JustARandomPanda

*Heavy sigh* That's what I wonder. Why are all the "practice and meditation inclined Buddhists" not here at Taobums as well? Damn shame that they're not.

Hi Xabir, My point was missed but that is because I was not clear. I am asking HOW you know 100% that the Seth Ananda mindstream "is unable to discern what the party is talking about, or he is not fully clear about the different insights and problems that can surface in those phases of insights." You see...I am asking HOW you obtain this knowledge about the Seth Ananda mindstream Prajna Level's subtle clingings and that your knowledge of his posts does in fact have 1-to-1 correspondence with what the Seth Ananda mindstream in fact actually Realizes via Prajna also and thus how far it yet has to go. HOW do you go about attaining this knowledge of Seth Ananda's level of Prajna?!! (I'm asking about your METHOD(S). Not WHAT you know about Seth Ananda's mindstream but HOW you know and HOW you know that WHAT you know is in fact 1-to-1 100% accurate in assessment. Interpreting posts on message boards in my personal experience is tricky business. Look at all those years of how many people argued and didn't understand Vajrahidaya. Or look at how many people get upset with VMarco and he keeps insisting very few at Taobums really understand what he's saying. Even you with all your Prajna Awareness and 2 Fold Emptiness Realization missed the point of my post. And I don't even have ANY realizations. I'm one incredibly deluded, clingin mofo. If you missed MY point...what assurance do you have that you aren't doing the same with Seth Ananda's or indeed any other posts you respond to?

*falls out of chair laughing* :lol:

The very view of a Self leads to clinging no matter how you deny it... No matter how non-conceptual the state is - I AM is non-conceptual, yet with latent dualistic and inherent view, it lends to reification, making a pure identity out of it, which one then tries to constantly abide as. This has me wondering... I'm curious. Do you have direct Prajna Awareness access to the Seth Ananda mindstream? In fact...I believe that is one of the Siddhis is it not? Please explain to the clingy delusional SB mindstream step-by-step how Xabir Prajna Awareness accesses prajnally that what the Seth Ananda mindstream might call "Self" isn't the same "No-Self" as Xabir mindstream Realizations but just using different words (with no reference to any Seth Ananda posts of course)? I presume you go into Samadhi and get direct Prajna access to Seth Ananda mindstream Realizations? Socially engaged Buddhism is what I've been leaning toward if a label must be put on what I've been focusing on lately. Although I'd be just as happy to call it Socially Engaged Taoism, Socially Engaged Confucianism, Socially Engaged Sufism or Socially Engaged Paganism. Labels don't matter as much to me the more I practice. I suppose being engaged on a message board might be considered an act of compassion if it leads to aiding other beings. But yes...I suspect most posts on message board fall rather short of that ideal.

Over the past 2 days I've begun to wonder more and more about the above sentence. I think maybe I am a Parrot dreaming I am a human being. I keep Parroting back things I've read in books or things I've read on message boards in my posts. But as for my own personal realizations? I have none. And if I can not even say what I think about THIS life...I can not really say what I think or know about anything before or after. If I said anything about it it would all be based on notions picked up from here, there, everywhere. Nothing from actual observation (assuming death can be observed).

Send an email to Mat Black. 100% Grade A Authentic Buddhist.

Well I have no idea how my art and music will evolve if I ever manage to succeed at some of my meditation and inner alchemy practices. But here's a shameless plug of my Deviant Art page. I need to update it as I have a whole batch of new paintings I've not yet uploaded.

