Wells

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Everything posted by Wells

  1. If taoist alchemy would be about metaphors then "spirit immortals" would simply be people who after their deaths are remembered by other people...
  2. In other words: No reversal of aging / becoming young again.
  3. So all studies show that 80 year old guys who go keto or calorie restriction become 20 years old again?
  4. We already tried to look at jing from a taoist alchemy point of view. But what is the definition of jing / essence (not jin / power!) in different chinese internal martial arts? I am only aware of the equation of jing with "basic body awareness", but that doesn't seem to be what we are looking for here. Do you guys know other interpretations or definitions of jing / essence in such internal martial art systems? And, more important, do such systems offer methods to replenish jing?
  5. I just got the info that according to Wu Liu Pai school, replenishment of jing is not only possible and definitely leads to reversal of aging, but also leads to the sign of "a child-like joy with life". So, concerning objective signs & effects of jing replenishment, so far there seem to be only three in my opinion: 1) reversal of aging (early sign & effect) 2) physical immortality (longterm result of 1)) 3) ascension to heaven with the physical body (final sign & effect)
  6. So the guys become old, tottery, sick, demented and finally die when they run out of juice but ABRACADABRA directly afterwards roam the void as young and perfectly healthy spirits with uncanny and sharp mental abilities and almost exploding of vitality...? Sounds like the taoist counterpart to the christian "Don't worry, grandpa is now in heaven with Jesus!" In other words: Wishful thinking! I rather fear: No physical signs (reversal of aging) now, no immortality later.
  7. As the old texts show, the taoist saints achieved not only physical immortality but even "ascended to heaven in broad daylight" with their physical body.
  8. Successful jing replenishment seemingly reverses your aging and makes you young again including restoring the color of your hair, eventually leading to stages of immortality, according to the classic scriptures. It is definitely the most secret, most rare and most important taoist training method there is, which leads to many schools which don't know the method to deny that it even exists. Possibly the method never has been written down and to this day is only transmitted verbally in very few schools.
  9. Another point to consider which Teomeow pointed out in other threads is that most taoist alchemy systems are basically mash-ups of buddhist and taoist materials, which possibly explains their assumption that one has to become "completely yang" and therefore their assumption that "jing -> chi -> shen -> emptiness" has to happen and that many of these systems seem to skip the replenishment of jing because it's "yin". Big mistake. To find answers on how to replenish jing, one possibly better looks at systems which have remained completely taoist and are devoid of buddhist influences...
  10. I am not sure where you are pointing at, but don't forget that your whole body and your whole system are supposed to become young and vital again.
  11. Replenishing jing is supposed to happen in the beginning of taoist training. How is a beginner supposed to be able to perform "the highest levels and stages of meditation"? Therefore, replenishing jing has to be a simple and basic method which can be understood and performed by a beginner.
  12. The masters practicing "the highest levels and stages of meditation" should be able to regain their youth then. I personally assume that replenishing jing is rather done with an extremely basic and simple form of training, but has nothing to do with gathering chi in the tantien. Fasting and low calorie diet decrease metabolic activity and aging but don't stop or reverse aging back to everlasting youth, therefore decrease the need for vitamins and minerals and decrease the burning up of jing but don't replenish it. The eight immortals of taoist legend?
  13. Empty mind meditation slows down the consumption of jing by reducing mind activity, but I don't think that this in itself increases your jing storage. Well, somehow a storage of jing is build up during pregnancy inside the embryo. As Taomeow pointed out in several threads, jing is considered to be pre-heaven / primordial anyway. Some schools differentiate between "pre-heaven" jing and "post-heaven" jing. A possible explanation is that they consider "post-heaven" jing manifestations like sperm, feelings of sexual lust etc., and as "pre-heaven" jing your "stock of vitality", which is in itself unmanifested. Like the amount of money at your bank account, which is unmanifested as long as you don't manifest it in form of buying goods (manifestations of money). Although, I personally would possibly rather consider any manifestation of jing either as chi or shen or as a combination of matter with chi and/or shen as "physical forms". Therefore, there is no "postheaven" jing in my book.
  14. I just checked the chapter 4 of the book "Taoist Yoga", which is about "laying the foundation". As far as I understand, the descibed method activates generative force (sexual energy, seemingly one of the possible "postheaven" manifestations of jing), refines it, gathers it and stores it up again. In any interpretation, this method just sets free one form of stored up energy, transform it into another, and then seemingly stores it up again, but in fact does not increase (replenish) the actual amount (sum) of stored up energy (essence, jing) and therefore can not repair the loss of stored up energy (jing, essence) that already happened over the course of one's life (through simply living, ejaculating etc.). Maybe this is the explanation that the Wu Liu Pai members claim that the method of this book lacks a fundamental part and that the described method seems not to be able to produce immortals although a lot of people practice it. According to the claims in the chapter of the book, you should already be an immortal superman who is unaffected by any weather, doesn't need to breathe etc. after "laying the foundation". ...which I assume would be true if you would successfully replenish the amount of stored up jing up to a level well beyond the level of stored up jing which you possessed at birth!
