Tibetan_Ice

Hi Aaron There you go again. Imposing your views on others. You just have no idea do you? Radical lessez faire. Just let go of everything and that will take you there. To emptiness. Well, you are wrong. You did not ever perceive emptiness, nor do you even know how to get there. Your practice, what you've described will lead you straight into the substrate consciousness where you will stagnate, fall into laxity and dullness, mistake it for emptiness and think you've accomplished something. You've accomplished nothing. The acid test is like Alan Wallace says. The experience is authentic if it liberates. No liberation? No awakening. If you took a moment to read the many buddhist books that are out there, you know the ones I'm talking about.. the ones with maps. But then, you wouldn't know that. You think maps are bad. Well radical rationalism will get you nowhere. Entropy is your elixir. It all falls apart. There is a reason why people follow teachings and maps. It is because some people have learned certain methods and ways based on their experiences, and they have the capacity and intention to convey that knowledge to others. We should be grateful that other people have written maps. Knowledge is a benefit, not a detriment as you so foolishly have been supporting in your radical posts. A silent mind state is not emptiness, it is not awakening, nor is it anything useful. As a matter of fact, it is regarded by most Buddhists as intellectually damaging. It makes you stupid. You are a prisoner of your radical belief system. Why don't you try letting go of that for a change and follow somebody else's map? You know, the Buddhists who become rainbow bodies. The ones that draw pictures of cows on the wall and then milk them, producing real milk. The ones who have realized true emptiness. I have seen other posts of yours where you declare that you have realized emptiness. I do not believe you. I'm sure others here don't either. From a few of your posts I would say that you don't even believe yourself. But, if you believe that sitting in silence is emptiness, then perhaps you have realized silence. But that is not emptiness. Had you realized emptiness, you could walk though walls, you could turn into a rainbow body at will. You could manifest forms at will. You could tell me what I look like. You would know your previous lives. After all, life is only a dream. It's all space and light, smoke and mirrors. Instead of trying to spread your brand of enlightment, your erroneous methodology, your bad advice, why don't you learn about the proper progression of events that occur during breath meditation? If you had proper breath meditation techniques, you would have learned that by calming the mind, the breathing slows, the mind calms even more and then the breath seems almost nonexistant. It lets go all by itself without any conscious effort of letting go. At that point, you switch from the 'learning sign' -nimitta to the counterpoint sign (which may look like a star, a sun, a ball of light). After you gain stability in that, the counterpoint sign engulfs you and your coarse mind dissolves into the substrate consciousness. The substrate consciousness is that which continues from life to life. The substrate consciousness is the alaya. That is the silent state that you are trying to teach everyone to remain in. But it is not so silent. It's not even not the final goal. If you stay in the alaya too long, your awareness will degrade and morph into dullness and laxity. Beyond the substrate is Primordial Awareness. The realization of that is the realization of emptiness.. The proper procedure is not to "let the conscious thought of breathing go" as you suggest. The proper procedure is to cultivate attention on the breath, and sustain it. Vitakka and Vicara. It is not a letting go. The letting go, the dissolution will occur if you follow the proper steps. And when you say "eventually you can begin your meditation without having to focus on anything, but simply entering a silent-mind state." this is not a goal, it is not a good thing. You've trained yourself to sit in dullness and laxity, probably stilted your intelligence and cut short your spiritual development. Now, I'm not going to educate you as to the proper Buddhist breathing meditaiton techinques. But I will say this. Silence is not a goal as it pertains to "no thoughts". Part of what you will discover as your progress in proper techinique is clarity, vividness of thoughts. Absence of thoughts is not a goal as there are always thoughts, or forms. But when the center of your awareness becomes very clear and you can see each thought, clear and separate, dissolve into the luminous space, you are getting closer. You know, nobody ever got entlightened by your method, just letting go. Letting go is a form of aversion. Sustained mindfulness is the key. Sustained awareness. Neither averting nor grasping. It requires relaxation and sustained attention. 24/7. That is the goal. That is what most all teachings teach. I suggest you look into it. Your "Silent Mind Meditation" is bad advice and you should seriously consider the effects of what you write on others. Or if you insist on pushing your brand of spiritualism, then maybe instead of copping out and avoiding revealing your wisdom from realizing emptiness as you continually do, you could tell the rest of us about the fruits of your brand of practice so that we may assess the validity of your claims, especially the realization of what you call "emptiness". (Actually, I'm not all that interested in hearing about it anyway because I've seen the fruits of your practice in most of your posts.). Good luck in your journey. I think you'll need it. TI For anyone else who is interested in learning proper breath meditation I would suggest reading Shaila Catherine, Ajahn Brahm, Alan Wallace, Dudjom Lingpa, anything on Dzogchen preliminary practices or any other of the serious Buddhists with maps to follow.

