Lozen

I think Zen Buddhism is not full of shit. Not sure about the rest of Buddhism. I do think it's amusing that people think they are morally superior by being pacifists while other people die so they can practice their selfish religion. for a guy who makes fun of people doing rituals, saying saddhu three times and bowing at the tv... well if you don't understand the criticism you prolly never will. i have no evidence his way is not the only way. i put it on him to prove that it is.

the karma stuff is full of shit, the "no you! no i!" is full of shit, the pretending his rituals aren't really rituals even though people are bowing at the TV is full of shit, the third grade morality is full of s hit, trying to accumulate merits is full of shit, i could go on and on and on and on and on. oh. and the "this way is the only way" is full of shit too.

See the thing is if you give shit away people don't take it seriously or put any value in it. I used to give herbs away to anybody who would take them, and then i realized I had two problems. 1) people weren't using the s hit i gave them and 2) i was always broke... Anybody who thinks that money is not important has never had to live without it.

I have really mixed feelings about the whole money thing... I think selling a good product is GOOD! You are giving people the opportunity to purchase it. And that's how I look at the stuff I sell and getting right with money--I am offering people the opportunity to get an awesome product that they wouldn't be able to get before. So yeah I think you can be spiritual and have money. Just like you can be broke and not have money. How you treat other people is the important part, the rest is just detail.

Ha ha! I just try not to hang out with people who say things or act in ways that are retarded. I have the same problem with the aikido guys. "I didn't knock him to the ground, I just redirected his energy." Fucking take responsibility for your actions, bell strikers!!

goenka is full of shit

NO NOT VIPASSANA!!! LORD SAVE ME FROM VIPASSANA!!!!!

Don't call me ma'am, I know who my parents are.

http://www.tcbmed.com/Store/details/tribulus_terrestris.htm

Does anybody know what it means when someone says, "Don't call me sir, I know who my parents are."? Is this some military colliqualism I'm missing?

Save the lives of all of the people who would have been killed in a full invasion, because the Japanese were literally ready to die to the person. A friend of mine told me he saw a video where a Japanese soldier literally jumped off of a bridge to avoid being captured by the Americans. Do you think it would have been more compassionate to have had millions more die on each side? And if you are a relativist, why does any of this matter?

Hagar, I don't know you from Adam so I don't know if you are an apologist. I was reacting more to your words and to the sentiment (as spoken by many many other people, most of them Buddhists or Taoists) than to you as an individual. Mirriam Webster's definition of an apologist is "one who speaks or writes in defense of someone or something." I think forgiveness is great, to dissolve rage, which is corrosive and harmful. To let it go and not dwell on it. To set it to rest. However to me this does not mean that I need to surrender, or to meditate upon the virtues of a tyrant (especially when they are "potential" or "unrealized" virtues.) I think forgiveness is something that comes after the act. There is still time to set boundaries, protect one's territory, and I think this can be done in a mindful way. One can be strong and generous, fierce and sensitive, etc. The idea of turning the other cheek has its time and place. But it is not right in EVERY time and place. There is a time to take action. And I would hope that most people would take action against a Hitler or a Bin Laden rather than turn the other cheek or think about that person's inherent Buddha nature. There's a story in the book Women Who Run With the Wolves about a man who had a terrible temper and was sent to the desert by a wise man to give water to every stranger he saw. He did this for years and felt no more rage, until he was encountered by a man on a camel who scoffed at the water, refused it and began to ride away. The man was so filled with rage that he immediately seized the rider from the camel and killed him on the spot. Another rider appeared, praising God that he had killed the man who was on the way to murder the king. At that moment the withered desert trees burst into full bloom. This isn't a story about killing people. It's about understanding everything has its time and place, and that "first thought right thought" in this instance, released the man from the oversimplified rule of "never be angry." Just some food for thought.

Does anybody know any good excercises for strengthening or working with the hara? Or the 2nd chakra... Or the kidney meridian (i think?) or whatever you want to call it?

I think one can forgive without being an apologist.

