Stigweard

Hiya Lin ... to keep the integrity of this project whole perhaps this post would be better in "A Gathering of Immortals" thread. I really don't think we should cross the wires and miscommunicate that such a gathering is about testing abilities which this thread is about. With respect I have reposted your comments below over into that thread. I hope that meets your approval. Regards Stig.

Posted by Lin in another thread: ------- As for setting up a 3 day lecture and cultivation series, the next step is to gather a set of guidelines for those involved to work by. Organization... Then Find a place to host. Then choose the teachers..now this one is big... Because asking a teacher to come down, is basically offering his airfare, hotel and transportation and food.... offering, meaning giving. Next part of this is getting people interested in going.. haha The idea is great, but these steps are important. When would the first meet take place...how much money is needed to spend on bringing teachers over to share their work...not to mention if they don't want to. OR Advertise! Advertise a cultivation center which is an open house for highly respected, and well sought after teachers of cultivation. Then when they apply to come and teach, those involved research the teacher's history, and service to society in terms of lectures/teaching. People will not like it, but high standards is important in today's age. Regardless of who thinks who is judging... I will not personally allow a past rapist to come to my temple and teach about cultivation. Nor would I allow a child molester come to teach in a kindergarten. Simply enough, if the teacher is indeed as they present themselves, then its a good deal. If they aren't, they don't come. Peace, Lin P.S.- Song Yong Dao has not posted on this idea for a few days? I haven't seen him here. Has anyone bothered to contact him on how he would like his, this, idea to develop? -------

LOL ... I think there is a common trait to interchange ego with 'self-importance', whereas technically, well at least in my perception, self-importance is merely an acquired feature of the ego, or sense of 'I'. I personally don't believe the ego should be 'dropped' as such, merely given a good dose of feng shui

Probably easiest in the long run to just refund his money Li Jiong

Interesting ... thanks for this.

There is a fine line of ego for sure. The intent, well at least mine, is not to 'debunk' as such nor is it to try and prove that such abilities are not possible. Because truth be told I do believe in paranormal phenomena, a belief built through my own experience and understanding. Your concerns are very valid, and I share them right along side of you. But the other extreme to unbending skepticism is blind faith and that path is likewise fraught with danger. Now Santiago has said that: "If you want to see things not work they wont. If you want to see things work and be miraculous they become that." However in this there is a danger as well because (excuse me quoting from a fictional source, but...): "People will believe a lie either because they truly want to or they fear it is true." I have seen so many people, myself included in the past, who have so wanted to believe in 'something' that they will ignore the obvious in order to hang onto their cherished fantasy. And when such fantasies gather popular sentiment then we can, and have, witness unfortunate cultural aberations. And yes of course the flipside is that people, in their desperate attempt to refute mysterious happenings, will ignore what is right in front of their eyes in order to cling to their cherished rationale. So a balanced, impartial approach is required. We should neither "want to see things not work" nor should we "want to see things work" because both of these imply an attachment to a desired outcome. Instead we should apply all discernment to see things as they truly are, neither believing nor not believing but instead endeavouring to become fully aware of the true reality of things. Should we unquestioningly believe in claims and demonstrations of powers? This approach is very convenient for 'masters' who are employing false abilities to gather more followers. And also to use such a false ability as a personal benchmark is the height of self delusion. And should we avoid applying true discerning inquiry to the teachings and practices we are being taught? Now sure we should trust our teachers and follow their instruction. But to do so without discernment creates a dependency on the source which neither honours ourselves nor our teachers. And, in my view, a spiritually independent soul lives by their own virtue. And in essence all of our teachings and practices have been passed down through aeons of trial and error experimentation. Did the sages of old wait until they were enlightened before they underwent their tests and experiments? Perhaps it was through exactly this process that they indeed became enlightened. So should I wait until I can fly through the air and walk on water before I start questioning and applying impartial discernment to the possibilities that are presented around me? Why shouldn't we question such claims of ability? So much good research has gone into the healing benefits of Qigong and much proof is prevalent about its benefits for many illnesses. So why should we then apply scientific research to one area of qigong and yet declare that the area of 'special qigong abilities' is off-limit?