Hi Vmarco. Why do you keep cutting and pruning the quote to suit your needs? Did you cut out the "Most of" because you are afraid to admit that Lao Tzu did acknowledge that some religions are in fact authentic? Or is that you don't want to discuss the other point of view? I personally do not wish to discuss it. You do realize that the Don Juan/Carlos Casteneda books are fiction, don't you? Although the essence of the practices such as 'gazing', losing self importance, looking for one's hands in dreams, becoming a warrior, finding a power spot etc have been culled from various sources and are powerful practices in their own right, there is much lost in the assembling of the story book. For one, practices are better understood within the culture and context from which they originated, wouldn't you agree? And that's just a polite way of implying that Carlos Casteneda was a liar. Oh, and someone who is impeccable doesn't have spelling mistakes or bad grammar, do they? TI http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pDrKI8nIMDc

Hi SJ, It sounds to me like they are distinguishing between conceptual consciousness and that which does not conceive. http://rywiki.tsadra...x.php/rnam_shes It's no big deal. I was just curious, that is all. I appreciate all the time it has taken to cut and paste these topics. Thanks. All the best. TI

Hi Simple Jack I liked that link to the Pali. The thing I have been thinking about is this: The elements or six properties must be impermanent. Therefore, does that mean that consciousness (within the context of those writings) is also impermanent? And again, if consciousness is infinite, non-created, unborn, the true reality, how can it be reduced to an impermanent element like air/fire/water/earth/space? In Bon, there are the five lights (not six). I can agree that "wind" is mind, as it is said in other teachings that prana is mind, and when the prana flow stops, there is no mind. But within that context, what remains is something other than mind, and it is often called awareness. But I liked the part when it says: http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka/mn/mn.140.than.html In my mind, "fabricated" is something you build out of the five elements. So isn't the so-called sixth element the fabricator (when it grasps) and the elements are actually the fabricatees? But again, we are in another realm with slightly different terminology, different usage of the words and terms, so really who knows what anyone is talking about let along compare from Dzogchen to Buddhism.. TI

Hi Simple Jack. What is the sadadhatu? The only place using Google that I can find a reference is off the Dharma Wheel. I would prefer to see the meaning from a source other than Malcom, just for comparison. Is it spelled correctly? Thanks. TI

And when someone who knows speaks, it is understand by all, each in their own way, regardless of their mother tongue.

Hi Seeker, That definitely is a clue that something is wrong with AYP's (or Yogani's) perspective. So many teachings indicate that you must develop minfulness 24 hours a day. In AYP, you do your practice and then forget about it. In classic teachings, you eventually turn your whole day into a mindfulness practice. That is the main key. Being aware 24/7. So many teachers stress the importance of bringing your spiritual perspective and meditative state into the real world. But not Yogani. Up one step, down five. Snakes and ladders. Yogani missed that. There is proof that he misses that continualy too. If you read his book on Self Inquiry, he assumed that Ramana's practice is simply to ask the question "Who am I?". He totally missed the point that Ramana is not saying that you do self-inquiry twice a day for 20 minutes, Ramana is saying that you must do that constantly. Big Difference. Besides, the AYP method of Deep Meditation (or TM) will only keep you bouncing in and out of the substrate consciousness, the Alaya. Like Alan Wallace says, the Alaya is ignorance, the ground of samsara. One has to go beyond, shatter the substrate and realize the Primordial Pure Awareness. You aren't going to do that by training in laxity and dullness.. You know, the hard part about AYP is that when you have pruned your forum, gotten rid of all the dissidents, and have a team of parrots and brownosers all saying the same thing posting on the forum, it produces allot of pressure to believe and conform. It seemingly gives AYP credibility. It is just not right. It's kind of like AYP is the "earth is flat" club, and if somebody else doesn't tell you that that is not true, you fall victim to the belief. For example, the cultivation of ecstatic conductivity in AYP is actually the cultivation and grasping of hedonism. Hedonism is one of the five obscurations in Buddhist teachings. It clouds the mind. It is a veil. In Buddhism, you try to eliminate the veils, not cultivate them! Yogani has no idea what he is doing to people. TI

