Jeff

So on one side I have people saying I am an internet Aussie chopstick using fraud, and on the other I now have someone saying I am the all powerful energy controlling dude... Only at the bums... But, to your specific question, the person is completely stable in their own right. Additionally, the person naturally resides in “higher” (and more formless) realms than I do. I can visit, but do not live there.

Because when residing at those levels and still living in the world, the light radiates purely/directly. Being at formless levels, means that there is no construct or attachment with it. Something even the “gods” would find beautiful.

Now I am confused... Is your point here, that yes, this person has probably realized what Jeff has said... But, that level of realization may be dependent on Jeff, so that if that person cuts off all contact they may not be able to support it on their own? Is that really what you are saying or did I misunderstand?

Ok, then please explain to me how statements like the above referenced post contains a coherent argument? Or maybe better what that argument is pertaining to? It was not my goal to offend anyone, it was more like... come on, stay on topic... But, since you are offended by it, I will change the post.

My point had nothing to do with abilities (or not). We were talking about drug usage (or at least I was) and whether it leads to higher levels of realization or not. Whether a drug induced astral trip is stable or not. You seem to want to disagree, but will provide no support for your position. Please just once, discuss the actual topic, rather than make constant comments that could be negatively interpreted like “aussies having chopstick skills” or your repeated comments around “no credentials”. Thanks.

I state very clearly on all of my posts..."No worries... I am only speaking on my own authority." That being said, yes I am definitively stating my position that it doesn't work, that it is only a not very deep/astral experience. Additionally, even the belief itself that one is "in a body" and that can be affected by "drugs" in the first place shows a trapped/limiting belief. While not experienced with things like LSD, I have tried Ayahuasaca, knowledgeable of the effects and what it does related to the mind and energy body. Also, as I have repeatedly stated, I am not doubting that the people you have met have had some really cool astral trips. The trips are so fun/interesting, that most such users continuing taking/addicted to those drugs for their entire lives. But, maybe the issue is simply definition. I do not really consider astral realms a big deal, maybe that is the difference. But, astral realms are not even in the neighborhood of Dao or being one with God. On proof of my position, this is an easy one. Drug based astral trips are so unstable, they unwind with any meaningful outside energy impact and all of the self delusion comes crashing down. So CT, feel free to find yourself someone that you consider totally legit that uses psychedelics, and I will remotely change his perceived experience. Once again definitively my position... It is not possible to realize anything near clear light/Dao/God with using drugs. So says Jeff...

Good question. Never really got that specific...

Thanks for the clarification. I am saying something different. Specifically, it is not possible to use drugs to access higher levels of realization. The best you can do with it is a cool "astral" trip. False lights, not the true/clear one.

What specific clarification are you expecting? What would you like to be forthcoming that has not already come up? Additionally since the topic seems to have moved on, do you believe like Jetsun does that drugs like LSD lead one to higher states of realization?

I dont think anyone is questioning Mother Meera's good name. We are simply discussing the way Jetsun was describing what she was doing. The issue is more in the same post he made a statement about using drugs to realize God. I cannot ever imagine someone like Mother Meera telling people that using things like LSD (and other drugs) would be an effective path.

Ok. Simply put, all drugs are an inherent limiter. Can only go so deep when focused on some drug experience, and such a drug induced experience is not being one with God. I am also not saying that there is anything wrong with drugs, just saying the depth is very shallow. Drugs do not lower your defenses, they simply affect your conscious mind. Very nice to hear.

Hopefully, that was a simple misquote or lack of understanding. LSD or any form of drugs cannot bring you to God. But, drugs can definitely give you some fun experiences and trips. Again, I think you are misunderstanding what I was previously saying. Also, one does not "bring down" grace. Grace is not something beyond or above you. Grace is also not something that you can take drugs and suddenly receive.

Anything specific that you were trying to figure out or looking for?

Are you asking if I counted by continent? Or more if some continent had a higher percentage? Either way, I did not try to analyze by continent (or tradition).

If someone is on an acid trip, they are not accessing any higher or formless realms. They are simply playing around in their own mind/subconscious. Also, if it is taking a toll on the nervous system, then the person is not residing at those levels. Believing that you are person, that is somehow pulling the light through your head and out your eyes is local mind duality, and is not at all the same as being the light itself.

The mother Meera example is also totally different than what I am describing. And yes, you have been very clear on your questioning of legitimacy point. In the future, to address such concerns, I will happily offer to prove or directly “show” what I am saying is possible/correct. (and no worries Apech - I know you will never take me up on it... )

Thanks, I think such a discussion would be very interesting, but may be cleaner in a new thread of its own.

No defined term. No specific system. As, I have repeatedly (and repeatedly) stated, it was only an attempt to give some context. Yes, I realize that I was making a claim for a fellow DB. Again, as stated multiple times, the purpose was a “shout out”. No, I did not at all mean showing you directly, as I know your feelings on the topic. Additionally, such a showing would not work in such a way to give the true context of what I am trying to describe. No, you are not correct. Zero level would mean zero. Not some base consciousness or concept of “One”. Formless realms, would be “potential realms” before they have been defined in form. If they had defining characteristics, they would be form realms. I think you are completely misunderstanding what I am saying with such a question. The perceptional concept of living in a cave (or even believing you are simiply a human living on this planet) is a local (or low level form) view.

There was no trying to define some super guru concept here, or specifically say someone was personally a super guru. If you read the OP, i used the words “super guru stuff” in parenthesis, in an attempt to give some concept to the meaning of higher end “form” realms (also perspective on formless). It was an attempt to give context to the previously mentioned idea of climbing 30,000 ft up a mountain with no support and no oxygen tanks; and not just visit, but actually live there. Apech - we know each other pretty well, and if you are actually interested, and while it doesn’t exactly fit, I would be happy to give you a rough comparison it terms of relative quietness of activity in your mind.

Yes, I agree that there is always cause for such concern. Particularly, as with what we have recently seen happen with one of the leading Buddhist masters. But, I think your repeated comments here seem to be addressing some problem that does not fit the actual intent of the thread. It was simply a shout out. No plan to further announce some “guru”. No advance release of some broader point. Just me saying that something was really, really cool. Like if someone climbed Mount Everest without any oxygen tanks or supporting equipment. I would be interested, and thought maybe some other members might be too. Just simply acknowledging the beauty and joy of human potential. Like saying, have faith and believe... it is all possible.

Sorry to disappoint, but simply as stated in the OP... “The purpose of this thread is really just to highlight the accomplishment (or reality) of what one of our members has done for an extended period...” And no worries, I was also not in some way backhand describing myself (as some have asked). Just thought it was very cool, and wanted to share something that I thought was positive (and interesting) with the bums.

No offense at all. Even though that was not my intent, can definitely see how you could interpret it that way. Best to you CT.

No, your intitial Post was pretty clear. Again, just saying that it is all integrated stuff.

I apologize if I am off the mark, I have just found that usually the energy body syncs up with the physical.

Sure. The issue is really more about you both mentally and energetically holding things in. Your semen retention was a physical manifestation of the same underlying issue. Things like charity work or helping others will make a difference. Simply playing with young children or long walks in nature will help. Talking to friends or or a psychologist about your fears and issues will help. Sort of like you want to be more balanced and “outbound” instead of emotional and inwardly focused. Also, will send you a pm with some other suggestions.