Cheers Matt, t'was my thoughts on the matter as well.

Fair 'nuf, consider it dropped.

I appreciate your comment and recognise the pitfalls you accurately highlight. Thank you for your insight. So if I hear you correctly, in your opinion, these 'tests' would only be valid if, just like TCM, appropriate care was given to ensuring that they treated each individual uniquely. Am I right in saying so?

No mistake ... you can also diferentiate in this way as well as front and back. I was just giving you something to work with.

The 'best' way is self-awarenes brought about through lots, and lots, and lots, of practice. Blessings,

No need to dip them! Because they are self-dipping! Aren't they so clever.

Heya B, after a period of quiet breathing, try and feel the difference between the left side of the body and the right side. The left side is often considered Yin and the right Yang. Blessings,

Welcome baloneyx, find a seat, how do you like your tea?

Hands in prayer position _/\_

A conflagration like this presents us all with a wonderful opportunity for greater self-awareness. The whole issue started with these two comments: "I asked the question to assess if your school teaches the true method. Care to answer my question?" followed by: "Well that is assuming you know what is a "true method". what make you think that?" An argument of any magnitude will only start when both parties make an emotional investment in a fixed point of view and when those points of veiw are threatened in any way we become defensive and we more than often opt for offence as the best defence. However with both parties defending their points of view you become more entrenched and fixated to it and as such the confrontation escalates. Now add to the mix other people also feeling their points of view are 'offended' and they throw their defensive/aggressive sentiments in. And thus we find ourselves in this unfortunate stouch. But like I said, we have here a great opportunity to learn. To Procurator, I know your orginal request was straight forward and sincere but can you see how the comment "true method" made it appear you were taking the stance of "I know the real truth"? Now granted you may indeed know such a truth, but can you see how this approach grated on other people's sensibilities? To Ken and others, can you see how Procurator's comments struck an emotional chord in you which threatened you in some way? If we were really secure in our beliefs we wouldn't feel the need to defend them. To defend a point of view is an attachment to self and such attachments limit our ability to reach the fullness of awareness. So let's take a moment to dispell our invested positions, allow our awareness to expand beyond our fixated points of view and continue this united quest for Universal Truth. Blessings,

Welcome along Trixter Streetcat, find yourself a seat, perch, stone, cushion or whatever takes your fancy, how do you like your tea

I second that motion To have the Tao Teh Ching and the Hua Hu Ching in one book is valuable.

In some circles commenting on someone else's teacher like this could be considered rude. With respect,

The opening sequence sends your awareness through the major channels including arms and legs, followed by circulation through the 5 organs, then the energy of the five organs are brought together to concieve the golden light energy which is passed through the 3 Tan Tien and then through the whole body. If you make any DVD's on song gong I will grab one straight off the press. Song gong is the foundation for the Taijiquan I teach and practice. I will see if I can get a vid together of my practice and share it with you. Blessings,

You have missed the intent of this topic. Noone here, well at least myself anyway, is "looking down" on abilities at all, in fact I agree with everything you have said. If you reread the first post you will understand that my concern is how people claiming false abilities as a marketing gimmick are misrepresenting our traditions. And in truth I will follow through on establishing a draft protocol on how to test the authenticity of claimed abilities and will post it here for review and amendment.

After reviewing your website I think you chose well with the books you ordered. I still would recommend the books I mentioned to really get a sound foundation for everything Master Ni teaches. I practice the Five Clouds Meditation which is combines micro-cosmic orbit, organ cleansing/attunement and Golden Light attunement. I also have learnt his 8 treasures and dao yin. His Workbook for Spiritual Development is truly a treasure. I am an ardent practitioner of Fang Song Gong as well ... do you have any vids of your exercises? Cheers and blessings,

Hi Franklin, I have been a student of Ni Hua Ching for nearly 12 years, and, apart from my Taijiquan training, exclusively follow his cultivation methods. You can have a peek at my Cultivation Journal. The three foundation books are: ~ The Gentle Path of Spiritual Progress ~ Harmony the Art of Life ~ Enrich Your Life With Virtue You can also consider home-study correspondence courses through The College of Tao.