JustARandomPanda

No one has answered my question. Am I risking insanity, permanent paranoid delusions or suicide if I continue down this path and attempts at dissolving or letting go FAIL? And I for one would like to hear what VH has to say on how to cope with the primal terror since he's seen The Matrix.

Are you kidding me? Let me see if I understand this...when this happens you crack up so much you start seeing familiars, incubus, succubus, daemons, hungry ghosts and residents of the Astral or Hell Realms evoked or materialize?!!! For REAL?!! Wow... Sloppy is this part of what you experienced? Damn this is starting to sound more and more like Gopi's experience all the time. Although it sounds like his was cranked to a Spinal Tap 'goes to 11' crack up as his Ego shattered into a million little pieces all at once (no stages) thanks to the nuclear detonating power of Kundalini. People should check the book out some time if they haven't read it.

Damn. Reading stuff like this thread scares the daylights out of me. I've not yet had one of these bad episodes but I'm told if I persist with meditation then that check is in the mail. I figure this bad stuff must be the flip side to the incredible bliss states I often hear also eventually arrive. If it is the flip side it must be exceedingly bad indeed. My problem is - when I read stuff like this - especially because I'm so fearful and timid by nature - it scares me enough I seriously wonder if I'd have the strength to continue. I mean...is this ugly stuff that you face enough to put you in an insane asylum or need heavy-duty psych meds to cope if attempts to dissolve it or just let it go fail?! I notice that Pietro and Wayfarer imply that is a very real possibility. To top it off I just finished Gopi Krishna's Kundalini: The Evolutionary Energy in Man and from the sound of it his Kundalini Awakening was horrible stuff not even I waking up from a Night Terror (which are worse than Nightmares) can imagine. And he lived with tottering on the edge of insanity for almost 2 years. Fortunately for him he had a wife. She was his rock when all else crumbled around him - including his body, emotions and mind. I live alone. No friends or family around and my BF lives several states away so there will be no one to turn to when I crumble. Am I risking insanity, permanent paranoid delusions or suicide (yes I own a gun - legally) if I continue down this path?

And now...just to toss a monkey wrench into the thread I give you this debate from the avid Materialist Logic-oriented Skeptic Michael Shermer v. Deepak Chopra (whom appears to be arguing from a Vedantin viewpoint). Too bad a Buddhist and a Taoist weren't included in the discussion too. I suspect Marblehead would enjoy it. Lots of good points to ponder. Cheers! p.s. Just found this website and loved the name so much I had to share. DIYDharma.org!

Fascinating. Pietro, can you give any links or books that go into this homosexuality aspect of Taoism? edit:Ah...just spotted the following Well I'd still like any extra sources that go into this more if possible

Speaking only for myself I've found Dr. Morris's Secret Smile to be very helpful. Especially in illuminating areas of myself that need work, letting go, etc. I have found the Confidence phase particularly difficult. I've always known I've lacked in this area but it is quite another thing to experience it so directly without it even being attached to an incident to which I could point to as 'ah-hah, this is why I'm not confident'. Remove the exterior reason or rationalization and I *still* find it difficult to even start up the Confidence phase. I've always known I've been a very timid person but I've always also brought up tons of reasons (external of course) as to why this is so. It was and still is a jarring thing to experience this difficult phase in Secret Smile because it gives me empirical evidence that no matter what the situation would be I would still have this problem. In fact, after weeks of trying and failing to summon up Confidence I've thrown in the towel and replaced it with the feeling of Quiet Satisfaction in a Job Well-Done. Which is not the same thing imo as true Confidence but that's about the best I've been able to do. I've learned similar surprising things about certain other phases of Secret Smile similar to the Confidence one. I've always lived very much 'in my head' and strongly guided by it so it's not been easy getting in touch with my emotions and never has been. There have been plenty of times when I've been asked what I'm feeling and I literally wouldn't know. But if you asked what I was thinking I could always tell you. Which is odd because women are supposedly more in-touch with emotions than men. I guess there are always exceptions to the rule. I would never have had this realization about myself in such a blatant - in-your-face - manner were it not for this particular exercise. It's a different thing to experience this block v. intuiting it intellectually. I can no longer blame anyone else or anything else for this lack inside me. Even if I never reach enlightenment I would still say that for people like me - the ones who tend to be clueless many times about their emotional states - will find Secret Smile very helpful. In such a case....trying to not consider emotion will toss gasoline on the fire of what we already have. It would be far too easy to mistake such 'deadened' inability to feel with Effortless Equanimity - and it would be the wrong conclusion. Until one like myself who lives in their head walks the path of emotion true judgment as to what is good for achieving enlightenment will not be attainable.

