Jeff

Your heart is now open. Such a shift of perspective is always profound.

Welcome Lori-Anne! Can feel your good energy flowing, thanks for joining the bums.

For me, the vineyard is the world (or life), that which was given to us. We are the farmers of the vineyard. The slaves that were sent are the past prophets bringing the word of God. I think everyone can guess who the son was... Anyone who can read had better pay attention...

In the teachings of Jesus, it is anything that does not focus you more on the “kingdom of god”. Sort of like there is earthly stuff which leads to death, and divine stuff which leads to every lasting life.

Jesus speaks on this point in the gospels... “Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast ye your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn again and rend you.” ‭‭Matthew‬ ‭7:6‬ ‭KJV Basically, saying... help those who “knock” or truly desire to know, but don’t waste your time with those who don’t. Focusing on worldly things leads to a worldly death. Dust to dust. Focus on the spiritual and find what is within...

Tula, Your heart is open, but you are still more receptive and not yet transmitting/sharing energy at the heart yet. On awakening specifically, I guess it depends on your definition of the term. After expanding and transmitting at the heart, your next stage would be connecting energetically more directly to your environment and the people around you. Best wishes, Jeff

To me, there seems to be a lot of problems with the Holy Trinity concept when it was added around 300 ad. The many teachings of Jesus seem to say different than all three being equal in some way. Specifically, Jesus even says... John 14:27-28 27 Peace I leave with you, my peace I give unto you: not as the world giveth, give I unto you. Let not your heart be troubled, neither let it be afraid. 28 Ye have heard how I said unto you, I go away, and come again unto you. If ye loved me, ye would rejoice, because I said, I go unto the Father: for my Father is greater than I.

Is there anywhere in the gospels or teachings of Jesus where it talks about the three in one or holy trinity concept?

I would agree with the unique part. But, as Jesus clearly says, he is before/beyond Abraham. New covenant.

I have no doubt that what you are describing fits with the older Jewish tradition. But remember, Jesus brought the "truth" or new wine that did not fit in the old wineskin.

What version are you using? I think the point is that there is one and only one Lord God, not that the Lord is one. Here is another (King James) translation... 28 And one of the scribes came, and having heard them reasoning together, and perceiving that he had answered them well, asked him, Which is the first commandment of all? 29 And Jesus answered him, The first of all the commandments is, Hear, O Israel; The Lord our God is one Lord: 30 And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind, and with all thy strength: this is the first commandment. 31 And the second is like, namely this, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. There is none other commandment greater than these.

Could you point out the verse in Matthew where it says that?

So do you exist independently? Or are you more of a fragment of God, that gets caught up in ego stuff and think you are an individual being?

If you don’t mind, a few questions... Is not what you are describing a concept of a universal consciousness? Also, if you are acknowledging someone else as they are, is that not then effectively separate beings, and then how can you be one and whole?

The earthly body does relate to ego and desires, but it is not really the same concept as mordern ego concepts. Additionally, in the teachings of Jesus, it is not that everything is one and whole like concepts of a universal consciousness. It is much more like with Taoism where the One (and whole thing) emerges from the Dao. 2. Jesus said, "Those who seek should not stop seeking until they find. When they find, they will be disturbed. When they are disturbed, they will marvel, and will reign over all. [And after they have reigned they will rest.]" The marvel and reigning part is about seeing through/beyond your One. I will take a look at your thread and comment there.

As the gospels say, there is sort of an earthly body that dies, and within there is a higher “heavenly body” (the one that lives). One who is whole, is one who has found and integrated the heavenly body. When the heavenly body is integrated, it becomes filled with light and radiates into the world. 1 Corinthians 15:42-49 42 So also is the resurrection of the dead. The body is sown in corruption, it is raised in incorruption. 43 It is sown in dishonor, it is raised in glory. It is sown in weakness, it is raised in power. 44 It is sown a natural body, it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body. 45 And so it is written, “The first man Adam became a living being.” The last Adam became a life-giving spirit. 46 However, the spiritual is not first, but the natural, and afterward the spiritual. 47 The first man was of the earth, made of dust; the second Man is the Lordfrom heaven. 48 As was the man of dust, so also are those who are made of dust; and as is the heavenly Man, so also are those who are heavenly. 49 And as we have borne the image of the man of dust, we shall also bearthe image of the heavenly Man.

In the context of Kashmir Shaivism, conscious apprehension is the direct conscious realization of Siva. Siva in this case would similar to your parabrahman.

I think you are misunderstanding my statement and the concept of the “cage”. I am not talking about the sense of being an individual person that is somehow separate and unique.

Very, very well said. One does not break out or mentally see through some cage. It is much more like you accept it, become friends with it and then you are not bound by it.

Abhinavagupta (Kashmir Shiavism master) definitely agrees with you... "True, but even though it shines there, it has not truly become a conscious apprehension. Without conscious apprehension, even if a thing exists, it is as if it did not exist..."

I am more saying that there is always some intent (maybe subconscious) with the act of smoking. If there was not some intent/desire, there would be no smoking.

I did not mean to imply that the Dao is not one. More meant to say that the One is like a subset (or state) of the Dao.

I was not talking about “I am”, but specifically quoted your definition of non-dual with your non-doership. Your definition of minor things like addction to smoking (or porn, drugs, etc...) are to me a sign of subconscious attachments (I need a cigarette... badly ), and effectively proof that the person is not in a non-dual state. Additionally, it shows that person is not even aware of their own subconscious mental processes in the first place.

My definition would be more in line with and could extrapolate to what CT has described above. It is not really the cessation or absence, but more when one has moved beyond and the two are known to be the same, and also being and non-being are known to be the same. Or you could say that what you have described is necessary, but not complete, for all the reasons that I have articulated earlier. Your definition above is an example of “quiet mind”, and not necessarily a sign of non-dual realization. As an example, one could believe that no one is “smoking” or has a desire to smoke, while all the while really just subconsciously addicted to smoking, but won’t consciously admit it to them-self.

I think that depends on how one is defining the non-dual state. But yes, I would agree that it is much more that a quiet mind where one does not identify with subject or object.