This thread reminds me yet again of why I have kept my reading of Buddhist Sutras (1 complete, a few others sporadic) and especially other Buddhist Practitioner's "Realizations" Comments on assorted forums to a bare minimum. On a practical everyday "news-you-can-use" level I know and do a LOT more Taoist Inner Alchemy than I do Buddhism. I am so weary of the Infallibility Factor of a lot of Buddhist posts at Taobums lately. I'm not talking about Sutras. I'm talking about Infallible View at Taobums. I wonder why Taobums Buddhists do not post about daily Loving-Kindness/Compassion practices and any "realizations" or experiences from it as I've seen other Buddhists do? You'd think it would be much easier since the Heart-Mind is opened. Awakened Bodhicitta is *the* thing (along with Buddhism's DIY/Scientific Method Approach) that I liked so much about it. Yet it's so lacking at Taobums. Any guesses as to why?

Thanks. As far as Muni, do you (or anyone else) know which Chakra it invokes? I know Maha invokes the Heart Chakra (isn't that similar to Heart-mind? I never was quite clear about that one). I also know Swaha invokes Ajna Chakra And I guess Gam ("gum") invokes the Root Chakra So which one(s) does Muni invoke, or does it? Or is it a composit like Shrim?

Can some one break down and explain to me what these syllables mean? Om muni muni maha muniye sakyamuni swaha I get that Swaha invokes the Ajna chakra and Maha the heartmind but seriously...can someone please tell me what Muni is composed of and what it invokes? Also the following?: So Ha Om La Om Bling Hum

*whistles* Sure hope I can experience Yang Chi Awakening someday. Sounds awesome! Oh well. I'll always have vicariously experienced Yang Chi Awakening through you. It's like reading Marco Polo's adventures and imagining I'm there too.

Ah! Is always good to be smacked upside the head now and again. Now... Where was I? Ah right! A mind scrubbing due to too much Spiritual Edumacation and not enough practice. * I wonder if I will stumble upon this thread decades from now and laugh at how ignorant I was?

It's too bad the paperback isn't available anymore. Wish I could've gotten it back in the day.

I am very attached to ideas. It's like crack. I'm practicing so that someday I might actually be able to go a whole day without jumping to conclusions, forming a judgment, opinion or whatever else of that nature. Man it is not easy at all to do. And to actually be Eviscerated? *sees red* Ego...dontcha just love it?

OMG! This sounds fascinating! I gotta try this!! Can the above exercise be done even if one has not yet successfully quieted their monkey-mind?

Ok. I won't talk about Sutras/Realizations, etc anymore - especially since I don't know anything (Gurdjieff Man #3 - I'm most definitely not a Bodhisattva). Never would I hold myself forth as any kind of expert on Buddha Nature Realizations or Sutras.