Hi Mike Actually, Geshe Tenzin Wangyal Rinpoche has a broadcast today https://www.ligmincha.org/retreats/live-internet-teachings.html Sunday, Dec. 30, 2012 3:00-4:30 p.m. Eastern Time U.S. (New York time) TI

Hi Turtle Shell You know, I'm open to hearing about it. I'll just say. I have had kundalini for about 8 years now. It hasn't gone away. Just today, I did three recitations of the mantra while focusing on the third eye, and for the rest of the day I just cooked. I nearly approached that old "reality looks like a bare raw wire that I just sent 220 volts through". Raw, wide awake, crawling the walls. I've taken Kunlun with personal transmission and the experiences that I've had would make anyone think I was psychotic/schizo. (But I love it). But Kunlun didn't make my kundalini go away. If anything, it opened up the upper part of the body (nadis/channels) so that kundalini could get up there more easily, especially the third eye. So, perhaps you could describe what your kundalini symptoms were, what kind of experiences you were having, mental abnormalities etc.. How long, (years), how intense, etc.. and how you know that it was kundalini. Also, please describe your level of experience with Kunlun. Did you recieve the transmission? From who? How often did you practice? What were the effects? Do you have no more kundalini symptoms now? It really would be a great thing if Kunlun cured Kundalini, but Kundalini isn't a disease, the symptoms are or can be, well, serious stuff. The whole point of kundalini is to send it up through the crown so it showers down around you, (or take it back down to the heart.. it can live in the head or the heart) which is something that Mike doesn't want to do. He is scared of too many sleepless nights, night astral body dissociations, brain fog, etc.. the typical kundalini overload stuff. And I don't blame him. So if anyone believes that Kunlun will "cure" kundalini, I would love to hear about it. There are so many people on this forum who would benefit from it. One of the reasons I'm not too thrilled about Kunlun is that I've seen posted on the website that if you have some kind of sickness or disease, you will not be allowed to take Kunlun. They only want practitioners who are sincere about learning the art, not just interested in curing their ailments. So, that isn't going to help Mike at all. (Even though I've read stories about Max curing several students of specific maladies). I think what Mike needs is a good swift kick in the a$$ to go see a true professional healer/guru/shaman/Dzogchen master. TI

Hi Mike, Kunlun is not a remedy for kundalini symptoms. The aspect of the downward flow is not that it grounds energy into the feet, or into the earth. The downward flow in Kunlun is from above the Crown to the heart. It is the water method. You should not do Kunlun, it will only make things worse with your kundalini. And, the heat just opens channels/nadis making kundalini flow around, and probably into places you don't really want it to go. You have been given advice time and time again about your condition. The best advice has been to seek out a healer/shaman/guru who has experience with this type of problem. It has been months and you have not taken that advice. You will never heal yourself because 1) You don't have the interest or discipline to perform spiritual practices (this is not your fault). 2) You don't have the training to perform spiritual practices correctly (this is not your fault). 3) You are interested only in the baser hedonistic pleasures which most spiritual practitioners are trying to avoid or transcend. You are walking into Heaven here and asking directions on how to get back down to Hell. You have been posting time and time again, yet, you don't take the best advice. Instead, you feel it is ok to take everyone's time, you ask questions which do rile some spiritual practitioners, you don't give them the full background and history of your situation and you just keep coming back for more and more. The best advice to you is get professional help from an authentic healer/shaman/guru. I have heard many stories about how one touch or proper shaktipat can ground the kundalini for you. You have to get over your trust issues. But now that I think about, it, maybe that isn't going to help either unless you decide to change your lifestyle. Your lifestyle activated your kundalini. Lust, sex, anger, passion and excessive exercise are what caused your kundalini to activate. Even if someone grounded it for you, unless you learn to work with it instead of against it, kundalini will just keep coming back. I sincerely hope you do get better, but I don't understand what the point is of asking endless questions when you do seem to want to take the best advice. Go get professional help. TI

