WhiteTiger

Hi 11:33, Well to be honest, I'm not exactly sure what I see as enlightenment is enlightenment. I also know very little and have very little experience with Buddhism... long ago in my childhood there was a period of time I started to refine my living as if I was going to live like a buddhist monk... I ended up failing way before I got very far down the refinement process of living that live style. Although I would personally claim when doing things on a more energetic level a more Taoist approach I found myself not having a hard time refining my life style. Anyway what I'm saying is my understanding and experience of Buddhist practices is very little. In other words, I don't feel I'm qualified to tell you what enlightenment is. Although I've heard from a Buddhist Monk that the Buddha's live, or take residence in one of the heavenly branches (which is not the deepest or highest level). He later illustrated the idea very clearly to me and said, the story of Siddhartha sat under a tree for a relatively short period of time and became a Buddha. So I would assume just by that that Enlightenment is not the end all path. I should try and find the post about enlightenment where Starjumper is having a deep talk with Lin and others about Enlightenment on this forum... They also come to the same conclusion... which when i read It i fully and utterly believed it... but based on my own experience I still had little understanding of what enlightenment truly is. I hope that helps Peace, Virtue, Sincerely WhiteTiger

Thank you very much for the information... To me that explanation sounds like differentiating between Soft wai gong and Hard wai gong. I should add I'm an extremely hard working practitioner (does a lot of hard work for the goals I'm interested in) but only given the right circumstances... Sincerely, WhiteTiger

See just with your last post Alexandrov, you gave more than enough information for Trunk to give his field of area help. (One which should surely help)

To me Enlightenment and freedom from the cycle of rebirth as you put it are two different things. Although I will say this much about energy practices, they help you get in tune with the natural order of things.

Bump

Wow great post Mat Black. I really enjoyed it. Patiently awaiting more great posts!

Its good to give out more information if your seeking for someone (whom may or may not be knowledgable enough to help out, or help identify what could be the root causes of such a problem). :applaud: Although I in no way am claiming I'm very knowledgeable in such an area... but I think answering a little more specifically relevant questions could help you determine a better plan of action to deal with the problem. (So if you don't know the answer to the question... it would benefit you to figure out the answer and maybe share it with the rest of us, in an open domain like this where multipule people with different backrounds may or may not be able to help you. You also ARE FREE to seek more private places to talk to more professionals in this field, which is highly advised... but in the mean time... figuring out answers to question I'm sure couldn't hurt if you have the time) I did a quick search to find out what Prostatitis, found on wiki (their definition of it) which claimed "Prostatitis is an inflammation of the prostate gland, in men." It also claimed "The term prostatitis refers, in its strictest sense, to histological (microscopic) inflammation of the tissue of the prostate gland, although it is loosely (and confusingly) used to describe several completely different conditions. To remedy this, the National Institute of Diabetes and Digestive and Kidney Diseases (NIDDK) devised a new classification system in 1999" (wiki defined Prostatitis Link) So I'm wondering which classification do you have? Within the last 2 to 3 weeks what are the symptoms are you having? You forgot the forth option... which is clearly to figure out more information about it... and if you already have that information share it. (It represents yourself much better on a public opened forum like this. Which will can possibly give you much more better in depth knowledge from TaoBum members.) (Honestly To lazy to double check for spelling errors or if I got my ideas across very well I may fix it later through editing tool)

I'm curious to know how do you know Master Kwan Sai-Hung?

Innerspace_cadet, personally "In my opinion" (which really only applies to me) I would stick out one until its luster ends. Very nicely said!

Your right... your words could easily been just something people could have thought on... my obvious mistake. My sincere apologize...

I hate to get into discussions about David Verdesi. Especially because I don't know the man nor never met him and DON'T HAVE ENOUGH INFORMATION to get into the whole thing. There are many talks and things on the internet that proclaim this and that about him. That being said... Its really funny how people may say something which is completely and totally not based on fact nor very well explained when they give out certain information like "This is quite a rare achievement for a Daoist practitioner and unheard of for a western practitioner. The greater implications for those who achieve this level is immortal life; the practitioner becomes what Daoists call a Xian or immortal being, liberated from the cycle of death and rebirth." 11:33 I'm not sure you can really say that they are specifically saying that David Verdesi is immortal. Infact you can easily deduce from what they say... The greater implications... First we should ask ourselves what do Daoists call a Xian? or what is at one point in history translated in english as an Immortal Being. When one says something that another doesn't understand... but in the moment when people read it... it can bring all sorts of ideas in the mind... especially in peoples ego. How many people want to become immortal if they believe they can be... How many people do you think can achieve it given hard work and how many of those people do you think truly understand what it is before they through around such a word. I thought I already said this... but its worth saying it again. 11:33 I think we should try and understand through experience what exactly a Xian is... or as some translations consider an Immortal Being. I will say this much... It seems the people that are putting out information about David Verdesi either one, doesn't fully know what they are saying. Two, aren't nearly very good with speaking in public or three, specifically talking like this sort of erratic sort of talk which may get lots of peoples attentions but many or few will actually know what it means... (three, means in other words different ways of marketing there practices)

