XieJia

Eat your vegetables. And talk to people's heart rather than yourself in them. Even the most insignificance things, it shows what's on their mind and in their heart. As for my case, I am a person that don't know a thing and talk too much.

Lienshan, there are 之 in chapter 78 aswell; could you help us read them? May All be Well...

Hey Lienshan, this is a interesting observation and a good point. Can you share with us more about this subjective Dao?

no need for merit transfer . Could you tell me more about what you are asking. 'Purification' is quite ambiguous... The mind go where it resides and dwells upon; it totally dependent upon the state of mind in that moment. For example if one is still attached to coarse sensation, this correspond to the realm of senses. The Honored One once expounds on the 5 precepts and how it helps one to stay within the Human realm or above. Is this the kind of question, you are looking for? So the mind goes to what it is looking for. So without the body to dwell as a house, the mind continues to flow according to the 'self-existing' of one ones' karma.

if i understood your 'purification' correctly. corresponds to being homeless bum

From the looks of it, you, just another bum as you said. Welcome

ni hao huan ying huan ying

Agreed; I rather disagree myself than that of the Ancient (Sounds abit confucian on one level) But there's also the grounding and rooting on the other . In any text, the level is multi-dimensional; for example what is written and what is the 'I' that have written. So by seeing the 名 (ming) the name and contrasting it with the 無 (wu); only thus would the name be truly understand. As to my opinion about the Dao, there's the Way of Heaven Way of Man Way of Tea Way of Pottery, Calligraphy, Martial Arts, Swordmanship, Business, Management, Warfare, Peace. There's Way of You, Way of Me. There's the Way and its function. The function of functions. I have mumbled too far, there's really no need to state it, but no need in not sharing it either. May all be Well, Xiejia

It's not mine, I actually puts your thought and Jeff's together.

Lol True, I did try to hammer it into the chapter since I can't answer the question of why is it there in the first place. In DDJ, there are many chapters where we see that somehow these funny lines popped out from the middle of nowhere. If it's not there originally, I'd still think it's useful to try to understand why it is there; I don't think the ancient will easily make Typo's. Even so anyone's Typos should show us the person's thought process. imho, whether the this chapter is with the last three lines or without the last three lines does not really matter that much. As we know that Laozi's Dao De Jing are divided up into two parts; One about the Way and the Other about Virtue. Where we understood that chapter 2 is in the the Way's discourse and chapter 77 is in the Virtue's discourse. So there should be a reason why Virtue is man's cultivation of the Way. If one throw away the Way, what is Virtue then? Without taking account of the Way. So whether the three lines are in this chapter or not; the logic should still apply and links the Virtue with the Way. May all be Well Goodnight, It's late from this part of the world.

Yi Jing is much about the interaction between the trigrams inside the Bagua. But true, I agree to your statement nonetheless.

Dear Lienshan, Do you think having a Yi Jing Study group here at the Tao Bums will be beneficial? Xiejia

Note: As Jeff and Marblehead pointed out One could use the Yin & Yang; Soft & Hard; Flexible & Rigid to gain more understanding from the last three lines. Two sides of the Palm, the Yin & Yang nature and conditions complements each other. The character here is 受 (shou) to bear, to accept, to receive. What does it share with 'Water'? The chapter could be read from a different light and it's not that obvious from the English translation. We can view that the two polarities of Hard and Soft; giving birth, complementing while it is not obvious from the English translations, they seems to be translating only one way of looking at the text which is as two opposing and overcoming.

Jeff, Without stone, how can we use the water? Without water, what use is the stone? Think this is the meaning of the last line; thanks for pointing this out. @MH I like your explanation

Jeff, Oh! I thought I covered all possibility. You got me! Yin & Yang could also be use I think. But maybe there are not entirely that different.

Bring Everything to the present. Live is a past thing, Death is a future thing. To do what you want; Bring Everything to the present. In the Present, there's no clinging. No place for life or death. This is what I have heard.

Hi Jeff, imho, Water itself is a fluid. Fluid is something that undergoes constant change depending on forces applied and the shape of its vessel. It could represent Time, Impermanence, the ever-changing nature of the manifested, the metamorphosis, the transformation or just water . I was hoping I covered all the possibilities so that I can't be right or wrong.

Dear Dwai, Thank you for taking your time to answer my question ; in the future, If you don't mind I would like to PM you to ask some more question. Lets continue with the study of the Yoga Sutra; the five vrttayah. Thanks, Xiejia

Let me dig it a little bit; would like to play with the character and see whether it could say something different. After some pondering, I think the second line could be look in a different light; as well as the interpretation of the last three lines. but there could still be problem with my english comprehension.

Lol, the water torrent is fast isn't it? hehehe

Thanks for the comment Dawei ; 1. I would think 'Act without expectation' would also be true to the meaning; since it implies Origin and Ending as you said. Acting without presumption and Acting without expectation of what one will gain or of what conceived consequence of the action. I think 'without relying' is harder to be misinterpret. 2. I won't touch this one then; it's not like it's much different from other translator any way. 3. The sage does not want to appear worthy according to the Way of Man, and thus provoking the Way of Heaven upon himself. Much like the your comment in the other chapter about Grounding and Rooting. There's no need for the Sage to stand from his action when he's one with it . *One interesting note, when translating this few chapter. I feel that Grandpa Laozi's Dao is neither the Heaven's Dao or Man's Dao. Thus something wider than that, and thus how Man can cultivate De. @Sir Chidragon I'd still look more toward more of your comments, I think we all some thoughts to share here .

What makes it boring?

Reminds me of a scene of Johny English; Chaos and Control...

Thank you deci belle for your comment, and Chidragon for your answer. May I suggest we look at this chapter with some Laozi's subtleties (My speculation). The Way of Heaven is to diminish the abundant and nourish the lacking, The Way of Man is to diminish the lacking and nourish the abundant. Who that have the ability to nourish all under Heaven, only then have the Dao. (Apply the Way of Heaven with this guy, Apply the Way of Man with this guy, Looking from the way of Heaven, this person is superior to all under Heaven. Looking from the way of Man, this person is inferior to all under Heaven.) Thus This is why Sages, act without relying, achieve without dwelling, does not want to be seen as of any value. The logic is hence complete; such person is superior through the way...

I wont mind the dim sums. But I do agree with Marble, nonetheless that we should try to finish DDJ first. It do provide a good base to look at Zhuangzi. @Emptiness Why don't you act as the TTB's vanguard on Zhuangzi? Maybe finding more resources or reference online and going through and meditate the contents in the Inner Chapters by yourself first. We will finish the DDJ in no time and then we are can share what we found. What do you think?