Hi Malikshreds Thanks for your comment. If you mind is too excited, then you should seek a remedy. This is what Alan Wallace suggests: http://www.mandalamagazine.org/tag/b-alan-wallace/ So, the remedy for excitation is bliss. Have you ever gotten to the point in breath meditation where you merge into the counterpart sign (star) and go into a jhanic state? With all due respect, the experience that I talk about on this post is precisely that, having finally succeeded... Good luck with your meditations. TI

Hi Simple Jack. The way I interpret your statement, is that I am somehow "reifying" subtle energy. Where did you jump to that conclusion? Isn't that kind of an insult? I mean, to reify means to grant a form some kind of intrinsic identity separate from mind. And putting me in the same group as Jeff? Thanks a lot! (no ego here.. lol) Reminds me of the show "The Thing" where they are all tied down in chairs, sitting next to each other, and suddenly, one discovers that the person they are sitting next to is really the alien. Perhaps you should examine the topic a little closer. This is the link where I learned that Malcolm has nonconventional (counter to new-age thinking about prana) views about prana vayu. I mean, he says things like prana vayu only comes from the air. This is not what new-age, nor even Taoist thinking says about chi/prana/energy. The Tibetan medical idea is that the finer vayus are transmuted by the body into more refined levels. Now, I'm not debating this idea. Lately, I'm of the opinion that the five lights of knowledge in the heart manifest our reality, and what happens after that is anyone's guess. Anyway, here is the link to the discussion about vayus with Malcolm. You will see that the new age view is contrary to the Tibetan medicine view. http://www.dharmawheel.net/viewtopic.php?f=40&t=3979&hilit=namdrol%2C+vayu TI

Hi C T You know, I don't know much about all of this. I'm just learning about the fine intricacies of the myriad of varieties of Buddhism. Yes, it appears that Allan Wallace's viewing the mind instructions are from Padmasambhava (I think he borrows from various places, though, because I don't think Dudjom Lingpa is Bon), and I found this out about Padmasambhava: http://www.treasuryo...masambhava/7442 and this from the wiki: So , I guess "Heart Drops of Dharmakaya" and Alan Wallace's pointing out instructions from Padmasambhava, and the Tenzin Wagyal Rinpoche book called "Healing with Form, Energy and Light" are all Bon. I like Bon because Bon in French means "good". And we all know what bonbons are Thank you for the link to the book. I read the web page. At the end it says that it is a restricted book. so I'm pondering about how to get a transmission, or what exactly has to happen. Kind of a pricey book too, but I guess if it has to come all the way from Nepal... The thing that has got me know is that while I was reading the "Healing with Form, Energy and Light" book today, specifically when I was reading about how the five lights/everything are/is sacred, my heart opened up and I could see the world (my living room) as if all individual objects were lit up like under a black light. It is some kind of 'heart viewing' or something. Kind of like a kundalini episode but without the overload. So, now, I've spent the day going back and forth from normal viewing to heart viewing the sacred elements and the wonderful manifestations they perform. So, I don't know what I should do. I've lost the thick white light in my breath meditations, now I only have this open luminous space which i think is the vacuity of mind being lit up by the substrate consciousness.. I kind of like the Bon because it incoporates the heart, the channels, visions, tummo and everything I'm familiar with, and most importantly, the heart. I'm not in a part of the world where I can drive to visit the gurus to get transmissions, (and I have a regular job to maintain) so i guess I'll just have to visit them astrally for now.. Thank you very much for your response. Best of luck on your journey. TI