I like your idea Little1, although to many generalizations for my taste. "That's why mystical thinking was made up, probably for the westerners like us." This mystical thinking I think is a kind of deeper subject to touch upon. One which I know leads a big hole of studying and understanding while I just have not done so to be able to explain. Anyway this post isn't meant to make you look bad and I only picked your post specifically because it came across with a lot dictating presumptions at least it seemed to me. There are many GREAT THINGS you do say in your post. For example, "It doesn't matter what the others do or how they do it." "What matters is what you do with what you have in front of you." "Dao is the source of everything, and it manifests it's power and knowledge" I especially like the last one! "The Chinese are very practical people, aren't they?" I don't think we can say all Chinese are practical people. But the ones that really have a foundation in Taoism (and Taoism influenced Buddhism, Confucianism as well as other religions found in Asia and it is after all apart of everyday natural assuming that we are abiding by the laws of nature. So In my meek interpretation it has to be evident in the family, although that may speak more about Taoist nature and life aside from the popular or known distinctions of the Monastic life, Priest like life, and hermits life of a Taoists)

Alcohol is a big discussion in my eyes! One discussion I should probably not spend so much time figuring out. Taoist Priests just don't drink Alcohol. Nor do Taoist Monks, nor Buddhism Monks. in an old post on TTB it was revealed to me that warrior dieties even now and then like the occasional wine offering. Anyway... If your meditating 4+ hours in one sitting. The means of the meditation is spirituality, meaning (as opposed to health benefits) You eat one to no meals daily... Alcohol consumption is strictly forbidden. It drastically hinders you off your goal. On the other hand... if you don't know how else to help you relax a little throughout the day. Than Alcohol is a great way to help relax a person, if you don't have other means of doing so. Although when I say this... please understand we aren't talking about lots of Alcohol here. A Taoist life or even a martial artist life is much different then the people whom seek out food to supplement what they can not achieve desired results through practicing. Although there is nothing wrong with using other means to make it easier. If I had to drink I would definately go for the darker beers just because simply they fill you up more and if I had a choice between wine and darker beer I would go with a little wine.

Just a reminder note... If any of these supposed practices of ZZ, Standing meditation, Pole standing, should all generally incorperate Stilling the mind. (some call it clearing the mind)

Traditionally Lineage holder acupuncturists (healers) privately or on the side practiced or had Neigong and Qigong. So aside from learning all the educational stuff... its important have practices of Neigong as well as Qigong.

Thank you for sharing.

HAHAHA once again I'm not very good at explaining things in words. I totally 100% agree with what your saying MythMaker. What I mean is... Through Non Action you learn to stabilize yourself. This is true practice of Wu Wei.

I really like this topic and I personally believe and think that many people have hinted very well at explaining Wu Wei... but I definitely feel that have the proper understanding through experience of Wu Wei. For a lack of perfection... I seem to feel that there is a serious lack of how everyone described Wu Wei. I personally not extremely good at explaining things at words... Nor am i instructor or even a teacher in anyway. Wu Wei has two sides to it. You doing action to preserve yourself. You doing None Action against others. This is to practice the fundamental Taoist aspect of allowing things to be natural. To adhere to the laws of Nature. Taoists even go so far as to observe nature and mimic its functional aspects. Prime example: They say Taijiquan was created by watching a Crane fighting an Ape.

Interesting, very interesting. Meridians refer to the 12 vessels right?

WOW! to generalize about similarities in approaches or different practices only speak about those similarities and not the whole practices. I mean every other little detail when i say whole practices. I do too understand how fun it is to discover the similarities of other practices. Although I do not start to feel, think or believe that they are the same all together. A++ for the information shared in this post! *bow* Peace, WTiger

ROFL, this is true Jedi777. This is why you should put much more effort and focus if your practicing infront of your teacher (at the very least) and not Yawn. I mean to help prevent yawning from acuring

Gold, I'm sure you've made many understandable once again points like you always do... Although when you really start to experience deep into Taoist teachings you start to learn that You are not playing with energy nor controlling it... You just allow yourself to access what was always supposed to be there until some disorter happened when it wasn't they any longer after birth.

*bow* Well than, maybe I had the wrong impression about you. Please excuse my ignorance and my ego. You know this is online posting, you can easily correct your spelling errors if you so choose.

through energy work you can prevent yawning... My Kung Fu teacher whom always used physiology on me, every time when i would be practicing slowly not very into it, (definately a lack of some sort of energy or energies) that I would find myself yawning... the moment i would be a second or two into the yawn he would say loudly... Are you tired? I would say no... Then he would say strongly... with some sort of change in energy would also happen... then practice... With the change in energy... i would immidately stop all yawning as if I no longer needed to. Although I may not know exactly what it is... I know Yawning is linked to some energy... and I'm sure through the study of TCM you could easily figure out how to keep yourself from yawning. (this really isn't much of a big deal also by the way) I'm sure if you look deeply into it you will find your answer.