus Mundi applies equally to Geomantic Campus with the sole exception that I don't know who acts as the Pre-Post Approval Gatekeeper but I've come to the conclusion it is not Christopher Warnock (even though he is a member of that group too). John Michael Greer is a member of Geomantic Campus and frequent participant. It's possible Greer is the Post Gatekeeper for GC but that's just a guess.

Hmm...you do have a point there. Still...I have only been seriously looking into this stuff for about a year...less than that for the Theurgy part itself as that has only been *very* recent (like within the past month or so). But I guess I can share some of the things I've learned. A lot of what I will share will relate to Traditional Western Astrology and Geomancy (Hellenic/Medieval/Early Renaissance - I don't do modern at all) and Qigong practices. Ah yes. That is most likely the result of my daily Yuen Method practices I just started doing these past few weeks. It has "super-charged" my Qigong and Shamatha practices.

The Traditional Western Astrological Theurge group is run by Christopher Warnock ;and is called Spiritus Mundi. I have only ever submitted 3 posts to the group in the entire year I've been a member since Warnock pre-approves all posts before allowing them to go out to the group and archives. He runs a tight ship. The flame wars, ridicule, etc so common at TTB simply doesn't happen on Spiritus Mundi. Despite this (probably even *because of* this) the mail list is quite lively. It makes it tough on a beginner like me because the majority of participants are experienced Traditional Astrologers (Quick Edit: NOT MODERN Astrology - Warnock will not approve posts that use Modern Astrology - SM is ONLY for pre-1700 Astrology) with decades of astrological and theurgic practice and a lot of the time I can't make heads or tails of what they're discussing. Only this past month - after spending an entire month on half of a chapter discussing Essential Dignities/Debilities [using rote memorization, plus daily home-made flashcards, plus a blank notebook for my own notes, astrological artwork and graphics, - and after all of that still didn't understand it well enough so ended up getting a book dedicated to that topic alone] on various pointers about them - have I been able to get an inkling of what some of the posts that mention this point (ie dignities/debilities) are saying in regards to it's importance to theurgic magic, rituals and talismanic consecration. If these things do not interest you then don't join the group. You'll find the discussions boring. Oh...Warnock seldom approves beginner questions. And if he does it's because within that question is something that even advanced practicers will find beneficial to discuss. On the upside - if you are willing to teach yourself Traditional Astrology for mundane and spiritual growth (since ultimately the latter is to transform or "realize" the former) - this means you'll see things discussed of an advanced nature (not the kind of stuff one typically sees in free-for-all forums like...say...Taobums). Imagine how the information on Taobums might change if it were run the same way? To give you a demonstration of what Warnock's group would do. 1. Let's say you discover the following consecration magic on someone's blog: Yin Yang Elixir: -Holy Grail- You have all the instructions now from this blog for this consecrated/charged/imbued Yin Yang Elixer. But there is a way Spiritus Mundi people will 'crank the Elixir to 11' (cheesy ref to Spinal Tap, yall). Before you begin you make an astrological chart to find out the very best time frame to create the Yin Yang Elixer (Electional Astrology). This way not only will YOUR intent/will, chi, shen, whatever, etc imbue and consecrate the Elixir but so will that of the Planetary aspects of the Tao when THEY are at their very best for this particular activity - You know, "As Above, So Below" (over and above what is provided by the person's own practices and virtue). You are aligning into the "practices and virtues" of the Heavenly Spheres and Mother Nature itself. Does that help make it more concrete what Spiritus Mundi (and Geomantic Campus too) practicers do? Since studying Traditional Astrology and joining this group I now...at long last...finally understand why Astrology was considered one of the three hermetic practices. It is nothing less than trying to "imbue" your life with the Tao and not only during those times when you are actually doing your practices and meditations. Those "ordinary" moments when you aren't practicing need attention and transformation too. Astrological Theury (and Astrological Theurgic Talismans, etc) is one way to do it. Ditto for Traditional Western Geomancy. I am also a member of a Traditional Western Geomancy mail list (also at Yahoo) called Geomantic Campus. Everything mentioned above about Spiritus Mundi applies equally to Geomantic Campus with the sole exception that I don't know who acts as the Pre-Post Approval Gatekeeper but I've come to the conclusion it is not Christopher Warnock (even though he is a member of that group too). John Michael Greer is a member of Geomantic Campus and frequent participant. It's possible Greer is the Post Gatekeeper for GC but that's just a guess.

