Taoist81

The Definitive Edition by Star is great. You can use it with your other translations on any chapter you would like more clarity on. Taking the other translators understanding with the literal meanings helps a great deal. I used to have a downloadable version of the 13 or so different translations but can no longer find it anywhere.

Sean, Impressive list. However, where did it come from? There are no references for your sources. David Blaine (agreed an irrisistible qoute) IS a big fan of Geller's. But the sources that are searchable only come up on Geller's site. Also, it is not just Randi that doubts Geller's claims: http://skepdic.com/geller.html there are many links on this page alone. The quote from Randi is great though: "If Geller is using psychic powers to bend spoons, he's doing it the hard way." One of the reasons many sleight of hand artists are so anal about keeping their secrets is because many of the tricks can fool the smartest of us. I am not saying it is definitely a trick, just that it probably is. Again, there are far to many instances of Criss Angel pulling off more impressive stunts than bending a spoon and he only jokingly claims "powers" (ever seen Geller "walk on water"?). There are many more people out there bending spoons that admit they are illusionists than those claiming it is a real power. Taoist81

----Believe me I agree. Blind faith is blind faith even if it is in skepticism or science. All sides must accept their limitations. Again, agreed, except one doesn't even have to all upon Quantum Mechanics to posit that the observer affects the observation. that has been well donumented in psychology for quite some time. And yes, unfortunately science is highly politicized in our society. Randi probably doesn't want to give away his million, but that doesn't make the challenge any less viable. Extraordinary claims call for extraordinary proofs. And an extraordinary proof would be hard to deny, especially since he has offered to accept "unbiased" judges, like those picked by the claimant. The question your suggestion raises is, if the hypnotist and the "Master" are doing the same thing, what is the use of the 20 + years of training? If he doesn't even realize he is using "hypnosis" then who has the "secret teachings" the "master" or the stage hypnotist who realizes what he is doing? Taoist81

They did experiment with acupuncture long before the US. But the way their licensing is set up, for some reason, unless you are an MD, you have to be "une sorcier" to practice acupuncture legally. In the US on the other hand, take say, Louisiana, you can't practice acupuncture unless you are piggybacking on an MD's license.

The American College of Acupuncture and Oriental Medicine. Not sure where right now. I am with a girl from France (she's studying at the same school) so we may end up as "sorcier"s in France. "Knowing the future is only a flowery trapping of the Tao"

Like others have said it depends on definition. Can "you" or "I" "live" forever, doubt it. But: "Being at one with the Tao is eternal, though the body dies, the Tao lasts forever."

I was reading a book on Bagua in which the author mentioned a similar idea: namely he would be weary of any teacher who would not demonstrate on/with those who hadn't been his students for a long time. It suggests that too much "conditioning" is required (i.e. the student learns to do what the teacher expects/wants him/her to without even realizing that they are doing it themselves). Also, seeing Criss Angel walk on water with people swimming all around and under him doesn't convince me that he is not using some trick to do it. Illusion is a tricky thing whether it is in your head during your personal practice or being shown in front of you. Just $.02

Kinesiology hasn't passed a double blind test either has it? I've yet to come across a study to back up it's claims. Penn and Teller also did an interesting episode of their show Bulls#!t about Feng Shui. Whether or not a thing has a "real" basis in reality doesn't change the affect it can have on one's mind though.

I am studying TCM. Right now I am in my third year. Hopefully I will be doing my Intership in around a year. My study of Taoism and my interest in studying TCM sort of arose at the same time.

A brief search showed that this had been discussed a bit in the past here. Nevertheless do any of you practice the techniques described in The Secret of the Golden Flower. If so, could you describe your practice? Results?

Hello from a lone Taoist in Houston by way of Tuscaloosa, AL. Anyone else in the Bayou City?

Thanks for the warm welcome. Nope, not working with NASA. I'm here for the acupuncture school.