ChiDragon

1. Is taking antibiotics to kill a bacterial infection considered interfering? The bacterial infection is causing you harm, it is natural for you to save yourself. Therefore, it is not interfering because no harm was done. However, it would be debatable if you say killing the bacteria is interfering with its life. 2. What about treating your head for lice? Are you cause harm to your head.....??? 3. What about putting someone on life support until they can get an organ transplant? it was interfering for the good with no harm done. Therefore, it did not violate the concept of Wu Wei. 4. What about using chi to heal someone, if healing them has to eradicate a virus? Again, it was interfering with no harm done. Therefore, it did not violate the concept of Wu Wei. 5. What about mowing the yard or starting a campfire? Mowing the yard cause no harm to Nature. However, if one starting a campfire to cause a forest fire, then in would be considered to be interfering because there was harm done to Nature. 6. What about removing a tick from your dogs ear? It caused no harm but a good deed for the dog, therefore, it was not interfering. Again, debatable. I can think of a bunch more if you would like. Keep coming....if you would like...!!!

Okay! just from the philosophical point of view, when you are interfering and when you are not....??? Can you give me some examples.....??? Thanks...!!!

I know it is hard to get the point across. Lao Tze was putting emphasis on "interfere with harm". I had been flagged "harm", with red many many times, and you still miss the point. If you think you are part of Nature, then there would be no Wu Wei to begin with. It is because there was no one, here, to interfere nor non-interfere with Nature. In the TTC, Lao Tze was treating that all humans are not part of Nature. He was suggesting that humans have to be coped with Nature. Humans are wearing clothes during cold weathers. If humans were stay naked and died(due to cold temperature) was considered to be part of Nature, then no human will be left on earth. If a madman built an atomic bomb to blow up the whole world, is it natural because he is part of Nature.....???

Sorry, the trigrams start with the top line as the youngest; and the hexagram starts with the bottom line as the youngest. I will make the corrections accordingly. Thank you....!!! It has been for a while since I had studied the Yi Jing......

The term "daughter" was only used for the explanation in studying the trigrams. Each trigram is designated with a given name. 1. The name of this Trigram is known as "Marsh"; and described as the "youngest daughter" --- --- -------- -------- The the broken line represents "Water" is flowing on top of high lands. 2. This is known as "Fire" (the second daughter) --------- --- --- --------- The broken line in the middle represents "Fire" burning in a cooking brick stove. 3. This is known as "Wind" (oldest daughter) --------- --------- --- --- The broken line at the bottom represents "Wind" blowing beneath the sky. Let's analyze the hexagram with the "Mountain" trigram on the top of the "Marsh/lake" trigram: A mountain is on marsh land which means the soil is very loose and weak to hold a big mountain. Hence, the mountain tends to fall. If we say a mountain is on top of a daughter, then the interpretation would be a female is buried underground. Edited to add: Thank Tao that we are still having the edit function at all times......

Yes, I had interfered with no harm but good. Have I violated the concept of Wu Wei.....???

Yes, I can understand. However, but sorry, it will not hold water for all the interpretations. No exceptions....!!!

FYI When one interprets the hexagrams, the proper way is use the names of the trigrams. In this case, "lake/marsh" should used for the bottom trigram instead of "daughter".

Temporal interpretation: 　惠施对庄子说：“我有一棵大树，人们把它叫樗。这棵大树的树干长着凹凸不平的大疙瘩，无法打上墨线，它的小枝又都弯弯曲曲，不合乎木匠的规矩，生长在道 路上，木匠连看也不看它一眼。现在你说的那些言论，都是大而无用的，所以大家都弃你而去。” 庄子说，“先生你没看那野猫和黄鼠狼吗？它把身子伏在地上，以 等候那些来来往往的小动物。东西跳跃，不辟高低，踏中机关，死于网罟。现今的牦牛，它的庞大的身驱象挂在天上的云彩，这头牛能力很大，然而不能捕鼠。现在 先生有这棵大树，却忧虑它没有用处，为什么不把它栽到什么也没有的地方，以及那无边无际的旷野，然后来往徘徊在它的旁边，自由自在地躺在它的下面，使它遭 不到斧头的砍代而夭折，也没有什么东西来侵害它。它没有什么用处，又哪里会有什么困苦呢？” 7b: The useless treeMaster Hui said to Master Chuang, 'I have a large tree, which men call the Ailantus. Its trunk has grown unevenly with swells out to a large size; its smaller branches are knotted and crooked; it cannot even allow to apply construction line on it; it does not meet the standards for carpentry. It stood along the road side, the carpenters don't even take a glance at it. You have been saying that the large things are useless. Therefore, the people had abandoned you and left. so that the disk and square cannot be used on them. Though planted on the wayside, a builder would not turn his head to look at it. Now your words, Sir, are great, but of no use; – all unite in putting them away from them.' Master Chuang replied, 'Have you not seen a wildcat and a weasel? They lies and crouching on the ground wait for the little creatures to approach; east and west it leaps about, avoiding neither what is high nor what is low, till it is caught in a trap, or dies in a net. Again there is the Yak, so large that it is like a cloud hanging in the sky. It is large indeed It's abilities are great indeed, but it cannot catch mice. Now, Sir, you have this large tree and are troubled because it is of no use; – why do you not plant it in a tract where there is nothing else, or in a wide and barren wild? There you might saunter idly by its side, or in then have the enjoyment of untroubled ease sleep beneath it. Neither bill nor axe would shorten its existence; there would be nothing to injure it. What is there in its uselessness to cause you distress?'