I can vouch for the latter for I am part of a mailing list that does exactly that even today! Basically they use Traditional Western Astrology (that is only the planets that can be seen with the naked eye and known since ancient times) to find the most auspicious times to consecrate talismans, perform rituals, blessings, etc. In other words...what is the absolute best time to align one's self with the Tao so as to get the most "bang for the buck" in elevating one's life circumstances and consciousness even after the ritual is over. There are two branches that can fit the bill depending on the spiritual seeker's need - Horary or Electional Astrology. After determining the best time he/she will invoke the planet's divine blessing (along with thanksgiving).

It began when ignorance first arose. Re-read the first few sections of the Hermetica where Poimanandres mentions this is so. It's virtually in complete agreement with Hinduism and Buddhism on this point. Accomplished Christian mystics also knew this to be truth.... "And the Light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not..." - John 1:5 (KJ Bible)

Well since DNB is back (and perhaps Theurgy eventually too) I'll bow out of this thread. If I post anything on the topic it will either be in the Articles section of TTB or my own PP Forum.

Yes, I've been familiar with Jason Miller for quite some time. He was involved in a back-and-forth post war last year with a bunch of materialist atheists who are fans of magazines like The Skeptic and the 4 Horsemen (ie...the New Atheists - Chris Hitchens, Daniel C. Dennett, Richard Dawkins and Sam Harris). He was the target of extensive ridicule and mockery by the oh-so-pragmatic-and-reasonable atheists (wow! Just like what goes on at Taobums! ) I'm grateful for his stuff but his works are not the only thing I draw from. Just to reassure a few folks I'm not a TOTAL noob at this stuff I can give a few examples of my interest in the topic: I'm a member of a mail list that focuses on traditional western astrology applied, another mail list on traditional western geomancy applied and have begun busily reading the writings of ancient authors *directly* rather than funneled solely through the explanations of modern day high profile western hermeticists (like Miller, Greer, Stavish, Warnock, etc). For example: Right now, rather than having other people tell me what Giordano Bruno believed and practiced I'm actually reading the works written by Bruno himself (currently it's The Expulsion of the Triumphant Beast - the work that condemned him in the Spanish Inquisition). Likewise the direct translations of the Persian Magicians Abu Ma'shar and al-Qabisi. I also own a copy of The Picatrix. Not the one listed on Amazon (Liber Atratus), but rather the rare red edition which is only printed when the moon is in the 7th mansion (Liber Rubeus - the Book of Blood) which teaches how to make a Divinitory Head (blood magic). Also own the new academic edition of Agrippa's First Book of the Occult. It's the first brand new translation (based on the Latin critical edition) since the original 18th century english translation. It has over 1000 footnotes and referenced citations (so you can read Agrippa's sources yourself as well). It was translated by guys who read Latin fluently *and* are decades long practitioners of traditional western astrology and hermetic magic - something the 18th century translator was not. So the portions of Agrippa's work that deal with traditional astrology, astrological correspondences and astrological theurgy have now been restored to the meaning Agrippa himself meant. I'm teaching myself traditional western astrology via the books On the Heavenly Spheres and A Practical Guide to Traditional Astrology. Anyone who thinks traditional western astrology is a load of shit (especially compared to Chinese or Vedic astrology) doesn't know what they're talking about and I guarantee they haven't bothered to master it. Traditional Western Astrology has got to be one of the most mind-knumbingly complex subjects I've ever attempted. Plenty of my college classes were grade school easy in comparison. Also own the following: Real Alchemy: A Primer on Practical Alchemy by Robert A. Bartlet (he is to traditional hermetic alchemy what Greer, Stavish, Warnock and Miller are to hermetic magic theurgy). After reading Real Alchemy and it's sequel you'll see how and why alchemy became modern day chemistry as well. [bartlet also studied modern-day chemistry in college]. That's just a fraction of what I intend to share in this thread. Here's a recommendation I strongly advise for anyone who is curious about whether the West hermetic/qabbalistic traditions and the various Eastern traditions are fingers pointing to the same moon: Get The Tao and the Tree of Life by Eric S. Yudelove Yudelove goes in-depth into both Taoist Inner Alchemy (MCO, fusion of the 5 elements, etc) *and* traditional qabbalistic tree of life inner alchemy practices (he references and explains Franz Bardon as well in addition to qabbala). Read it and see if you still think the Western traditions are a load of play-acting dabblers that have never produced people with deep spiritual insight or remained at the level of childish Lestat wanna-be's.