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Interesting discussion. I have no answers. Just many questions. It occurred to me about 4 weeks or so ago I and everyone else here have long experience with a sort of mini-formless-jhana. And all without needing to meditate or become enlightened or whatnot. I am of course talking about deep sleep. Those times when we do not have dreams nor any kind of sensate awareness of any sort - not even as much as a vegetable. In an odd way I see it as mirroring this discussion. I think it's why some ancient philosophers and theologians called sleep the 'little death'. Odd...I enter into this formless, non-dual, unbounded state every night - no years of insight meditation needed. In fact...I only know it exists precisely because I wake. But when I'm actually in it it's as if all that I've called and believed to be my "Self" has suddenly been deleted. Shades of Hermes Trismegistus...As above, so below.... I've been pondering this for quite a while now. It's as if I'm some sentient A.I. computer program who has suddenly decided to turn around and look at itself. And all it sees is just lines of code...and where there is no code...there is no A.I. If I actually end up experiencing that all I thought was 'ME' is nothing more than just a bunch of 'computer code' (metaphorically speaking) that doesn't exist when it's not running... *blink blink* wow. Just wow. Must go think... or not... In such a state...even simply 'Being' - and the Tao - doesn't have the same meaning for me it once did.

What is Kriya Yoga and why is it so dangerous?

Buddha Boy was proven to be fake? Oh well. So much for that documentary. I wish Drew Hempel would post here more often. His stuff always interests me. Take a look at this article he posted. Also can anyone point to an exercise website or whatever that can teach one to sit full-lotus? I've tried on multiple occasions but can only do half-lotus...I just don't have the flexibility for full lotus. p.s. I *think* maybe I found a book by Drew at Amazon (and Lulu.com) but there's nothing to indicate what the subject is about.

Can anyone recommend a website or exercises that help one be able to sit in full lotus?

Damn DH. Maybe someday I'll finally learn what an orgasm feels like (one of those O at D's would be a great start!). I got nadda for a sex life but it's sure fun hearing of yours.

Wth? I just did a simple breath meditation and all of a sudden - I swear if I'm lying I'm dying - my hands started moving into all these weird positions! All on their own! Fingers touching palm, then moving to do a hook-em-horns kinda thing, then shifting to do a middle finger to thumb, then shifting again to do pinky to thumb, and lots of other kooky finger to finger and fingers to palm type movements, etc. ALL on their OWN! *I* wasn't doing it. Wth is up with that?! This has never happened before. Is this a side effect of KAP?! What does this mean in TCM? Does it mean the meridians or chi in my hands are sick?!!!!!!

I did the meditation again later that night and same thing happened - hand kriyas - except that time I also felt a tiny trickle of *something* (chi?) along my spine. And later that night as I focused on my breath to relax before sleep my body started doing a funky Qi Gong-ish (dolphin-like? snake-like?) undulating dance front-to-back and side-to-side movements with my spine. I felt like I was being forced to be a Bellydancer. I'm sure I looked quite silly. I've posted to Tao asking his opinion on things. He usually doesn't answer the Facebook posts preferring to wait until class time to answer them directly during the call. In any case I am glad to know it's not a sign of sick chi. That was my main worry. And then I discovered that one website I linked to earlier and that scared the daylights out of me. But I think maybe if I just follow Tao's instructions I hopefully won't live through the hell that lady went through.

Scary. Kriyas and Mudras yikes

No, this was nowhere even remotely close to what I've read are descriptions of Kundalini awakening. I didn't feel zip 'awakening' in my pelvis, spine or anything else. This was localized to my hands. I am wondering if this is a side effect of my doing KAP? I hope it doesn't mean I have sick chi.

I think finally this post clarified - for me at least - Buddhist teachings on 'ultimate reality'

Fascinating. Is there a book that goes more in-depth about this?

What is meant by one never draws energy from outside one's head in RP 1? If not then where is the energy drawn from? And what is meant by 'flossing'?

A friend of mine once said he read a Zen master say, "There are no enlightened beings, only enlightened actions."

*olive branches to everyone in this thread*

Get the book Tao and Longevity. It will answer your questions - and many more.

This is an interesting thought. For some reason when I read it it brought to mind something I'd read recently from U.G. Krishnamurti. It gave me a bit of a jolt. Namely because I had the odd sensation he's right! It occurred to me I literally don't know who or what I am without thought, emotion, sensation or whatnot. I meditate but haven't experienced any of these so-called higher jhanas.

Can someone provide that link to the 31 Planes again? I lost it.