raimonio

I have fell in love with these first words of TTJ aswell Taoism, because it is a more gentle and natural version of Zen, although it became before it and was a great influence in the upbringing of Zen. To me Taoism doesn't have any of the negative stuff of Buddhism. Many feel that Christianity is a horrible religion because people are blamed for sin. For me, my existence has always been questioned, my feelings always doubted and never validated. When I became a Buddhist and heard it was all becase of my ego, I felt again, like my experiences were being downplayed. I started blaming my thoughts for being the ego. Just like my parents had blamed my feelings about their alcoholism to be not true. So for me Buddhism just didn't fit, although I am still a Buddhist and agree with the theory of enlightenment. I tried to become aware of everything and ended up denying my feelings and thoughts. Taoism on the other hand has no sin and no ego. It simply states very gently, the universal nature of everything, the Tao. If you don't follow it it doesn't mean theres an evil ego at work. It doesn't really mean anything, the Tao continues just like before. You can either go with it or not, but there is no guilt involved. I read Thomas Clearys "Vitality, energy, spirit" and there it describes the process of enlightenment from the perspective of energy. If you remain in Wu Wei, then the energy is stable. It is much better for me to see it from the point of energy, because there is no morale involved, no ego. Just different styles of handling your energy. The Taoist practice suits me because of similar reasons, it doesn't start from overcoming your thoughts and doing battle (by not doing it) inside your head. It starts from below, circulating energies, still resulting in the same mental state as Buddhism. At no point do you have to wonder whether it is okay to think or not, you just do something else. Today I can live in Wu Wei thanks to Taoism. I could not reach this state with Buddhism. The teaching of the story is, that different philosophies get different reactions from different people. Ofcourse one could argue that I was simply a bad Buddhist, but the question is, why force myself to do something that gives me a negative response, when I can choose another path that works right from the beginning without a massive overextending effort? So in the end. Everyone who responses to the question "Why Taoism" is a person, who for some reason has been hardwired for it. Glad to hear it from each individual

Don't you see any contradiction with the idea of being good, but avoiding people like plague? Also women having worse karma than men. Really frightening views you have

Hi, I ran to a youtube video where a guy (Oscar Hsu) talks about a "Bell Channel" and was wondering if anyone had heard of it? In my practice I always do spiraling movements and have been wondering whether there is an energetic line or something that correlates with the movement, the Bell Channel seems like a good candidate. Does anyone know about it? Did a google search and found nothing 11min 27sec

Thanks for clearing that out, must've heard wrong Found a bunch of information on the subject now. It is very interesting, because the spontaneous movements that I do seem to correlate perfectly with the extraordinary meridians, especially the belt channel, if seen as enveloping the whole body in different points like here http://globalqiproject.com/media/8ExMs/07.TheBeltChannel.pdf What can you guys say about the subject? There are some discussion about the eight extraordinary channels, but they are mostly about different practices, what about the meridians themselves?

Someone said that Buddhism goes top to bottom and Daoism vise versa, this has been my experience. I'm a head-oriented person and Buddhist meditation makes my brain go hyperactive, while Daoist practice get me rooted. This is why I feel that Daoist practices are better for me, Buddhism causes imbalances. I think everyone should try what works best for them and go with that, but there are clear differences in approach within all schools and religions. I also think that Daoism is almost completely based on dealing with energies, while in Buddhism that is evident in only certain schools and with certain techniques. Like in Buddhism you have alot of visualization, concentrating on images, mindfulness, concentrating on feelings like loving kindness, mantras etc. At the highest level it seems to be all the same. I read Thomas Cleary's "Vitality, Energy and Spirit", there you have many accounts of Daoist masters who also happened to be Buddhist masters and from what I gathered, it seemed like achieving immortality was basicly the same as enlightenment. But even when it comes to enlightenment, the Daoist masters are looking it from the point of view of energy. They say that the practitioners "energy merges with the cosmos", while Buddhist say "Your conciousness becomes one with the one" or "You let go of your ego". These are very different ways of looking at the same thing. In many cases, it seems like the Buddhists are completely oblivious to the world of energy and the Daoist have forgotten that there is also something else. Many routes to the same destination indeed.

I am fairly new to the scene, but will offer my take. Tao bums is like an endless book of information, that keeps writing itself. I have spend literally days, weeks and months just reading what the bums have offered. As a source of information I could not imagine a better source. Seriously, imagine if you had to get all the information you have got out of Tao bums on your own? Or trough experience and having random discussions with people irl? Impossible. Tao bums gave me my practice, what else can one ask

btw tried walking in the wu wei today for 3 hours, I think it went smoothly, I feel like I might be ready to breach the barrier of non-wu wei and wu wei Will have to run more tests..