Sigh... Well since no one is going to continue this thread then I will do so. With the understanding that what I post will be coming from someone who is a beginner in theurgy. Most of my knowledge about it comes from assorted books as well as logs of my own trial and error attempts to put it into practice. Also I've had zero initiations - whether Eastern or Western. I don't doubt initiations can speed someone's transformation. However...some people do not have that option and I do not subscribe to the abundant naysayers on Taobums in saying that those who study on his/her own are doomed to being deluded playacting dabblers. Any practice will bring results proportional to what you put into it. Start as a dabbler, stay as a dabbler and a dabbler is all you'll be. Self-study with consistency, maintain it...and...well that's a whole order different. By the way I believe this is possible of "ordinary" skills too. I believe it's possible for someone to learn how to play the guitar to a very superior degree without ever taking a single lesson from an acknowledge concert virtuoso (guitar "Master") if he/she trains his/her attention and brings that skill into guitar playing. My father is a self-taught "shade tree mechanic". He didn't go to school (didn't learn on the job or apprenticeship either) to learn how to repair, rebuild and customize cars. It was all from books, magazines, swap meets, talking with friends on the subject, etc and years of practical application. Likewise with magic. It's just another form of gong fu. I'll try to adhere to the western way of understanding the Tao (Allah, God, Ein Sof, etc) but might occasionally point to areas I think show some similarities with other cultures (Chinese, Middle Eastern, etc). The fight that broke out in this thread seems to be par-for-the-course at Taobums. If it had been someone posting about Mantak Chia Taoist Magic or Kunlun Magic or any other form of lineage and that lineage's ritual practices the *exact same fight* would've broken out (and has - just do a search sometime to see the long history of Taobums hostility, mocking and rampant ridicule to anything that's a identifiable spiritual tradition). Only the names/lineages/traditions would have swapped places (ie.the form) but the ridiculing attack energy that Taobums posters are notorious for would be exactly the same. BTW, Participation by other western magic/theurgy practicers is welcomed. P.S. One last comment... 1. If you are one of the numerous Taobums who think western magic tradition is a load of shit - Take your opinion and your compelling need to announce it in posts to a different thread. 2. Likewise - if you feel compelled to post DEBATES about it - again I repeat: Take the debates to a new thread. If either of these post types are posted in this one they'll get split off into new threads. Keep this thread to the original intended purpose.

Sneaking something in that may be of interest to Western Mystery Tradition students. On the qualities of water (the tangible, manifested stuff we all drink - not talking about the alchemical 'water' [although maybe it has bearing on the alchemical water element too?] ). From New Scientist (Oct. 25, 2011 - issue 2835): The WATER MOLECULE not only has unique properties that allows it to exist as a gas, liquid or solid within a very short temperature range, but also has a unique arrangement of hydrogen atoms, displaced by 120 degrees, that allows water to move up all plant life against gravity, without which no like could ever exist. As revealed by New Scientist, "Water's quantum weirdness makes life possible."

What does it mean according to Taoism if during meditation one often smells odors of wood burning?

Here's a Youtube vid of John Michael Greer on Western Mystery School Teachings. Maybe it's just me but I suspect most Taoist monks and nuns would agree with a lot of what he says. Using examples from nature as a touchstone, Greer takes readers on a journey into the seven laws of the mystery traditions: the Law of Wholeness the Law of Flow the Law of Balance the Law of Limits the Law of Cause and Effect the Law of Planes the Law of Evolution Greer explains each law, offering meditation, an affirmation, and a theme for reflection, to show how the seven laws can bring meaning and power into our everyday lives. Mystery Teachings from the Living Earth reveals one of the great secrets of the mysteries—that the laws of nature are also the laws of spirit.

Well sure. But the same could be said of most tantric practices or even Qigong and Inner Martial Arts (now there's more than a few guys acting out their Alpha-Male-soaked fantasies - maybe a lot more than the cocaine-powered up, Sponge Bob sigil makers) if those are not done with developed awareness. But I don't see many people suggesting we give up Qigong or Inner Martial Arts to sit on our butts on a cushion for hours on end daily because that's a more direct path to Direct Union with the Tao. We don't expect most people to be Qigong/Inner MA experts since they lack the Pure-Motivation-for-Direct Union of Taoist monks but that doesn't mean we tell them those practices are useless in helping them eventually get there and of improving their lives in the meantime. Likewise when someone trains in and uses ritual magic correctly. It is a type of legitimate gong fu practice just as much as Qi gong fu practice. There are even specific Taoist Lineages where Magic Ritual is a legit part of Taoist training of aligning with (and eventually realizing) the te of the Tao. Check out this Nov. 5, 2010 NY Times story of the revival of Taoism and authentic Taoist Rituals (Theurgy) that is sweeping across modern-day China. ******** edit: correcting typos