Basically it boils down to, either you take out the rabid dogs, or you can sit around and pretend you are really really spiritual while watching innocent civilians all around you get taken out. You have a choice. This isn't about Hitler, it's about all of his victims. You might want to try thinking about them instead of about Hitler or Bin Laden's supposed uncovered Buddha nature. And this isn't about you or your spirituality or about what you find "illuminating." Try thinking outside of yourself and your own "spiritual journey" and maybe you will start to see the big picture. Like I tried to explain, the dropping of A bombs in Japan happened when the US was involved in a world war and implemented total war, which means using any means necessary to destroy Japan's ability to wage war. The Germans were bombing london with V2s. There would have been FAR more civilian casualties if Japan was invaded, as Japan was fighting a "jihad" of their own. They were ready to fight to the person. The Emperor had to be shocked into surrender to avoid the terrible cost of a full-scale invasion. We used total war in Germany too, we firebombed Dresden, burned the entire city to the ground. Total war isn't a pretty concept, but like I said it saved perhaps millions of lives. The reason I don't want to get in a philosophical argument about whether Hitler or Bin Laden has Buddha nature is because IT MEANS NOTHING to millions of dead civilians.

Warrior School always taught that ego + power = evil, that if you are using your power to serve your ego, that is evil. It really makes a lot of sense to me when I look at it that way, because I do think that ultimately it is best to serve others and not yourself. Having said that, they also teach (and I agree with this) that you only help people who are helping themselves, that you have to take care of yourself first, etc. And ideally this would be done within a community where everybody is doing it, so it's not just one person trying to take care of everybody else. It just always makes me rack my brain when I meet people who think that not believing in good and evil somehow makes them more spiritual or puts them on a higher plane of existence. I mean really it puts them on the same level as all kinds of tyrants, and really I have a hard time trusting people who think there's no such thing as good or bad. Why would I invite them in my home? They might decide they want to rearrange all the furniture and take off with all my stuff. I mean, there's no good or bad, right? Luckily most people I've met that believe this are either a) too stoned or spaced out to actually do anything about it, rather than sit around and do nothing when a serious situation comes up other than say, "it's cool, man, it's cool" kind of like a kid getting attacked by a dog fawning, "nice doggie! nice doggie!" or only believe it in the most hypothetical/philosophical sense. But really, I wonder how many people who think they are "spiritual" are really just in it for themselves. Are you using the skills you learn to serve yourself or others? Are you letting it flow through you and come out through your hands, words, intent? Or are you trying to hoard it for yourself? Who are you serving? Are you trying to help others, or are you trying to "gain merits" or improve nothing other than your own energy field, ego and sex life? I wonder if this selfishness is why I meet so many "spiritual" people that are complete assholes--like a guy I met who had been doing yoga for 15 years. Total jerk. You;d think that FIFTEEN YEARS of HEART YOGA might make you actually have a more open heart. Only time I saw him being nice to someone was after a Buddhist talk where the speaker said we had to be nice to people we didn't like to accumulate merits and dedicate those merits toward finding our perfect spiritual partner, or some bullshit. Having said that, one of my teachers, who is a very good person, tells me that order is good and extreme good is fascism, that extreme bad is apathy, that really it is necessary to have a balance. So I'm trying to reconcile these beliefs and to find a way my knowledge of good and evil can be explained in TCM...hence the Michael Winn quotes... but also I guess I would argue that things that I consider "evil" (like genocide) are extremely out of balance.

*blush*

Heh heh, too late now. I didn't know anyone had such microscopic medicine balls. I had to get out the really tiny knives. hahaha

I don't believe in Buddha nature and I do believe in an intelligent evil but I've come to realize that trying to discuss this with most Taoists is pretty much futile. The bombing of Japan was actually a very humane thing to do. It saved millions of lives (American and Japanese). The US implemented a concept called "total war" which means that they have to use any means necessary to destroy the opponent's ability to wage war. An invasion would have brought far more Japanese civilian casualties. The Japanese were not going to surrender until the Emperor told them to. I make a distinction between attacking legitimate military targets and targetting civilians. And it really makes little difference to me or the dead civilians if those people wouldn't target civilians if they "knew their Buddha nature." The only place I could see this excercise in futility having a place is maybe in some overpriced Buddhist college classroom requiring folks to bang out a really hideous double spaced essay due three weeks from now.

Thanks for the quotes Sean!!!

There are so many Taoist apologists for Hitler. Let Hitler apologize for himself! I think people are accountable for their actions. I don't think there's really any excuse for genocide, philosophical wrangling aside. At the very least, even the most airy fairy person will admit that genocide is "out of balance."

lol, you crack me up. i guess michael winn wrote MORE than one post on evil! i was looking for another one about evil being the stopping of yin/yang flow in complete yin, or something like that.

I don't remember telling you not to repeat my real name, lol. Where is the post on evil? I want to see it!!

uh, metal and wood and all that, i mean