rainbowvein yea I know what you mean, in Stillness-Movement we have "walking in the wu wei". Which basicly means you are in a meditative state at all times. Also I have read about enlightenment so I know what it is about, I mean technicly there would not need to be any formal meditation right? However, for some reason, unknown to myself, if I try to "walk in the wu wei" or be mindful at all times it overexhausts my nervous system and nothing good comes out of it. The only times I am able to pull it off when I read spiritual literature at the same time, so it somehow makes it happen on its own. Over the years I have simply given up and made a decision that I will let the practice take me there little by little, but I will not try to solve the whole dilemma of existence once and for all at all times. I guess it does take energy to make the change or get into that state, now ofcourse when it is done and you are in the right state of mind, you will not need energy. Now, after doing Stillness-Movement for 4months now I have actually got to a point where there have started to be moments of wu wei outside of practice, so my plan is working As a matter of fact I feel like I am coming to a crossroads, because the moments of wu wei have increased so much, that it might become possible for me to start walking in wu wei in the coming few months. Anyways, in my case it has been better to slowly change the nature of my mind, almost secretly working behind the curtains.

If I could meditate more than 1hour a day I would be doing this, if not now, then after my studies. It is my dream to go on a long lenght solitude and do nothing but meditate. I believe it would be a very powerful tool, like someone mentioned here. On the other hand I have had ages in my life, when I was really depressed and was all alone, in those kind of cases it destroys your psyche whether you like it or not. So I guess if it is planned and the person is ready, then it can be a bliss, but if not, then not

I agree with Sanson. I know exactly what you are talking about. I had a huge problem with this and still do to some extent. The solution is paradoxical, you see the more you concentrate on this problem the bigger it gets. So the answer would be to forget the whole scenario and try to be more relaxed, the better you are at forgetting this little horrible truth the more relaxed you will be and the more joy you are able to spread around. For me, the more self-concious I am the more paralyzed I am, then in comes all the negative shit. Also, you cannot blame yourself for whatever negativity you might be sending somewhere, I mean all these emotions etc. have a reason. Maybe something in your life happened that makes you have such emotions? It doesn't matter what angle you look at this, the answer is either relax, get to know yourself better or forgive yourself. Blaming or feeling guilt about this is not the answer and does not mean that you don't care for people, it is just that the answer to this dilemma is not found within the boundaries of another negative emotion. At worst this can end up being a vicious cycle where you at first become aware that you have "send negative energies around" and next thing you condemn yourself for doing so and then you feel even more negative, the whole situation falls apart, you blame yourself for that.. fast forward few years, youll kill yourself Lol okay that was a bit extreme, but hope you got the point

Good point. I think in the end it comes down to the fact that when you have an urge to preach it means there is something in reality which you cannot yourself accept, so you have a desire to change by force, you end up trying to control reality to go like you think it should be going. The occasions when there is truly a window of opportunity for change for a person are quite rare tbh. My own patience is rarely enough to wait for a couple of years for that window of opportunity, I end up preaching and then everything goes bad, I am left thinking "great, this is just what I wanted". On the other hand I feel guilty if I dont preach, because then I wouldn't be giving them the opportunity and information. And ofcourse sometimes, like munky said, you do it just so you can appear to be right and wise, which is pretty far from actual wisdom

What about a Daoist take on the list?

It would mean the world to me

Wow thanks

I have received a healing from both chris d and clarity, both times it worked, so I can recommend these guys and the system

Theres alot of evidence that the last ages have indeed ended trough a catastrophy. It isn't just the Mayans, some Yuga guys are on the same boat and are saying that the ages were downgrading. Going from better to worse, but now the change will go upwards. The traditionalists say that Kali Yuga lasts for more than 400 000 years but I'm not buying that, there are other takes on the matter by respected people. For example the fact that the Mayans have basicly the exact same predictions than the guys who are saying that Kali Yuga is not 400 000 years makes me lean torward the smaller cycle model. http://theyugas.com/2012-the-mayan-calendar-and-the-yugas/ What I'm hoping is that as the ages go upwards there isn't a need for a total wipe out. I mean how else could an age go downwards if the cultures had all the knowledge from the age before? The wipe outs were in a way necessary to make people forget what they knew, to truly have a "lesser" age. But what about now? It makes sense that to raise onto a greater age it would be handy to accumulate the knowledge. This is just me playing with ideas and hoping the world wouldn't end The documentary was mainly about Wandering Wolf as a person, it did talk about the situation at hand when it comes to the Mayan calendar but the emphasis was on this great teacher and sage. He is truly a profound person.