Hi C T I was listening to Alan Wallace's podcast #14 again. He specifically says that the "Gap between thoughts" is the alaya, the substrate consciousness. It is not "pristine awareness" nor is it the Primordial Consciousness. Did you even listen to any of the podcasts? And, in retrospect, in Bon Dzogchen, there is not the conventional route of "ground, path, fruit". It says that specifically in "The Heart Drops of Dharmakaya". So, calling my interpretation of Dzogchen more of a completion stage just didn't make any sense. You were using Buddhist conventions to qualify my interpretation, when in Dzogchen, those conventions do not exist. Just thought I'd mention that. TI

Hi Creation Thanks for that. I did some research on Malcolm. http://www.kripalu.org/presenter/V0006111/malcolm_smith http://tsegyalgar.org/localcenters/tsegyalgareast/tsegyalgareastcale/birthlifeanddeathw/ This last link is pretty good. Seems like a fairly intelligent individual.. http://www.tricycle.com/p/1977 In it, he says things like this: TI

Hi Alwayson My response was in reference to your statement that "From the Vajrayana point of view, meditation is contrived and conceptual." You must have missed that. Don't we all know that the highest form of meditation is called non-meditation? And that the prelimiary practices are called "meditation"? Dzogchen is realizing the view, then staying in the view. But if you haven't cleared away the five obscurations, good luck with that. The main point is that in Vajrayana, they do call it "meditation" in the preliminary practices. Now you're talking about karmamudra? Ok. Let's talk about karmamudra. You are saying that "it is karmamudra", not Karma Kagyu. Let's take a look. link: http://www.khandro.n...gyu_schools.htm So, it looks to me like karma mudra is found in the Kagyu lineage. What exactly are you saying? Wait, I have no desire to know. If karmamudra is found in the Karma Kagyu, what is the difference? The practice must be similiar or not between most lineages. However, it is still the same word: karmamudra. Now, I'm not really interested in the differences between the meaning of the word in the different lineages. If you thought that was important, then you should have elaborated. But, evidently, by your post, you didn't seem to think that was important at the time. But wait, you did talk to someone about that at the Dharma Wheel, didn't you? And Tsongkhapa too! I guess that was before you decided to respect the Dalai Lama's wished and shun Tsongkhapa.. http://www.dharmawheel.net/viewtopic.php?f=77&t=4588 And then further down in that thread it says: So, if karmamudra is not important in Dzogchen and essence mahamudra, why do you recommend it to me? Are you giving me bad advice (not that I would now believe anything you say)? Once again, although it was interesting to do some research, I have found that not only have you wasted my time but now you are appearing as insincere. All and all it's just another brick in the wall. TI

Alwayson, I'm getting tired of your incomplete blanket statements that explain nothing. This is what is said about your miniscule sentence: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karma_Kagyu So, although the "fruition of the path" is beyond any acts of contrived meditation, the early practices, such as shamatha and vispassana are called "Meditation". You are just jerking everyone's chains again. And, Malcom? He's the guy that thinks that nadis are parts of the physical body. I can see see why you like him. He usually says one or two very short comments, just like you, that don't explain much at all and leave the questioner to do their own research. That's fine if you like that style. I don't care for it at all. It's too arrogant and condescending. TI

Hi Alwayson Thank you for dropping by to throw another brick.. Yes, mundane, isn't it? So tell me, what is different from my little star and the star you declared as the pinnacle of Buddhist and Hindu Yoga? And do you still think that the AYP star, the one that they ignore, is the same star as in Thogal? http://www.aypsite.org/forum/pop_printer_friendly.asp?TOPIC_ID=4541

Hi Anamatva I'm glad you explained "rushan" because I had it confused with the Dzogchen practice of Rushen. Here is a link: Also, doesn't that posture in the image look suspiciously like a posture out of the Kunlun book.. I think it was the "Travelling posture or the grass gliding posture".. or something like that. http://books.google....Rushen"&f=false TI