Guys... You are not hearing what VMarco is saying because he's rubbing you all the wrong way. Honestly I think he is doing it deliberately like Zen Masters of Old to see who can get past their knee-jerk response to be in "accord with the Buddhadharma". [Whether his message is Truth obviously I can not say as I'm still a beginner.] So maybe I'll display my level of understanding (and of course correspondingly my level of ignorance as well). Let's get back to the Shurangama Sutra. I reference it because it is one of the very few Sutras I've read (and still reading as I haven't been through all 9 volumes of Master Hsuan Hua's EXTENSIVE commentary on it - which is why it's 9 volumes, instead of merely 1). I'll admit I can count on one hand all the Buddhist sutras I've read. Shurangama is one of them. And I love it to death. I actually looked up Shurangama Mantra determined to try to learn it to begin chanting it (until I *gulp* discovered it's a full 554 lines long for ONE bead on a mala ). But I did learn the intro as translated into English Here's what some of the lines of the Shurangama Mantra say in English: Buddha Nature NEVER moves. Not ever. Even the Buddha himself mentioned it. It is THE THING that distinguishes Buddha Nature from Maya. See...I think it is totally and completely possible for Maya to duplicate exactly Anatta and Shunyata Realization. Perfectly. Exactly. Completely. What is the message of the Shurangama Sutra - especially the section on the 50 Skanda Demon-States? Well I got from it that even people with freakin ridiculously high stage attainment - orders of magnitude beyond what we see at Taobums - still mistakenly think they've reached Buddha Nature...except they didn't. These are Beings who LOOOOONG ago realized Dependent Origination and Emptiness of all things! And still they F'd up!! That's what freaked me out so much about Shurangama's message. They thought they had Realized Buddha Nature. Except they didn't. At least beings in the Evil Realms realize they're trapped! Many Beings in the Upper Realms do not realize they're just as trapped as the ones in the lower ones. Hence why Tathagata vows to save all beings equally without distinguishing between "good" and "bad". If it's illusion. It's illusion period no matter what. Tathagata's compassionate light extends to All. The beings at the Top need saving every bit as much as the beings at the bottom. So that is what I keep asking everyone who posts about it. And what my 2 Act Play was getting at. How do you Fn Certify your Anatta and Shunyata is in fact not the Maya-induced CLONE?* Until you have tried to turn it back on itself as the Buddha advised...can you really Certify your Anatta and Shunyata are the "real Shunyata and Anatta" the Buddha was talking about so to speak? See...this is why I think Great Beings get trapped in the God Realms for Eons upon Eons (Eons = Big Bangs). Time out of mind they stay stuck in the God Realms because they think they've discovered Buddha Nature. Nothing moves in those God Realms and if it's one thing Buddha Nature never does it's move. So since Nothing moves in the God Realms they naturally see they've discovered Buddha Nature. Until...as Vajrahidaya often said..."the merits burn up". And what happens next? Back down they go. The root cause of suffering was never removed. They got trapped in the upper layers for Eons - exactly as Shurangama says - because it too never moved. Except the five turbidities were still there...waiting... Master Nan Huai-Chin says the key at every stage is to keep letting go. That's it. ALL the training methods any of the world's spiritual traditions EVER does is to help you just do that. It's all expedient means to get you to Just Let Go. So I ask again to the Bodhisattvas of Taobums. What have you done to certify you are not making the exact same mistakes as those Great Beings of Shurangama Sutra? *Shurangama Sutra has a cool section where Buddha worked with (if I recall correctly) Ananda in showing that someday even Shunyata Realization will melt away (just like it says in the Shurangama Mantra!) - in other words it too is still trapped within Maya!! Even Emptiness must someday be Emptied! Or at least that's how I understood the lesson.

And because I am such a fan of Gurdjieff I can't resist tossing this into the thread either. And here is a website of Osho giving talks about Gurdjieff

I always say Diamond-Sutra Bodhisattva because A. I haven't read most of the Mahayana canon. B. Diamond Sutra is a short sutra and the Buddha was very clear in outlining such a being in order to be called a Bodhisattva. C. I have seen on a lot of forums people calling this-or-that person a Bodhisattva when this-or-that person talked about has not met even one of the requirements the Buddha outlined in the Diamond Sutra as to what a Bodhisattva is. Ordinary everyday compassion, loving-Kindness and equanimity is not enough to qualify for the title Bodhisattva according to the Buddha. Going back to something else: I have always found Gurdjieff fascinating. He was very much about how the vast majority of humanity is a Machine and furthermore is utterly contented to remain a Machine. I did a websearch on Man #2 (and #1 & #3 - alas, I think I'm a #3 - no better off than Man #1 or Man #2 although I do aspire to be Man #4 at least someday). I found the following on the subject:

The U.S. was founded without any kind of Central Bank whatsoever and did just fine for a long time without one. Returning the power of coining money to the People as was specifically set out in the U.S. Constitution would go a long way toward shaking up the status quo. Not necessarily, scare tactic again. You think the above point is just a scare tactic? I say there are powerful Factions in society that have a vested interest in not letting it be known just how bad the fallout was from the Derivatives and Mortgage Debacles. If it's a total wash then Interest rates can rise and we'll see nada in the outcome for prices or jobs. So why isn't this happening? I submit that if they didn't deeply suppress interest rates as is being done now we'd see the economy nosedive and calls to regulate Wall Street, Shadow Banking institutions, The Fed, Fanny Mae/Freddie Mac, etc would grow so loud, so frequent and so hopping mad Congress would blink in the showdown and be forced to act in ways the Powers-that-Benefit-From-the-Status-Quo would deeply resent. The only permanent thing in this universe is that things change. Only that which has no beginning will never come to an end. You and I may be long dead by then but yes, someday it will do exactly that - dissolve.

