GOOWDAY
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《庄子·齐物论》:“六合之外,圣人存而不论。”
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whatever,my job is done.
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Therefore it is not surprising that Albert Einstein and Chuangtse agree, as agree they must, on the relativity of all standards. The only difference is that Einstein takes on the more difficult and, to a Chinese, more stupid work of mathematical proof, while Chuangtse furnishes the philosophic import of this theory of relativity, which must be sooner or later developed by Western philosophers in the next decades. Lin Yutang 1942
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I don't know how big your project is,Taoism has great respect for women. When I did some research on Taoist history, I was very interested in such topics. Because of Chuang-tzu, there had been a big outbreak of Queens in the middle of the Warring States period.Every big state had a very strong female politician, which had great influence on the situation at that time,Later no longer had such phenomenon again in chinese history. Although some of the history has been revised by later Confucian scholars, there is still some information can prove that one of Chuang-tzu's students, She did a great thing, probably turned today's North Korea into a world - class power country over Thirty years. Instead of using real history as evidence, just compares Taoist and Confucian Views on women ,there should be many similar papers, I am not very interested.And it is difficult to find a gender argument from Chuang-tzu,good luck.
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Lao tse or Lao tzu; Chuang tse or Chuang tzu
GOOWDAY replied to wandelaar's topic in Daoist Discussion
Early phonetic notation is based on Cantonese, and now the phonetic notation is in accordance with Putonghua(Mandarin)。 -
The present translation technology can be close to the original translation, but word for word translation is necessary because there are too many Laozi and Chuang-tzu.
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惠子相梁,庄子往见之。或谓惠子曰:“庄子来,欲代子相。”于是惠子恐,搜于国中三日三夜。庄子往见之,曰:“南方有鸟,其名为鹓鶵,子知之乎?夫鹓鶵发于南海而飞于北海,非梧桐不止,非练实不食,非醴泉不饮。于是鸱得腐鼠,鹓鶵过之,仰而视之曰:‘吓!’今子欲以子之梁国而吓我邪?” 庄子与惠子游于濠梁之上。 庄子曰:“鯈鱼出游从容,是鱼之乐也。” 惠子曰∶“子非鱼,安知鱼之乐?” 庄子曰:“子非我,安知我不知鱼之乐?” 惠子曰:“我非子,固不知子矣;子固非鱼也,子之不知鱼之乐全矣!” 庄子曰:“请循其本。子曰‘汝安知鱼乐’云者,既已知吾知之而问我。我知之濠上也。”
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This story is written at the end of Autumn Floods, and its original meaning should be combined with the original text. Zhuangzi's relative Theory of space-time shows some strange ideas and knowledges,They are hard to be accepted ,or made people feel very mysterious. Some people,as Huizi did, just used their logic to prove that kind of knowledge should not be exist. Huizi is a logician and Prime Minister of Wei state, Wei state was once the strongest state at that time.
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a logic story: Zhuangzi and Huizi had strolled on to the bridge over the river Hao,Huizi is a logician. Zhaungzi said, " The white minnows swim leisurely, That is the pleasure of fishes." " You are not the fishes ," said Huizi, " how do you know the pleasure of fishes ? " " You are not me," retorted Zhaungzi, " how do you know that I do not know the pleasure of fishes? " " I'm not you, of course I cannot know what you know," urged Huizi, " You are not a fish either,so you cannt know the pleasure of fishes,the reasons are complete." " Let us go back to your original question." said Zhuangzi, "When You said, ' how do you know the pleasure of fishes.’ That means you already knew I knew it then you asked me. I knew it on the bridge."
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There is only one rule for Taoist logic: the natural.
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Taoism logic,at the beginning, it works without too much information, the form and content can be very vague, don't need sufficient conditions, the process of calculate and argument are not very deliberate. its reasoning process don't need to explain, do not judgment the right and wrong or the true and false. The contradictions are allow at begin,but they will transform each other at last. Maybe it don't look like a logical system, But it do work in the end.Taoism logic can deal with something unknown or unclear,even some invisible stuff.It allows to use some unusual way to solve problem.That is what I know.
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My understanding,Einstein's letter talking about the development of Western science .The Needham question related to the standards of western scientific,It is not a question years ago. There were too much arguments on this two topics,I don't want to repeat those discussions again .So we can go back to the Zhuangzi's theory of relativity , 河伯曰:“然则吾大天地而小豪末,可乎?” 北海若曰“否。夫物,量无穷,时无止,分无常,终始无故。是故大知观于远近,故小而不寡,大而不多:知量无穷。证向今故,故遥而不闷,掇而不跂:知时无止。察乎盈虚,故得而不喜,失而不忧:知分之无常也。故生而不说,死而不祸:知终 始之不可故也。" For this paragraph, more translations are needed.
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It seems that Taoists have forgotten to name their logic system.
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@ wandelaar Sorry, I didn't want to made something on logical . There should be several logical systems. Formal logic is just one of them. Taoist logic tends to natural logic, I heard it from some old Chinese scientists.If the wording of natural logic makes you unhappy, you can ignore it. Some Einstein's ideas were verified after many years. He had no qualified experimental equipment at the time.
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At that time, Mo-tse had made a formal logic similar to Aristotle. But it seems that Zhuangzi believes that Mohist logic is not perfect enough, and he like natural logic. Considering the conditions at that time, They did not have those instruments invented in the Renaissance. Einstein's ideas were verified after many years. He had no qualified experimental equipment at the time.