Hi Anamatva Thank you for your comments. According to Shaila Catherine (and Kenneth Folk), once you can get to a jhana, you can go directly to it any time, directly. Ajahn Brahm, on the other hand, says that it is linear and you must go through the stages. So, I don't know. But I abandoned the bliss and joy stages a while back.. Although they are very nice and seductive, they are actually kind of coarse and breed attachment.. I'm not much of a hedonist. I really have no idea where I was other than I went through the series of events successfully this time. Also, even it is a linear progression, there is no mention anywhere of how long you have to be in one jhana before progressing to the other. I think I've heard it mentioned that if you have enough intertia, you can sometimes zip right past the lower jhanas.. Also, when I hit that final stage, there were no senses, the body and the senses were long gone.. and I have read that the mind will keep producing thoughts and forms all the way up until the Cessation jhana.. so that follows.. Thank you for the link. I've added that book to my Amazon Cart. Looks like a good one.. Unfortunately, I don't have a Lama to tell all of this to. I do wonder what one would say.. TI

Hi Anamatva, C T and others Having accepted that there are indeed two definitions for the term "rigpa", perhaps a baby rigpa and a mother rigpa, I listened to Alan Wallace's 26'th podcast. It contains a guided meditation which is Padmasambhava's meditation of introverting and expanding awareness: (the second meditation on that podcast). Alan Wallace makes the analogy that this meditation instruction, that of inverting awareness in towards the mind and then expanding it outwards, is like using a battering ram to break on through to the other side. Now, Alan Wallace has a PHD in religious studies, was the Dalai Lama's personal interpretor and has lived the Tibetan life style for over 16 years. I don't think Alan Wallace is making this up, nor is he misleading anyone. My conclusion is that there are various levels of comprehension that are exhibited by various teachers, and various levels of initiation into their various views. (the three "V"s) LOL I have been reviewing "Heart Drops of Dharmakaya" and I found this next text in the "Practice of Trekcho" section (bolding is mine): So, it appears that there are not two but three descriptions of awareness (rigpa). I'm opting for the idea that Alan Wallace's rendition of Padmasambhava's meditation instructions are addressing the third meaning of the term "rigpa", being Primordial Awareness. And, anyone who mentions rigpa as a form of Vipassana is defintately of the second meaning. No wonder all the confusion... C T, those were interesting links that you posted. Thank you very much. Anamatva, you said: My belief at this time is that no Dzogchen master can transmit the recognition of Primordial Awareness, for, if they could they could transmit enlightenment. If it were possible to transmit enlightenment (as C N Norbu claims that it is not possible), then surely all the enlightened beings in the world would have enlightened the rest of us. What I think is occuring is this: The Dzogchen masters are passing the "child rigpa" on to the initiates' substrate consciousness. It is then up to the initiates to make this introduction manifest into the "mother rigpa" or true Primordial Consciousness by correct practices. Well, on to podcast # 27. TI