Dunno if my contribution will be worth anything as I've only recently begun researching this very topic in order to get started. How odd that within only a few weeks of my interest in it this thread should turn up. Anyway...here's my 2 cents at the moment. Ritualistic Magic has a long history in most societies around the globe and across time. Chaos Magick is only the latest phase. Typically by people who like the idea of going against the grain of whatever society (usually Western) they happen to be in. People live in the world of the 5 senses (6 if you include thoughts/thought-forms). We can't practice what we don't have direct experience with. People don't have day-to-day experiences of relating concretely to Formlessness, etc. Formlessness is too abstract and thus is seldom a good tool for training in attaining higher consciousness/awareness. So we use Ritual as another tool in the box to help us learn about the mundane, everyday world we live in as well as higher realities. Ritual Magic is also known by the older name Theurgy. In Western society one can read works by the Neo-Platonists explaining the uses of Theurgy to return to the Absolute, The Ein Sof, Brahman, Tao, etc. To put it in Taoist terms it is a tool to use in realizing the Tao. Ideally in Theurgy one has already trained to a level where he/she has steadied the mind via concentration meditation and brings this developed skill into the realm of ritual action. In short, by invoking specific patterns in specific movements with stilled awareness one's consciousness is aided toward being elevated to a higher level - as Plotinus would say - Returning to the One (aka God-Realization). In this regard it is similar in some ways to the Tantric practice of Deity-Identification. The goals are similar. The meditator by identifying with a specific Deity is hoping to embody the qualities that Deity represents. So Buddhist tantrics will use a lot of Bodhisattvas and Buddhas for this purpose. Muslims similarly will invoke the 99 Names of Allah. . The idea as I understand it is to use Ritual to get us to the point where we don't need it anymore. Once it has served it's purpose - where every waking moment is actually realized as Embodying the One (we're getting close to Wu Wei here too imo - they may in fact be identical) like one does in the Ritual then it can be set aside. But most people doing ritual magic seldom have the kind of concentrated awareness "chops" to really use the tool of ritual magic for it's intended purpose. Most people simply go through the motions and stay stuck at that level. I suspect this is one reason why the Buddha mentioned Ritual alone will not bring about enlightenment. Any action made with unskilled awareness will only net you more of the same. The best explanation for understanding the theory of WHY ritual can actually help you realize the Tao that I've ever found is from the modern-day Hermetic Druid John Michael Greer. He has two books that address precisely the subject of this thread. They are: Learning Ritual Magic: Fundamental Theory and Practice for the Solitary Apprentice Circles of Power: Ritual Magic in the Western Tradition Circles of Power started out as a theory chapter in Learning Ritual Magic but very soon he realized it was so extensive it deserved its own book. It's a thick book. Some other recommended works for understanding ritual-work: Mantra Yoga and Primal Sound: Secret of Seed (Bija) Mantras The Esoteric Structure of the Alphabet and it's Hidden Mystical Language Magickal Use of Thought-Forms: A Proven System of Mental and Spirtual Empowerment (awesome book but you'd better have your concentration meditation chops down COLD!) Theurgy and the Soul: The Neoplatonism of Iamblichus Philosophy and Theurgy in Late Antiquity On the Mysteries of the Egyptians, Chaldeans and Assyrians The Golden Chain: An Anthology of Pythagorian and Platonic Philosophy If you wonder about the last recommendation let me sneak in the Amazon reviewers points and Seen is this light it's easy to see the philosophy profs I took classes from in University were just as clueless about the real truths Plato and his lineages were teaching as are most pastors, tv preachers and imams of today are about their source 'holy' documents. ***** edit: correcting typos

bumping all of this because I'm interested in Hermetics and Stoicism

bump

Hmm.... Well I don't equate this smell with something like sandlewood burning. It literally smells like burning wood from a campfire or a house on fire. Yall all have sat around a campfire at one point or another in your life right? Remember that smell? That's what I smelled. Anyway...it's not happening now. Don't know why. It seems to come and go. If it is a sign of the root chakra activating I'm very glad for that!