  15. Yes, here is the quote: https://www.thedaobums.com/topic/42135-damo-mitchell/?page=2#comment-734939
  16. Not ejaculating, no drugs, healthy eating, not getting drunk etc. possibly decreases the burning up of jing, but I don't think that you can replenish jing by not ejaculating. Otherwise all kinds of ascetics and monks would not age and would become immortals automatically through their lifestyle. Possibly not ejaculating saves jing / chi which would have been used up for rebuilding sperm cells and channels it into other areas like brain or immune system performance...and the other way around (therefore brain fog and feeling depleted after ejaculating)?
  17. Seemingly rather replenishing jing and not just stabilizing it is the big secret and rare knowledge. Well, as discussed above, exactly this is the dramatic misunderstanding of "inverting the course" in many popular taoist alchemy schools and which will not make you into an immortal but on the contrary, will possibly make you burn out even faster than a person who is not cultivating. If you "increase the efficiency of the jing > qi > shen conversion" then you will transform from a candle which burns at one end into a candle which burns at both ends. Your flame (chi) and its light (shen) will be twice as bright, but you also will burn out twice as fast. In the end, both sorts of candles will burn out anyway. The big secret in alchemy or taoist practice is how to add wax (jing) to the candle. This and only this is what can make a candle which never burns out and can make you into an immortal. In other words: If Damo Mitchell is teaching how to increase the conversion rate of jing -> chi -> shen, then he possibly teaches how to burn out faster and therefore he possibly teaches the exact contrary way of becoming an immortal...like so many other public schools!
  18. Perhaps we have to narrow down the list of conclusive signs & effects to "reversal of aging" then... Although, I could imagine that an increase of stored up jing might lead to a natural increase of a feeling of calm self-assurance at a physical level kind of like knowing to have a lot of money at one's bank account might lead to a similar feeling at a mental level...
  19. I have no idea. But I would probably look rather for signs like: - increased vitality - increased sexual energy - increased assertiveness - increased health - increased mental energy - reversal of aging - healing of chronic ailments - increased overall wellbeing - increased resistance against stress - increased immune system - increased recovery - increased sleep quality - increased psychological stability ...
  20. Yes, that's true. It would be interesting to know something about their method. Sadly, I don't know the answers to both of these questions but hope that people with more knowledge of classic taoist texts can enlighten us with some quotes.
  21. On a sidenote: My fascination with the topic of jing came quite natural to me, I have always been fascinated with the root and the essence of things, with things which gave me naturally a feeling of primal, original, unrefined, rooty, rustic, rugged, unspoilt, primordial, ancient, initial, substantial, dense, heavy, primeval, essential, fundamental, basic, still, prime, critical, etc. As this thread is about jing and if your focus is a similar one, for loosening up the thread a bit you can post pictures which give you personally a "jing" feeling!
  22. http://www.all-dao.com/difference-qigong-alchemy.html "The ways of Alchemy and Qigong have very many differences, but the most fundamental difference is that alchemy is the process of reverse perfection, while qigong – is a process of onward perfection." I have no doubt about the high accomplishments of these masters in ways of "onward perfection" through methods which "follow the course" and cultivate chi and shen, but I doubt that they accomplished anything in ways of "reverse perfection" through methods which "invert the course" and cultivate jing. All these known chi masters have amazing abilities but don't exactly look like young men, therefore they are obviously inable to reverse aging. I therefore doubt that they were able to replenish jing or that their schools have the methods for replenishing jing. That leads me to believe that the methods for replenishing jing are the most rare and the most secret ones in the world. I think that Taomeow said that someone who is able to replenish jing is able to play with gods on their playground. I surely agree with that.
  23. Transformed, yes, and that could also mean that previously "cold-stored up" energy (essence, jing) is now released / set free in the form of heat or vibration (chi), thereby increasing energy leakage ("following the course"). Like an amount of gasoline which is ignited...
  24. Probably the cultivation of internal power is supposed to have a similar "equilibrium" effect (decreasing or stopping energy leakage), but seemingly it does not increase essence (amount of stored up energy in the human form).
  25. Probably those techniques of "reaching a stable equilibrium" of "fire" ("Dragon") and "water" ("Tiger") in the form of "steam" are rather about decreasing (or stopping) the energy leakage than about increasing the actual amount of stored up energy, thereby only "slowing down the following of the course" and not actually "inverting the course"...