Hi Anamatva, It is just like Alan Wallace said. The substrate consciousness is a state of bliss, clarity and non-thought, but the primordial ground is also bliss and clarity. This kind of follows suit: link: http://www.rigpawiki.org/index.php?title=Dzogchen As well, this follows the general trajectory of the path of jhanic realization. The bliss and joy of the first jhana must be abandoned in order to progress to the second jhana.. and so on.. If one does not abandon the clinging to the coarse sensations, one will never get to the fourth jhana of equanimity, let alone the 7'th or 8'th jhanas. But I think the key here is not clinging or averting.. I think many Dzogchen texts have said that already.. Well, if we believe that rigpa can be simple awareness as well as the Primordial Ground, then I can see that there is room for confusion. However, there is no mention of the experience of transition or realization of enlightenment in that whole article, so one should not assume that there is no 'pop' or 'boom'. Alan Wallace and other sources have stated that there is a transition stage of passing through a state where it feels like death, the substrate shatters and the self loses footing. The other very interesting things that were pointed out in that article, to me, are these: Yes, primordial wisdom is rigpa. But there are two meanings of the term rigpa, the second is the simplified: 'awareness'. C N Norbu emphatically states that you cannot make someone enlightened. Therefore, according to Padmasambhava's statement, no Dzogchen master can empower someone else to realize rigpa, because the recognition of rigpa results in enlightenment. This is sort of implying that Dzogchen masters can only point to it, not transfer it. I can see why some teachers have resorted to using the simple meaning of rigpa as "awareness". Or is it the case where enlightenment is just hiding behind the veils, and we can occasionally see it through the cracks in the veils? A little confusing here.. So, this seems to be some kind of contradiction to me. Surely, if we are already enlightened, a Dzogchen master can remove the veils, if not temporarily, but by removing the veils temporarily that would make us realize our enlightenment, which is not possible, so these statement don't make sense to me. The next interesting point that I found in that text is: I have to wonder about that statement that Shamatha doesn't have the lucidity to it. Alan Wallace says that the three components that we cultivate in Shamata is relaxation, stability and vividness. Perhaps that is the practice round to develop the substrate consciousness, but it would indicate that you can have Shamatha and lucidity.. The section on dissolving emotions is very similar to Eckhart Tolle's method of dealing with the pain body. Eckhart is one smart cookie. Who'd have thought he knew something about Dzogchen practices? And this last one, I discovered while browsing today. It concerns the visions which are obtained during the practice of Trekcho: link: http://www.rigpawiki.org/index.php?title=Dzogchen It says "These visions are naturally ready to arise from within the central channel that joins the heart to the eyes." This is a very profound statement to me. Not only does it suggest that the heart plays a role in the visions, but that the channel from the heart to the eyes must be open. When I first saw that text I thought of tummo, vase breathing or kriya pranayama (the practices of opening the central channel with heat). Then I considered that heart seems to be the seat of consciousness, referring to the experiences I have had with using the love from the heart for remote viewing.. Then I thought of that end point for the path to the eyes, is actually from the heart to the third eye. There is something very profound with that statement.. All is well. TI

Hi Anamatva and C T I have found a very interesting article about Dzogchen, which has answered many of the questions we have been discussing. It seems that C T and I are both right about the dual interpretation of the term "rigpa", according to this article anyway.. http://www.kamakotimandali.com/blog/index.php?p=1110&more=1&c=1&tb=1&pb=1 The whole article appears to be quite good because things are said in it that really resonate with me. For example: the idea that emotions are particularily good to dissolve because they feed "rigpa". I have found that to be true and it is nice to see that premise confirmed in writing. Emotions, when focused on directly until the meaning or head of the emotion dissolves releases quite a bit energy. But on to the 'meat'. It is not so wrong to use a simplification of the term "rigpa" and simply call it "awareness", is it? Perhaps not. This next part of that article says this: Really the whole article is really good. I will have to digest it and see how it appears after some contemplation. I would also like to verify the sources. (which reminds me, C T, it would be nice if you posted links or sources to your quotes.. ) C T, thanks for the discussion. It has helped (and hopefully others) gain a better understanding of the varieties of Dzogchen teachings and interpretations of obscure terminology. All the best. TI Well, on to 24 and the nyams of practice..

Hi Ananamatva Being the stickler that I am, I noticed that your quote is actually from page 118, not 84. But, perhaps you have the Kindle edition? I also noticed that the term "rigpa" is used on page 152, by Khenpo Gangshar when he says "This is awareness (rigpa)." Incidentally, that section in Perfect Clarity from Khenpo Gangshar is actually from the book called "Vivid Awareness". Hmm. This is getting interesting.. There is a mystery here. TI

Hi Anamatva I don't think you are butting in. Thanks for pointing that out. I was having a hard time understanding how Samten Gyatso could be such a humble person, yet many people feared him (according to the book "Blazing Splendour"). He did not reveal his inner state, yet he was purportedly one of the most direct and exact masters when it came to teachings. And yes, we here in the West like to talk about attainments and experiences. I like to talk about them because I hope that it will help others with their understanding and help support their desire for realization. TI