Edit: Are there actual Diamond-Sutra Bodhisattva's at TB?!!

1. What practice can one engage in to see if in actual fact Anatta and Shunyata Realization can never be let go of if one wishes to actually Scientifically Test the above assertion for one's self? 2. Assuming Anatta and Shunyata Realization can never be released...does that mean one has therefore successfully become a Diamond-Sutra Bodhisattva? 3. Are there actual Diamond-Sutra Bodhisattva's at Taobums?!

This may be true. However, I'm not sure ANY Fed Board (Chairman included) would be permitted to raise interest rates even if they wanted to. 1. The recovery is weak. There are still large sections of the country hurting from both the Wall Street shenanigans and from the mortgage debacle and the subsequent meltdown. 2. Raising interest rates would have both an immediate and longer range negative impact on production of both services and goods and would have an impact on an already-weak economy. Although I wonder if by keeping interest rates so low it is masking how "sick" or economy really is. *shrug* 3. The Fed has both stable prices AND preventing widespread unemployment in it's charter. And Congress regularly reminds them that What Was Once Given May Yet Be Taken Away. [aka the Fed dissolved]. And like any institution - private or public - once it has power it wants to keep it. 4. The bailouts have had the effect of devaluing the dollar. It takes more money to buy the same amount pre-meltdowns. This is concurrent with the weak economy. 4. Current American society has been conditioned to squawk much more loudly at rising and persistent unemployment than low interest rates (dang it you can't be that Rugged Self-Made Individual that makes His Own Destiny if nobody hires you or buys your services). And of course everyone LOVES to consume. The end result is that we are seeing a massive transfer of wealth from Savers to everyone else - Rich or Poor. Unfortunately this has it's most pernicious effect on Poverty-Stricken Savers trying to get their ass out of poverty. Society's reply? "Oh well. Sucks to be you, eh?" "Now get a job you F'n Slob."

I am not so quick to dismiss some of the things VMarco is saying as being stuck in the I AM stage of realization. Now granted. I am a beginner. Not really one of the people he's looking for to help. But I do find his posts interesting. So I wondered what the following scenarios might look like. What if SereneBlue followed VMarco & Twinner's advice? The Search for Truth (A Play in Two Acts) ACT I SB: I've realized Anatta and Shunyata! Twinner: Great! Now throw those realizations away and you can finally begin. SB: There's nothing to throw away and no one doing any throwing! Twinner: Great! Now throw *those* realizations away and see what happens SB: *stares blankly at Twinner* ACT II VMarco to SB: Throw away Anatta and Shunyata. Go on. I dare you! See if you even CAN. VMarco: BTW - the Buddha himself said you should be able to verify if it can be done. If it can be done then it isn't what the Thus-Come-One taught. SB: But the Thus-Come-One teaches that Emptiness is Form and Form is Emptiness and I have realized it! There is no throwing out to be done and no one doing any throwing! The Buddha spoke Truth. SB: *points out several Pali and Sanskrit Sutras confirming her realization as being in accord with the Buddhadharma as spoken by the Buddha himself* VMarco: Now you are being a Parrot parroting back everything you've been taught about Tathagata. You can not even throw away your precious Anatta and Shunyata. The Dharma that was meant to set you free has now become your Prison. You're just like all the other 99%. *heavy sigh* Twinner: I agree with VMarco. SB, you've been indoctrinated so deeply you can't even see it. This is why I am against all Religious institutions. SB: *Blinks like a deer caught in headlights at VMarco and Twinner*

*sits back eating popcorn waiting for Twinner and VMarco to show up*