ChiDragon

Fa Jin is the ability to have any individual muscle in the body to exert a force. I did not prefer this method. It was will known by the martial artists. If one goes to Kung Fu school, at least in China anyway, the first thing was asked by the Sifu to have the students to do zhan zhang before teaches them anything else. The Sifu will go to each student and give a push to check the ma bu(馬步) daily. If the student got pushed out of place, then the student failed the test. So, the ZZ continuous until the student passed the test. Zhan Zhuang give a foundation for martial artists to anchor their feet to the ground for stability in balancing the body. Like I said before and I will say it again. Zhan Zhuang is to build up the muscle tone in the leg muscles. As soon one bends the legs, the leg muscles contract automatically. The amount of contraction depends on the bending angle of the knee, the smaller the angle the tighter the muscles. You can always try that yourself at anytime. If you understand how the muscle works, you will know that when muscle contracts the biochemical energy, ATP, will be generated. The tighter the muscles the more ATP energy will be generated. In order to keep the ATP energy going, one must be continuously breathing in the oxygen to react with the glucose. If one does not understand this much about muscle contractions, then there is no longer to continue with this thread.

LOL..... No, Zhan Zhuang will prepare you for a better physical shape to handle the most adverse situation that one might encounter. At least, ZZ will give one a better chance of survival. ZZ is very important in balancing one's body. If one can do the 90 degree stance, then it will help to prevent one from falling off the edge of a cliff. Let's assume that you are standing at the edge of a cliff for some reason. Somehow, your back was face outward due to a situation which causing you to fall. For most people, they will fall off due to their weights by gravity. However, for an ZZ practitioner, one can control the weights by Fa Jin to put all the strength on the legs to hold the body in place.

Well, second thought, you guys are right about relaxing shoulders but it is only can be done at high zhuang. However, at the 45 degree stance, the body weight was shifted to the rear because the knees must kept behind the toes. In order to keep the body in balance, I have to extend my hands forward to counterbalance my body weight from falling off. That was why my shoulders were not relaxed even though my elbows were still bent.

dwai and mYTHmAKER...... I was wearing something black; one cannot see too good that my elbows were bent not which it was. I know you guys like to put more emphasis on relaxing the shoulders which is fine. However, IMO, the legs are more important to keep the body in place than the shoulders. When one run into a dangerous situation, one would rather be concerned about the strength of the legs more than the relaxing shoulders. Don't you think....???

We are only humans and start doing the practice in the later stage of our lives. The Wudang Taoists are super humans because they were practicing since they were young. If you can do the 90 degree stance right away at the school, then you would be as good as them and don't need to go there in the first place.

Thanks. Here is what I am experiencing. On the lower stance, I felt a tremendous stress on the upper and the lower legs. I only feel the stress on the knees if they were passed the toes. If I have to keep the back straight, at lower stance, I have to move my back backward to align with the vertical and bend my knees to go pass the toes and move the hands forward to keep myself in balance. At the high Zhuang, there was less stress on the legs, almost none. Thus people can stand for hours and meditate if they wish. At 45 degrees, the stress is tolerable for some people with a good physical condition. They can stand for a limited of time. I think the 45 degrees stance has the best effect; some might have some moderate sore or pain in the muscles at the beginning. However, the muscles will adapt to the stress and getting less sore as the practice progresses.

mYTHmAKER..... Here is my video done indoor. At the end, I showed balancing myself with one bent leg as the result from the practice.

bubbles.... This thread may not be the "high level of discussion" has taken place. However, the 90 degree stance is certainly a high level of practice..... You are welcome to bother me anytime....

No, it is not me, but I will make a video of me for you as soon as the weather permits. It's a rainy day here right now....!!!

When most people speaking about "sung", they did not include the phrases as indicated in bold. That was what threw me off. Anyway, if one can do the 90 degree stance, one already has all the tools to do it by all means. At that level, all the minor details are no longer significant. Thus it becomes natural to the practitioner. PS.... Is there a real need to repeat all the amateur stuffs at a high level of discussion. All those are understood. Don't you think.....???

Ohhh... I forgot one more thing. Please tell them sorry for me that I excluded them.......

i am,,, Please do...!!! I am sure that they don't mind for being Taoists. They probably get a good laugh out of it.....

Walker.... "纸上谈兵 and 纸上谈玄" 真金不怕紅爐火。

"The knees are at ~ 90 degrees because his butt is lowered (low stance). As sung increases, the stance will automatically become lower. That doesn't mean one has to fight through pain and physical damage to do that." It was understood that one can do 90 degree stance, one had went through all the pain and torture from the practice in the earlier stage. His muscles are well adapt to the stressfulness. You have too much emphasis on the sung. That was for the amateurs. The 90 degree cannot be done with the state of sung. Have you ever tried the 90 degree stance....???

The 90 degree(low Zhuang, 低樁) is the ultimate stance only can be done by Shaolin monks. 90 degree stanceby Shaolin a monk while he is eating rather than meditating: http://www.snowyy.co...rse-stance.html

I can only do the 45 degree stance for a long period of time without any pain. 45 degree stance

Yes, my bad. I had thought of that in my mind when I write that. I knew I'll get in trouble for that.

Why did you take it negatively....??? As soon I had spoted the extra twist in the body movements, I knew it was the Chen Style.

Let's look at it this way... Do you know why there are so many family styles of Tai Ji Chuan...??? It was because each family preferred to have it the way they like it to fit their own preference. If one had noticed, the original Chen style always have an extra twist in their movements as oppose to others do not.

It takes all kinds........ :D

Well, I had seen some Tai Ji practitioners stand on one leg with the leg bent and some are straight. Which method do you prefer....???

What is incorrect or correct...??? It is a matter of preference. Perhaps some people prefer health benefits over martial practice. Anyway, any motion produced by the gesture of the body are considered to be isotonic exercise. However, Tai Ji is different, it require slow movements, then the breathing improves by itself in the later stage. Even martial artists need to improve their health to keep a well fit physical body.

It is not a matter of displaying how good one. It is how much health benefit and understanding one got from the practice. If I am all into the cosmetics to show how good I am, then I would be here shooting the breeze. Perhaps, some of you may be thinking that I am........... PS..... I believe this is a Taoist environment. I think things should be conducted in a friendly manner without any verbal abuse. I think things are improving right now....!!!

I believe practice is the key to acquire the effect of internal art. A teacher can tell one a lot but how much can one absorb and digest. Even no matter how much one can understand them without practicing the art will not get the effect. Understanding the effect can only be done by self intuition. One can feel the physical change in the body and the increase in body strength from a long period of practice by intuition.

I was going to say this elsewhere, but let me say it here. Zhan Zhuang is standing on a pole. Later, people stop standing on the poles for this practice because it is very dangerous from falling off the poles and get hurt. By the basic definition of ZZ, the legs must be bent at some degree depends on the ability of each individual practitioner. How do people ended up calling it as "standing meditation" that I don't know. There was also a term called "walking meditation". These all seems to me was only use in the west. The word "meditation" basically implies to be sitting down in a quiet place to go into a deep concentration of some kind. If somebody says "standing on a pole", then the practice will be standing on a pole without meditating. However, if somebody says "standing meditation", then the practice will be standing and meditate. BTW To me it would be difficult to meditate while standing or walking.