I appreciate your advice, but I have a long history with this disease and have tried everything, I have data of what has worked and what has not. I tried healing this condition purely on nutrition for 2 years, didn't work. Also physical exercise for me is the worst, used to go against the disease going to the gym, jogging, doing martial arts etc. My condition only worsened. Going on light walking trips is the same. My body is filled with toxins and the most efficient way of getting rid of them is to fast. The body has reservoirs of energy in fat and because I have eaten so much raw food and vegetables my cells have all the nutrients needed for a long time after I stop eating. Fasting is the most efficient natural way to cure any disease. For westener this thought is a very unsettling and unorthodox one. But it has been proven again and again. This is my third fast. The previous fasts did not take me back, but further. So I have data on this aswell. I have proven that nutrition alone does not work for me. It did take me miles forward but was not a complete cure. If 0% is where I was then I am now at 60-70%. With fasting I'm gonna take it to 100%. While eating the body uses over 50% of the energy at hand for digestion and all these things that don't heal you, when you fast the body uses all the energy for healing. The first thing any animal does when it gets sick is stop eating. They fast until they are cured, this is the natural way. Also I switch between low carb and raw. I was one year on raw and it did not heal my condition. This is a bit off-topic, but I hope I got you convinced

Thank you mate This what I'm doing, currently on a water fast. A few Taoist healers have said that my condition is about having too much toxins in my system and it does make alot of sense when looking at my history. It is still a long road. I hope that by the end of the summer I will be completely healed. I will do fasting, raw food and low carb food with alot of vegetables and ofcourse practice. When it comes to remaining motivated in your practice, daydreaming is sometimes good

Watched it, impressive. Wandering Wolf's compassion came right at you trough the screen. An inspiring documentary.

1 hour every day, if didn't have cronic fatique would be doing more :/

I would also advice you to just read alot of books, roam the forums, try to get a view of different practices and views. Choose what feels best for you and then start testing the different techniques that interest you. On one hand you should educate yourself on the subject as much as possible, but on the other you need to get your feet wet. If there is nothing at your location then you must prepare yourself for a trip at some point. Many techniques you can learn from a DVD and it might be a good plan to start out that way, test the different techniques and see what fits you the best. Just get on the train and let it take you where ever. But I must say that after years you might find yourself to be in a place where you never thought of being. Like for me it was Buddhism all the way, but I turned out Daoist. Spring Forest Qigong comes to mind if thinking about a safe system that can be learned on DVD and has a good hype surrounding it. Then ofcourse I must recommend my own practice Stillness-Movement, but with that a live transmission is recommended. I don't know many books on Daoism, but can recommend Anthony De Mello's "Awareness" which is about awareness and all the books of the Dalai Lama. The truth is, that the greatest source of knowledge is found among the bums of the Dao, so make this place your home. Wonder if Mr. T has figured out the name of the book he was talking about, would like to read it aswell

It seems like this thread is the place to be if you want a PPF. After contemplating on the issue for months, I wish to ask for the masterous moderators for a PPF.

Yes ofcourse. Buddhism surely is not a religion or philosophy of guilt, nor does it lead to it if applied correctly. But there in lies the problem. In practice there is alot of guilt that alot of people are experiencing because they are not enlightened enough. Within their minds they are going "I have a negative feeling, it means I am not enlightened enough" and then they try to become aware of the situation which can lead to liberation of it but sometimes they fail. Sometimes the feelings are so harsh that the actual cure would be much more simple. For example if you have been within your apartment for three days and have done nothing but been on computer and your anxious, you have two options, become aware of the feeling and try to beat it like that or go outside. Also if a person is having a bad feeling like if his girl friend has just left him would you go to him and say "dude, thats just an illusion, become aware of it and thats it". Life does not work like that, but still many people try to do it because they want to be good Buddhists. I'm not saying Buddhism is evil, I'm just saying that the effects of the philosophy are not always good. This is not an attack on Buddhism itself. Its easy to forget normal life and normal solutions when you are trying to solve everything by being an extremely advanced practitioner. It happens, just saying Sinansencer was feeling bad and wondered whether it would be okay to think about samsara and if it truly is a negative thing. I wanted to help him and felt that he did not need the mandatory spiritual speech, but a more down to earth one. Does Buddhism truly have a view of samsara? A negative one? Or does Buddhism state "all views are an illusion, therefor samsara as a thought or view is not negative nor positive"? Yet 99% of Buddhists view samsara as negative in their heads, why? They are not enlightened. See, the effect of Buddhism. In some cases it does make you have a view even if it does not mean to Do you not agree, that while Buddhism itself is quite perfect, in some cases it can still have adverse effects before you reach enlightenment and greater wisdom? Have you never yourself experienced such? I think you might've misunderstood me, Buddhas words are golden, but it takes time to learn to truly apply them. We are all clumsy at first Admittedly the comparison between Buddhism and Taoism was uncalled for and the guilt analogy might've been poorly expressed.

many times the idea of enlightenment is used as a way to deny your feelings and thoughts before enlightenment it might be a good idea to give some value to the teaching of modern psychology which state that every emotion is precious and comes bearing with a message etc there is alot of guilt to be had from Buddhism for everyone who is not enlightened and this is why I chose Taoism which I find to be way more gentle if you feel bad then thinking about samsara is a very natural thing IMHO and you should not blame yourself for that it simply comes with the situation but it will pass just like any other problem or emotion and at the end of the day did you loose something by having the thought of samsara with the negative feeling? my keyboard is broken cant have all the keys

Wow, this truly inspires me to read Chuang Tzu. Funny how there is no mention of the guy in the university when the discussion is around politics although he seems to have nailed it