This question has been addressed to me many times. Is natural to see a baby drowning in the river....??? It is a matter of how people understand the definition of "Wu Wei". If people have understood the true meaning of Wu Wei, then this question would have had been asked again and again. Wu Wei(無為) is to let Nature take its course without any interference to cause her any harm. Now, let's ask ourselves two logical questions: 1. If we've saved the baby from drowning in the river, are we causing any harm to Nature....??? 2. If we have not save the baby from drowning, are we causing any harm to Nature......??? What are your thoughts based on the above definition of "Wu Wei"........???

It's not nice to fool with mother Nature. This is a classic example of not being Wu Wei.

Dagon... You welcome and thank you....!!! The symbol you have shown is a phonetic symbol for the Japanese languages. I think...

It means exactly what it says. Your breath is vital. As long as you are breathing, the body will function normally. If you breathe more, your body will even function more efficiently. The body functions include the body growth, development and self healing by metabolism and mitosis. Learn to breathe, learn Chi Kung.

Did you practice any kind of Chi Kung (功) at all......????

It looks like these characters: 文: literature plus other meanings 之: of Note: These characters might not be the same as what is in the picture but it is the best that I can come close to it.

As soon you move slowly, then you are into Tai Ji...................

I've read your post. Please do not just read one line and expect to reach a logical conclusion.......

庄子说：“先生，原来你不善于使用大的东西！宋国有一个人善于炮制不皱手的药物，祖祖辈辈在水中从事漂洗丝絮的劳动。一位客人听到了这件事，请求以百金购 买他的药方。宋人把全家集合在一起，商量说：‘我家祖祖辈辈从事漂洗丝絮的劳动，所得到的钱很少，现在一旦卖出这个药方就可得到百金，让我们把药方卖给他 吧。’客人买得药方，用它去游说吴国的国王。一次越国发难侵吴，吴王派这个人统帅大军，冬天和越军在水上作战，大败越军，于是得到割地的封赏。能不皲手的 药方只有一个，有的用来博取封赏，有的仍然不能免于在水中漂洗丝絮的劳苦，这就是因为对药方的使用不同。现在你有五石容量的大葫芦，为什么不将它做成腰 舟，拴在腰间，借以飘浮在江湖之上，反而愁它大大无物可容呢？可见先生的心窍还是被蓬草睹塞了吧！” Rephrased.... Master Chuang replied, 'You were indeed stupid initially not familiar in the use of what was large. There was a man of Sung who was skilful at making a salve which kept the hands from getting chapped; and (his family) for generations had made the bleaching of cocoon-silk their business. A stranger heard of it, and proposed to buy the art of the preparation for a hundred ounces of silver. The kindred all came together, and considered the proposal. "We have," said they, "been bleaching cocoon-silk for generations, and have only gained a little money. Now in one morning we can sell to this man our art for a hundred ounces; – let him have it." The stranger accordingly got it and went away with it to give counsel to the king of Wu, who was then engaged in hostilities with Yüeh. The king gave him the command of his fleet, and in the winter he had an engagement with that of Yüeh, on which he inflicted a great defeat, and was invested with a portion of territory taken from Yüeh. The keeping the hands from getting chapped was the same in both cases; There was only one kind of medicine that would prevent the hands from getting chapped; but in the one case it led to the investiture reward of some ceded lands (of the possessor of the salve), and in the other it had only enabled its owners to continue their bleaching was inevitable to prevent the torment from their bleaching. The difference of result was owing to the different use made of the art. Now you, Sir, had calabashes large enough to hold five piculs; – why did you not think of making large bottle-gourds of them, to put them around the waist, by means of which you could have floated over rivers and lakes, instead of giving yourself the sorrow agony of finding that they were useless for holding anything. Your mind, my master, would seem to have been closed against all intelligence!'

Yes, a good teacher can only get one started; and the rest was by the inner-self-intuition to get to the final stage. As the fundamental basis was established, all the knowledge stay within to help to grok anything new that comes along. Indeed, it will speed up our learning process toward enlightenment.

Putting one on the spot, don't you think it was a noble thing to do in studying philosophy in a subtle manner.......??? Since you have concluded that Chuang Tzu's concerns were about usefulness, not human morality, thus I don't think that "destroy something that might be useful to someone else is wasteful" was ZZ's concern. He just want to make the point about the "uselessness", here, from the point of view of Master Wei. In the next part of the section, ZZ will mention about the "usefulness" of a big useless tree to make Master Wei to look bad, so to speak.

Based on the given parameters, ZZ had specified that a ladle was made from a useless gourd. If it was offered to someone else, then what can one do with it....??? Do you still think that the parable is about "self-centered" or "uselessness"....??? Since we are following ZZ's philosophy instead of LZ, do you think he is more concern about "uselessness" or human morality....???

Yes, you are correct. Sometimes, a direct translation from one language to another does sound awkward because of the non grammatical sentence structure, especially in the Chinese classic. I just have to consider myself lucky that I can come up with something for correction by an English speaker. Thank you. I had "gourd" in mind too but Legge used "calabash" in his translation.

Steve,,, Classic: 非不呺然大也 Temporal translation: 这个葫芦不是不大，而我因为它没有什么用处 How would you translate the phrase in red....??? Perhaps you need some help with the Chinese or pardon you without knowing the phrase exists.....!!!

You did a good thing, indeed, by reading into the story of the parable other than picking on each individual object. Thank you....!!!

That was only Master Wei's idea rather than ZZ's. Wait until what ZZ has to said in the second part of the section about the big tree.